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"Battle of the Bulge 1944 - 1945." Topic


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World War Two on the Land

774 hits since 14 Jan 2019
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
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Paskal Supporting Member of TMP14 Jan 2019 12:02 a.m. PST

Hello everyone ,

I would like to find a book where we find the full battle order of all the belligerents who participated in the battle of Battle of the Bulge of 1944-1945, from the first to the last day.

It is specifically the full battle orders of all the belligerents that interest me with the organizations and the manpower and the quantity of armaments of each great unit.

Any ideas ?

Keith Talent14 Jan 2019 1:10 a.m. PST

Good luck. I don't think you'll find a definitive answer in a single book. However, a good (and inexpensive) place to start is Danny Parker's "Battle of the Bulge, Hitler's Ardennes offensive" it does have a full OB for for both sides,with Armour strengths and types plus a list of what date units were committed

Carlos Von B14 Jan 2019 1:36 a.m. PST

For Orbats it is difficult to beat Hitler's Last Gamble: The Battle of the Bulge, December 1944-January 1945 by Trevor Nevitt Dupuy.

repaint14 Jan 2019 2:38 a.m. PST

one additional approach is to purchase a wargame such as 'Ardennes 44' where the author has done extensive research and have assessed for you the effectiveness of each unit represented.

Richard Baber14 Jan 2019 3:14 a.m. PST

jean Pallud – Battle of the Bulge Then and Now would be my first call.

The old (and harder to find) Osprey Order of battle series on the Bulge was pretty good too

deephorse14 Jan 2019 8:53 a.m. PST

Coming to it late it took me a little while to collect those six Osprey volumes.

The three volumes of ‘Duel in the Mist' breaks down KG Peiper, and sometimes its opponents, right down to individual AFVs and names the crews, but I doubt you'll find that for many other, indeed any other, unit.

Keith Talent14 Jan 2019 10:40 a.m. PST

"jean Pallud – Battle of the Bulge Then and Now would be my first call."
To be honest would have been my first choice too, I put up Parker's book because it is a cheaper alternative and furnishes good OB info.
HOWEVER….I've just seen that the Pallud book can be obtained for less than 30 quid….which is an absolute steal for an outstanding book

Richard Baber14 Jan 2019 11:39 a.m. PST

Yep, bought my copy for £60.00 GBP? Own Parker`s book too, not as good but OK.

Paskal did ask for the best choice :)

Personally I`d always start with Google, until I run out of ideas and turn to TMP or any other forum :)

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP14 Jan 2019 12:09 p.m. PST

I would like to buy only one …

What is the 'Ardennes 44' wargame?

Herce Salon de Guerre14 Jan 2019 1:41 p.m. PST

Jean-Paul Pallud – Battle of the Bulge Then and Now

Richard Baber14 Jan 2019 2:09 p.m. PST

To be honest Paskal – you need more than one resource anyway, never take one as being 100% correct you need you to read and re-read several books and loads of lists to get a better overall view of things.

Richard Baber14 Jan 2019 2:11 p.m. PST

As an example i have 9 books on the Spanish Blue Division alone plus another 20 or so articles.

Each gives more info or adds to what i knew, subtle variations in the organisations, manpower, weapons, etc

Sometimes you just have to put in the time and leg work.

Lee49414 Jan 2019 3:31 p.m. PST

Paskal you're asking a lot! Everything in one book lol. But miracles do exist and Dupuy's book mentioned earlier in this thread is the premier "one book" source especially for detailed OBs. Good luck!

repaint14 Jan 2019 8:19 p.m. PST

link

You will have a lot of the OOB you are looking for in this game (and can also play the game, however it might be leaning toward the complex set of rules)

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP14 Jan 2019 10:22 p.m. PST

What I need is an order of battle or not a single big unit is missing because I would like to have an overview …

This campaign and that of the Tunisia in 1943, are really the only ones that interest me in the WWII,also I'm looking for an overview for both not a tactical or sub-tactical game.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP15 Jan 2019 10:26 p.m. PST

@ Richard Baber, Lee494, repaint, Herce Salon de Guerre, Keith Talent, deephorse and Carlos Von B :

So if I understand correctly for this kind of documentation, you save time and money to buy a board game It's amazing all the same!

The creators of these games have had the same desires as me, have an overview of the campaign…

Fred Cartwright16 Jan 2019 12:05 a.m. PST

So if I understand correctly for this kind of documentation, you save time and money to buy a board game It's amazing all the same!

Yes that what they are saying, but it is not really amazing. With books and games you are benefitting from the authors research and many game authors conduct rigorous research to get their games right. The advantage of the game over a book is it is gives you the information you want in a format ready to game with. Unlike hunting through a book for the info you need.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP17 Jan 2019 9:16 a.m. PST

Yeah I think that's the simplest solution, especially that they give their sources? But we must be careful, there are necessarily more or less good … Need to know which? how? We can not buy them all …

Murvihill19 Jan 2019 7:11 p.m. PST

I got my Bulge OB from Nafziger. Looked pretty comprehensive to me.

Paskal Supporting Member of TMP20 Jan 2019 12:05 a.m. PST

For an overview, a board game can be interesting because the authors do a lot of research and give their sources.

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