"Army painter fast and good technique" Topic

Hi all,

I would just like to share with all of you the new way to paint figure I found. Actually I would also like to know if anybody else out there uses something like that.

I must say that I basically don't like inks and I usually paint my figures to a good standard mainly with accurate shading, some rare and limited drybrushing and the odd use of layering and ink every once in a while.

Recently though, I decided to get a Flames of War army painted, but, having already 5 or 6 project going on I didn't want to waste a lot of time on them.
At the same time Army Painter came out, so I thight it was the best time and went for it (them… the army and the army painter).

I managed to paint a whole company of US Paratroops in a weekend to a very good standard (expecially considering it took only two days!).

Before I tell you how I did it I have to say that usually modellers complain about the acrylic colors being too "transparent", or not covering enough, but that is actually a good quality. We tend to forget, as any artist painter can tell you, that is the peculiarity of the acrylics. Thay can be used thick and covering, or diluted and transparent, even like watercoulours. This characteristic can actually be exploited to our advantage when we paint models and figures. That is actually the thing that allows a proper shading technique, but I am not here to talk about it.

So, this is how it goes. I primed all the models with white spray paint (I used GW Skull White), then I painted all the separate areas of the model with the color I wanted , BUT very very diluted, almost as it was a wash. You don't want to have a flat surface like the AP's guide suggest(you might want to use a colour just a tone darker than what you want as an end result though).
The color tends to slide off the raised areas of the model and stop in the recesses, just like an ink, leaving a lighter shade of the colour on the raised areas exposed to the light and a darker tone where the shades should be. And that gives you the highlighting with no effort at all.

At this point the model doesn't look that good though. The shades are too light and the details look mixed up… it is as if the colour just ran off the figure and some bits are painted and some are almost white. But those are the good things.
First you don't have to be too precise at this stage, as long as you are pretty much within the right areas with the paint it is going to be ok. Second, you want to leave some, almost white (of course it will depend on what final colour or effect you want in the end…) raised area.

Then, when the wet paint dries up it is time to go for the Army Painter.
I used the medium tone (I think they call it strong tone) with the 15mm US Para. I tried the strong tome on some German tank and I think it was too dark and I got some miniatures that didn't look neat, but to me it looks like the paint job is dirty… scruffy… I don't know how to say in english, but I wouldn't advise its use if not for very dark tones, maybe blues and greys.

At AP they tell you to litterally dip the figure, but personally I prefer to use the old forgotten buddy, the big brush. It allow more precision, because with the AP you risk you completly cover some areas when you leave it to dry. I think this is the most tricky part of the process, because you want the AP to cover the whole figure and run in the recesses, but it sometimes tend to stick to a place and run off from where you want it if it too much. If it is not enough it won't be able to give you the shade tone strong enough to look like a realistic shade. Also you will waste a lot of it.

Then… you just wait for the miniature to dry, you spray paint it with the anti-shade thing and if you want a brighter look you give it a coat of purity seal (I think it might look good, because sometime the anti shine spray is a bit too matt and makes the colours a bit dull for my tastes).
At this point I added some more details, like the flag and the screaming eagles on the shoulders of the 101st Div. paras, but it was very easy and straightforward, no highlightning at all.

Trick done. The results are impressive expecially if you are in a rush and you are not usually willing to give up the idea of having good painted miniatures in your collection just for the sake of a quick game or an upcoming tournament. It could also be used as a base and then add more layers of classical highlighting

I will post some pictures of some tries I am making with my 28mm GW beastmen (I am building a chaos warriors army but I just hate those disproportionate ugly marauders… and they come from the deep north, why are they naked? I would like to see them like fierce and scary warriors covered in furs and chainmail… but anyway…) so you can see the results on a big mini too.

If, in the meanwhile you want to have a look at my paras in action you can go to fotoalbum.virgilio.it/vezio and click on the Tunisia album. I will post some close up pictures too.

In the meanwhile I dare you to try it and let me know. My friends are already using it and one of them in a couple of weeks found the time to revive two old 3000 points WH armies… I haven't had a chance to see them yet, but he is very happy. So, give it a try and let me know.

Ciao, vezio

P.S.: forgive my english as usual ;)

Here are some threads talking about using Army Painter, Minwax Polyurathane Stain, and Future Magic Wash. All the same techniques, just using different substances.

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JJ and Delthos thank you for the compliments and the links.

I think what I am suggesting is different from most of those previous posts. They all concentrate on the Dip, the formula of the wax, the maker of shader etc, I am talking about what is beneath it. The way to paint the miniature to get the most out of the AP with little effort… not only shades, but highlights and midtones all at once.
Don't you think?

I'll post some pictures, maybe tomorrow.

Ciao

Yup I see where you coming from on this, sme 6mm painters use the same technique, diluted wash of the base colour then an oil based wash over the top to bring out the colours…When I get some more AP I will give it a go

Supposedly, when Zardoz was released in Baltimore, the heat was just stifling.

Nope, that wasn't me.

I'm not not going to spend ten minutes re-typing it, either. I'll just say:

- There is nothing new under the sun.

- I don't feel compelled to use hyped brand names.

Good technique, though. Now just do it with reasonably-priced products!

Allen

One other quick question…Are you usingthe well diluted paint on the flesh, weapons, webbing etc?

I agree with Allen. I can't fathom why anyone who has been informed about their options would spend the money on Army Painter. Heck, although I am no fan of Minwax it is way cheaper and achieves the same result.

It's Future for me.

Thanks,

John

Have used it too on some GW figs; in combination with the 'dull cote' they make, it inks well and protects nicely – thanks for the tip about dilution. Will try it with my next batch of historicals. As an aside their spray primers (yes also expensive)have been exceptional.

[Yes, more expensive, yes cheaper alternatives, but no not uninformed about my options – I suppose I have more money than sense when it comes to searching out the right shade of a certain furniture stain sold only at a select few stores across town and rarely in stock than going to my local hobby store 0.5 miles away and supporting them and getting a good product that gives good results every time without worrying about paint and dull cote compatibility etc. I could eat bread,cheese, onion, water and wine every day and get close to my full nutritional requirements too. Just some days I might like something different – so I occasionally spend money like a drunken sailor on a hobby item – tell me all your purchases are rational or life-sustaining only. Cheap is a relative term when talking about this and any other hobby. We could scratchbuild every building we have on the table out of various inexpensive household items (some people do) or we could be wastrals and scoundrels and buy say a Norman Church made and prepainted from 'MBA', are those folks to be lambasted too? How about we make our own paint brushes from twigs and pet hair? Much cheaper. If the poster can write so well in English, I doubt research into hobby trends and techniques is an issue – especially seeing some of the great models and paintings coming from Italian hobbyists, magazines and manufacturers recently. The title of the post was pretty specific to technique with Army Painter not necessarily asking us the best way to protect or ink figures. I'm not against being informed of better or less expensive options but dismissing ideas simply on the basis of cost or because it's not the way you do it might be construed as condescending or supercilious. I can just see at a convention, you're in a game hosted by someone else, you ask about the painting of their figures, find out they use ArmyPainter do you:
a. refuse to game using needlessly overpriced figures
b. launch into a lecture on the benefits of alternate inking and gloss coating techniques.
c. possibly think the person wasted money, but keep your opinion to yourself and enjoy the game.

Hopefully your answer is c.
Sorry, this post sounded more bitchy than it should have, just appreciate the report the poster gave and did not wish it to be given such short shrift because of the product he used].

Well, I used those products because they are easy to get here in italy and probably, like somebody else, have more money then sense. I think though that using brands or not is a matter of tastes and principles, and sometimes urgency or availability are issues, so, if you find something cheaper that works like the expensive products good for you and please let me know.

I just wanted to suggest a little variant in the way you can use some kind of products and get a great result.

I am not connected either to army painter or GW.

I would suggest to try the technique on one or two minis before you start a whole batch.

The only bits I didn't use the diluted paint were the metal areas and some of the darker areas on the 28mm beastmen.

Ciao, Vezio

This sounds like the "stain painting" technique Duke Siegfried was promoting in the late 70s. It works very well for 25mm figures with folds in their clothing but I had not considered using it on 15mm figures. Thank you.

I just uploaded some close ups of the miniatures I was talking about. fotoalbum.virgilio.it/vezio

from 2986 to 2988 is the miniature painted with diluted acrylic paints.

From 2989 to 2995 is the same miniature just "dipped" (I burshed it, but it is the same)

The pictures up to 3003 are the miniature sprayed with the anti shine varnish.

Then there are a couple of miniatures I painted starting with a brown primer (still from AP… they are very good products to me… don't know about the price quality thing… you work that out for yourself, it is not important here) and a blcke primer. Those are for you to compare and I wanted to know how long it takes to use each different techniques (those are not my best minis though ;)).

Then there are some 15mm battlefront WW2 US paras to show you.

If you click on "formati disponibili" then on "formato originale", you can get the larger picture and you can see more details, although live look better then in photo…

Let me know what you think.

Ciao

Hey there… I knew my english is not that good… everytime I said shading I meant "blending"… sorry… must be the old age catching up…

:)

Hi, if you live in an area or Country where alternatives are unavailable it's completely understandable why Army Painter makes sense.

However, I stand by my comments about Minwax and Future. Saying that it's just a choice and sometimes spending money to support a local store is good, etc. really doesn't make a lot of sense. Would anyone buy Vallejo paints in a smaller bottle at 3X the price just to support a store? Or would you buy figures from a local store who repackaged a 6 pack of figs into 3 and tripled the price? It would be a bit silly wouldn't it?

I am more than happy to explain (as are a number of folks here) how to obtain the same or better results with Future at a tiny fraction of the price. It also won't dry up, smell, eat your brushes, take as long to dry, can be used with any number of shades and colors. That is what I would call helpful advice. Once upon a time someone provided it for me when I was using Minwax. I would NEVER go back. I'm trying to do the same here. Don't want the help or to switch? Cool. no problem. But please, let's not try and rationalize that Army painter is just another viable choice for folks.It's the same product as Minwax. Just WAY more expensive.

YMMV.

Thanks,

John

can we stay on topic, please? I don't care if AP is expensive or not!

I think the paratroopers look really good…

Topic deviation is a long honored tradition around here.
:-D

Thanks,

John

No prob John :D
Thank you Steve ;)

Those Paras look really good – well done. I wasn't sure how well AP would work on 15mm figures becuase of the smaller details but they're fantastic.

I actually tried it on big models with flat sufrfaces and I don't think it works as well as with very detailed surfaces… I revived some of my old… ancient, actually, GW and Marauder Dwarves… they don't look that bad at all. I had them painted on a white base and the overall effect was that there was no contrast at all, even if they were highlited with blending tachnique. Now the details stand out.

i've used it diluted on 10mm with some success