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"WATER WARS: Get Your Figures Ready!!!" Topic


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Cacique Caribe21 Jul 2009 10:03 p.m. PST

This is a cool gaming scenario for modern and near-future figures:

link
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link

What do you guys think?

CC
PS. Remember, we are talking gaming scenario, not politics.

Eli Arndt21 Jul 2009 10:09 p.m. PST

Only you can go from discussing a world flooded to a world without water!

-Eli

John Leahy21 Jul 2009 10:12 p.m. PST

Like any precious resource I see no reason why Water wars would be crazy. I buy it.

Thanks,

John

Cacique Caribe21 Jul 2009 10:14 p.m. PST

Think water-plundering armies and desert pirates!!!

link
link

If we are talking 15mm, and 50 years into the future, I'd go with Rebel Minis "hardtops" and Sahadeen:

link
link
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For 28mm, I guess it would be something like the GW Tallarn:

picture

CC
Opposite scenario: TMP link

Cacique Caribe21 Jul 2009 10:38 p.m. PST

But if we are talking contemporary then, aside from modern troops, you'd need figures like these desert-hardy fighters:

link
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link

They would raid government-run desalination plants and convoys.

You could make plants like these, and fortify them:

picture
picture
picture

And armies would make it standard to carry drilling equipment in their invading forces.

picture
army-uk.com/equip.php?ID=388
link

CC

Personal logo Dances With Words Supporting Member of TMP Fezian22 Jul 2009 1:01 a.m. PST

erm….

If you combine 'Serenity' with THOSE…you get….

'ICE PIRATES!'…..beware the Space Herpes!!!!!!
bwah-hah-ha!!!!

Sgt DWW

Turbo Pig Fezian22 Jul 2009 3:47 a.m. PST

Throw in some mutant Kangos, and a tricked out tank, replete with punk grrrrl (Caution Trespassers Will Be Slapped), and you could probably come up with a successful comic book franchise.

Steve Johnson22 Jul 2009 4:15 a.m. PST

It may be closer than we think. Yesterday, the city of Atlanta was given three years to stop taking its city water supply from Lake Lanier. The governor is going to fight it, but just where can Atlanta go to get water?

Cacique Caribe22 Jul 2009 5:36 a.m. PST

See. It has begun. Atlanta is going to raid Florida for its water!!!

Those would be interesting gaming scenarios. The Georgia National Guard making a secret raid into Florida to steal water. Imagine the long line of empty water trucks going in.

CC

richarDISNEY22 Jul 2009 6:24 a.m. PST

To heck with it… We should all be drinking beer.

Oh, wait a min… Lets think this through… humm… huh?

beer

ComradeCommissar22 Jul 2009 6:52 a.m. PST

Puts a whole new spin on some post apocalyptic favorites:
"Oi! Max, we're thirsty!"

picture

Eli Arndt22 Jul 2009 7:37 a.m. PST

Time to build a Berlin-style wall around my state…

-Eli

Mil Dot22 Jul 2009 7:55 a.m. PST

I have the deepest well most likely in the whole county or better according to the clerks office paid way more to do it but it looks like it's going to pay off, now I have a chance for everyone to bow down and on their knees and address me as "Your Lordship" bwah-hah-ha-ha-haaaa!!! (evil laugh evil laugh)

Mlatch22122 Jul 2009 8:05 a.m. PST

I came up with a slightly different scenario for my game world background. I imagine that the "big bully" government uses water against neighboring regions that need it by building dams, destroying other dams, reservoirs and aqueduct systems and otherwise attempting to shut off or divert water supplies. The battles could range from small skirmishes over infrastructure (pumping stations, aqueducts, small dams, power stations) to massive land air and naval battles to protect, destroy, capture/recapture lakes, rivers, wells, large dams and such.

Even in areas where water isn't a scare resource, it could still be a point of contention. Raids to destroy flood control structures could devastate a city or region and shutting off or diverting rivers that provide transportation corridors and sea access could wreak havoc on a region or country's economy and ecology.

wminsing22 Jul 2009 8:44 a.m. PST

Water scarcity leads to hydraulic empires, and we all know what hydraulic empires lead to- pyramids, harems and eunuchs!

-Will

Personal logo x42brown Supporting Member of TMP22 Jul 2009 9:12 a.m. PST

Some of the battle grounds may be a little closer to home than some of you imagine.

msnbc.msn.com/id/21494919
alternet.org/water/82378
waterinfo.org/node/3337

And so rednecks, pickup trucks and State Troopers may be the appropriate figures to game the water wars.

x42

Top Gun Ace22 Jul 2009 11:05 a.m. PST

Sounds plausible, since you can't live long without water.

If wealthy, water-rich neighbors are not willing to share for a reasonable price, then that may exacerbate the situation.

There were a number of conflicts out in the wild west over water, back in the 1800s', if I recall correctly, and the LA region drained a number of basins, including Mono Lake, if I recall correctly. Water is also being shipped from Northern California to parched Southern Cal.

Regions that get their water from the Colorado River are also under pressure.

Some people have even advocated towing icebergs to various cities in North America to satisfy local demands that doesn't seem to be very practical, but apparently could work. Given the shrinking icepack though, that may be less of an option. No doubt, other nations, or pirates may try to steal, and/or interfere with these deliveries.

Unless recycling can be improved, and/or desalization on a large scale made more efficient and less costly, the issue will only get worse.

Beware Canada.

Mil Dot22 Jul 2009 10:09 p.m. PST

Just tonight there was a story on the news about a man in New Jersey who the city is MAKING put a meter on his well. And pay for his own water…He does own the mineral rights too…hummm something fishy here!!!

Dropship Horizon22 Jul 2009 10:14 p.m. PST

Hi

I've updated my Dropship Horizon blog with a preview of Khurasan Miniatures new Karkarine Marines – 15mm Sci Fi 'Sharkmen;. Perfect for this type of scenario: link

Cheers
Mark

Top Gun Ace23 Jul 2009 2:19 p.m. PST

"Just tonight there was a story on the news about a man in New Jersey who the city is MAKING put a meter on his well. And pay for his own water…He does own the mineral rights too…hummm something fishy here"!!!

That's absurd, but doesn't surprise me. Governments are always over-reaching.

I'd take that fight to the Supreme Court.

Top Gun Ace23 Jul 2009 2:22 p.m. PST

Ah, Sharkmen – sounds terrific, although I would probably prefer clawed feet, no trousers, and a fishnet type covering, only if absolutely necessary.

Looking forward to seeing them.

Mil Dot23 Jul 2009 2:46 p.m. PST

To TAC

I was surprise myself and I hope he takes it to court too, hope to hear more about it in the mean time south Texas is in such a drought that cattle men are selling off their herds so fiction could be reality

SpleenRippa23 Jul 2009 4:24 p.m. PST

Jack Aubrey on the hovership Surprise, ranging across the desert in search of water pirates and enemies of the state :-p

Dropzonetoe Fezian24 Jul 2009 3:48 a.m. PST

I recently started watching an Anime called Desert Punk. Really kind of a mmmhh type show but it does have a post-apoc desert japan. Well worth the watch for terrain and ideas.

Cacique Caribe24 Jul 2009 6:05 a.m. PST

This?

YouTube link
YouTube link
YouTube link
link

Hmmm. Interesting anatomy, i mean, terrain.

CC

Cacique Caribe24 Jul 2009 11:38 a.m. PST

Guys,

I think you'll like this:

picture

CC

Dropship Horizon24 Jul 2009 11:40 a.m. PST

You're right!

Mark

Brutorz Bill24 Jul 2009 11:47 a.m. PST

Very Cool!

Dropzonetoe Fezian25 Jul 2009 8:23 a.m. PST

CC,

LOL, if you can get past the corny dialog and the perponderence for the female form it does has a lot of intersting ideas, locations, terrain and combat in the desert.

Cacique Caribe25 Jul 2009 8:42 a.m. PST

Dropzonetoe,

Personally, I love it. I think I can grow to like the series.

It's just that it's so different from the cartoons I grew up with . . . not that I mind that, of course.

CC

Dropzonetoe Fezian25 Jul 2009 10:48 p.m. PST

I had never heard of it until like a few days before I mentioned it here in my first post. It was in a dusty back corner of the stand. It was a shame it's only 24 episodes – well in the series I saw. I need to track down some of the Manga's and see if they go further.

pigbear27 Jul 2009 1:58 a.m. PST

It's an instant play on Netflix so I'll definitely check it out. But what's with that female character? Is that what it takes to get people to look at this anime? I feel a bit skeptical already.

Cacique Caribe27 Jul 2009 5:45 a.m. PST

Despite that distracting character (apparently she is not in every episode), I do like the PA terrain concepts I can use, and the realistically desperate conditions of the survivors.

Very interesting.

CC

Dropzonetoe Fezian29 Jul 2009 2:17 a.m. PST

pigbear,

It is a bit of an overriding theme for the main character, his obsession with breasts. Like I said before it is pretty juvenille but the rest of it is full of great ideas.

CC
I am in love with the sand covered high rises. I really like the look of them.

Cacique Caribe23 Sep 2009 5:37 a.m. PST

More Water War scenarios:

link
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link

CC

28mmMan23 Sep 2009 6:14 a.m. PST

"It is a bit of an overriding theme for the main character, his obsession with breasts. Like I said before it is pretty juvenille but the rest of it is full of great ideas."

Actually I think it is an obsession for the bulk of Japanese pop culture…more of a nod towards the ren classics with the heavy women, having a plump woman was the sign of wealth and social position. I am thinking the exagerated female form has developed from comic book/manga geeks who like all comic book geeks the world round like exagerated human form be it male or female. At one point I think it is an inside joke that everyone takes for granted…if you have a group of characters in a manga it will have in one way or another the clever little guy/girl, the big goofy guy, the large breasted serious woman/girl, the good looking guy, the meek yet strong girl, and the old man/woman…insert others and swap them around but that seems to follow suit.

I think it has come to be expected at this point…like talking animals and everyones grandma looks exactally the same.

No harm no foul…I am a true blue comic book geek raised on ink for mothers milk…I expect the big boobs!

Yay big boobs!

…and woohoo for desert post apoc setting… :)

Whatisitgood4atwork23 Sep 2009 7:17 p.m. PST

They make good scenarios, but I am an optimist on the 'water wars' front.

I live in a place with few water resources and that still relies on a not-entirely chummy neighbour for its water supply.

But consequently they treat water as a strategic consideration. Singapore recycles as close as humanly possible to 100% of its waste water including sewerage, has dammed or is damming every single waterway before it reaches the sea, and has the world's most advanced large desalination plant.

It is now exporting water technology to the Middle East.

There is no shortage of salt water, and while desalination is expensive, it is much cheaper than war. And if you don't have water, there is no such thing as 'too expensive'. As more states and businesses take water management more seriously, I expect to see better and more affordable technological solutions appear over the next few decades.

Wellspring24 Sep 2009 5:08 a.m. PST

I think the more realistic scenario for water wars would be one of two things.

1) pollution leading to a lack of *potable* water. So the planet could conceivably be very wet, but mostly polluted. In a post-apocalyptic or 3rd world setting, filtration would be expensive and unreliable.

2) Depletion of the aquifer under the continental US. That linked graphic notwithstanding, the aquifer under the US is actually about 66% due to the needs of agriculture, and falling. But even then, the lack of drinking water wouldn't be important because long before then you'd have a lack of water for agriculture causing a famine.

Water wars would not have stolen water being trucked back to Atlanta. People consume water far too fast for that to be feasible. Instead, you'd have wars of conquest and mass migration to the remaining water sources. So you still have fun post-apocalyptic scenarios to play, but they'd play out differently.

Lion in the Stars24 Sep 2009 10:18 a.m. PST

1) pollution leading to a lack of *potable* water. So the planet could conceivably be very wet, but mostly polluted. In a post-apocalyptic or 3rd world setting, filtration would be expensive and unreliable.

That's a serious problem *now*, just look at the Colorado River where it reaches the Gulf of Mexico. If Mexico actually had enough $$ to do something about it, we might actually be seeing a Water War.

I live out West, "where the whiskey is for drinking and Water is for fighting over."

Lampyridae25 Sep 2009 3:57 p.m. PST

They make good scenarios, but I am an optimist on the 'water wars' front.

I live in a place with few water resources and that still relies on a not-entirely chummy neighbour for its water supply.

But consequently they treat water as a strategic consideration. Singapore recycles as close as humanly possible to 100% of its waste water including sewerage, has dammed or is damming every single waterway before it reaches the sea, and has the world's most advanced large desalination plant.

It is now exporting water technology to the Middle East.

Sheesh, optimists taking away our fun! But there's a reason (actually several) why everybody's not singing kumbaya…

1. The 100% recycling is mythaganda. Did they tell you that on the recycling plant tour? It's not true. Singapore only recycles 15%.
1. Singapore does not grow its own food. Agriculture is the primary consumer of water, along with industry. How do you recycle water lost to evapouration and transpiration?
2. Singapore is drenched in rain. Only 40% comes from Malaysia.
3. Recycling water to potable levels is EXPENSIVE. Not every country in the world can afford this.
4. Using desalinized water for irrigation eventually destroys the soil through salt deposition. link
5. Desalinating water requires significant amounts of electricity, meaning new power plants, more coal and more global warming!!

So, folks, water wars are a sure thing!

Top Gun Ace26 Sep 2009 3:09 a.m. PST

They've turned off most of the water to some farmers in Central California, where unemployment in a number of counties is over 40% (42.5%, if I recall correctly, in one county).

Since the region is the bread-basket for the country, food prices on some vegetables and fruits are expected to rise, and more will be imported from outside the USA.

Apparently, there is water available, despite the drought, but it has been turned off to protect a small fish, which is an endangered species, and a source of food for salmon.

Not sure when/if the region's farmers and workers will be placed on the endangered species list.

Cacique Caribe11 May 2010 12:30 a.m. PST

I guess that this struggle for war could spark a Second Civil War in the US:

TMP link

Dan

War Monkey17 May 2010 9:45 p.m. PST

Could be closer to some then others
link
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Mead
If the Hoover Dam were to be shut down, about 30 million people in the Southwest would be out of water, says Mike Eaker, manager of communications for the Bureau of Reclamation, which designed and supervises the dam

Doug
P.S. Less then 75 feet and it's game over for most of the southwest.

War Monkey17 May 2010 10:17 p.m. PST

War could come from over the seas too!
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So bring on the modern Chinese figs and equipment.

Doug

Cacique Caribe18 May 2010 9:17 a.m. PST

I can definitely envision the countries with large desalination plants charging exorbitant amounts for their precious liquid, followed by terrorist attacks on those plants.

Dan

Lion in the Stars18 May 2010 9:36 a.m. PST

But not terrorist attacks in the classical sense. The Tangos would be after any man-portable components to the desal system, not it's explosive destruction.

If your system is small enough (a pair of 4000 gal/day reverse-osmosis units fit in a 20-foot cargo container), they might even just swipe the entire system!

There are also some interesting ways to reduce potable-water consumption, not the least of which is using non-potable water for sewage. Ships use that all the time (saltwater toilets, I mean).

War Monkey18 May 2010 8:42 p.m. PST

If we pull water out of the ground as we do oil we are setting up for the chance of a sinkhole situation, great huge big ones, and towns and cities to just sink away into the ground.
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interesting gaming terrain,

Doug

Cacique Caribe18 May 2010 9:35 p.m. PST

Doug,

If the reason behind this project was water conservation, then I can see this becoming the wave of the future . . . semi-subterranean farming:

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undergroundgardens.com
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Weren't some of the buildings on Tatooine subterranean, with open areas that looked like man-made "sinkholes"?

Dan

War Monkey19 May 2010 8:22 p.m. PST

Ok those are perty cool pictures, which leads to some ideas.
Yeah some of the buildings were underground, like Luke's Aunt and Uncle's place was underground.
I wwas thinking more on the line of this but on a large scale.
picture
scroll down just a hair, using the U.S. map in the middle showing areas that is likely to have sinkholes and caves.
link


Doug

War Monkey19 May 2010 8:41 p.m. PST

Picturing something like this!
picture

Doug

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