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"WSS rules (again)" Topic

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Mute Bystander Inactive Member21 Jul 2016 6:47 a.m. PST

I thought there was a thread on rules for the WSS but searches only showed miniatures related threads.

What rules work best for War of Spanish Succession gaming?

Battles, not skirmish.

EDIT: Found a 2012 thread and then older threads, so will not request Bill delete this thread in case something new is mentioned.

Oh Bugger Inactive Member21 Jul 2016 6:51 a.m. PST

Piquet Field of Battle is very good if you like card driven games.

John Watts21 Jul 2016 7:09 a.m. PST

I used to play Ga Pa, but ran out of opponents. Now I've moved to the brigade level and play Age of Honor – excellent system. We've played Blenheim (first and second), Ramillies and a number of fictional battles.We shall play Oudenarde this autumn, provided we get sufficient Dutch recruits.

VVV reply21 Jul 2016 7:19 a.m. PST

Just released Best Allies. Units are battalions of infantry, regiments of cavalry. Units are grouped into brigades, with brigades grouped into divisions. Army lists for Gt Northern war through to French Revolutionary rules. Available on Wargames Vault as a pdf.

WFGamers21 Jul 2016 7:20 a.m. PST

We use the Twilight of the Sun king rules from the Pike and Shot society and have been play testing the new edition of these. They work well for big battles. The new edition and scenario booklets will be available soon I think.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 7:36 a.m. PST

I'm sure if I answered in the old thread. I answered benith the lily banners 2. And that's what I'll still answer.

redmist112221 Jul 2016 7:48 a.m. PST

Another plug for Beneath the Lily Banners v2!



Skeets Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 8:09 a.m. PST

We have been using Blenheim 2004 for quite a while now and have been pleased with them: warflag.blenheim2004/.

Shagnasty Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 8:48 a.m. PST

A third vote for Beneath the Lily Banners.

mbsparta Inactive Member21 Jul 2016 10:20 a.m. PST


Personal logo Bashytubits Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 11:04 a.m. PST

Maurice and Beneath the Lily Banners.

Reactionary Inactive Member21 Jul 2016 12:13 p.m. PST

Yet another Beneath the Lily Banners

dbf167621 Jul 2016 12:25 p.m. PST

BLB2, to be precise.

Sharpe5221 Jul 2016 12:36 p.m. PST

Ditto:-) Beneath the Lily Banners V2 is really enjoyable

Personal logo herkybird Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 12:44 p.m. PST

BTLB 2 for us too!

stecal21 Jul 2016 1:06 p.m. PST

I use the BLB basing, but the rules….Meh. I stick to Black Powder

steamingdave4721 Jul 2016 2:57 p.m. PST

Our little group have had a number of very enjoyable 10mm games with Twilight of the SunKing, but the rules could be ysed wuth any scale of figures.
The rules are suitable for the period from about 1680 to 1720, so cover the WSS. We have played Blenheim a couple of times and Ramillies. The game uses bases; we tend to use 60mm x 30 mm with two representing a brigade of 2000 infantry or 1000 cavalry, but the rules would work equally well with bases representing battalions or squadrons. As there is no calculation of firing or melee (everything is based on a morale test which tskes account of the units situation- is it under fire? Is it bring attacked by more than one unit? Are its flanks secure? Is it supported? etc) games flow very quickly, correct tactics are rewarded but there is always that imponderabke element of luck. Recent games have included Aughrim and Neerwinden- a little earlier than WSS but very interesting battles and very enjoyable.

lloydthegamer Supporting Member of TMP21 Jul 2016 3:05 p.m. PST

Ga Pa and Maurice are very good systems. Quite different games, but fun comes in different packages. I'd like to try Beneath the Lily Banners.

daler240D Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member22 Jul 2016 4:17 a.m. PST

I highly recommend Twilight of the Sun King also.

Khusrau Inactive Member23 Jul 2016 1:01 p.m. PST

Played using WRG 'Horse Foot and Guns' worked very well for large scale battles with 6mm figures on 60mm x 30mm bases.

Old Grunt23 Jul 2016 5:50 p.m. PST

Beneath the Lily Banners 2nd edition and/or Maurice. I like both a lot.

GenWinter24 Jul 2016 8:23 a.m. PST

Maurice is very good. In my experience, it is strictly a two player game but lots of characterization through the use of cards.

cae5ar29 Jul 2016 4:42 a.m. PST

I like Maurice too. It builds a great narrative and is still one of my favourite all-time games, if not THE favourite. The clever turn sequence just seems to capture linear horse and musket warfare brilliantly and places great importance on manoeuvre against conflicting priorities. Unfairly criticised by dice devotees for its innovative use of action cards to command your troops, any gamer should actually play it first before passing judgement.

Twilight of the Sun King is a neat little game, but you'll need to improvise as situations arise, as it's rather bare bones (or at least the copy I have is, at 6 pages in total). Fast game, quite abstract, suited to large battles.

I haven't played Beneath the Lily Banners in any edition but I must set aside time to do so, because it seems to get good press for a period which I enjoy very much.

Recovered 1AO Inactive Member03 Jan 2017 7:46 a.m. PST

BLB2 sounds like something to try while I am waiting for OPM to decide to pay me the full amount I may buy the PDF and if they are as advertised then I can buy the hard copy version.

TotSK sounds okay but the rules tinkers in the group will spot any holes on first reading and be itching for house rules even before playing.

Recovered 1AO Inactive Member03 Jan 2017 7:51 a.m. PST


Funny I found the one game of Black Powder played at a con very unsatisfying.

It was AZW and I had some real issues with several game processes. I have tried it again.

daler240D Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member03 Jan 2017 7:57 a.m. PST

FYI, TotSK has a new version out and it is quite good. I do not see any holes per se.
TMP link

Recovered 1AO Inactive Member03 Jan 2017 10:41 a.m. PST


Thanks for the information!

RogerC03 Jan 2017 11:12 a.m. PST

I will be trying Black Powder first for Great Northern war mainly due its flexibility to represent the very different tactics and national charateristics. Let you know how I get on.

dantheman Supporting Member of TMP04 Jan 2017 3:10 p.m. PST

Surprised no one mentioned Might and Reason, cousin of Maurice. There is a module called Sun King for WSS. I play Might and Reason and it is a favorite in my area. It is designed to fight the large historical battles of the period.

There s also Age of Honor which is the official Fire and Fury variant of the period. I like it and would recommend it for anyone that likes Fire and Fury mechanics properly refined for the period.

Personal logo Il Granatiere Supporting Member of TMP04 Jan 2017 3:26 p.m. PST

Beneath the Lily Banners 2nd edition.

Oudinot Inactive Member09 Jan 2017 1:08 p.m. PST

Has anyone used BLB2 with 6mm?

VicCina Supporting Member of TMP21 Feb 2017 8:59 p.m. PST

The Pike and Shotte society that sells "Twilight of the Sun King" are they reliable?

I sent them an order for the rules and an email just to follow up and haven't heard from them

WFGamers22 Feb 2017 3:30 a.m. PST

VicCina: The society are very reliable but have had some supply problems. I understand that all outstanding orders were sent out last week from the UK. So hopefully they will be with you soon, depending on how quick the postal services are.

Hopefully the problems are now resolved but if you, or anyone else, continue to have problems please contact –

JoJo the Idiot Circus Boy22 Feb 2017 8:48 a.m. PST

I was about to make a new thread to ask about just this subject. So I'll pop into this one rather than make a new one.

So the wife ordered two of the new starter boxes of the ex-Wargames Factory WSS figures to give to me a birthday gift. (The receipt email got sent to my email account in error, so I found out a month early…) So I see the start of a French and an Anglo-Dutch force in my future! After my recent research for my club's Great Northern War games, I'm pretty fired up about the period. So my question is what rules sets would be out there that suit my needs?

So the game I have in mind is 28mm with infantry battalions, cavalry regiments, and artillery batteries being the maneuver units. I'll be using the BLB basing and more or less their unit organization. I'm looking for a rule set with a good deal of "crunch" and period flavor. Finally, I'd like a rules set that handles a game with about 12-15 maneuver elements per side well.

With those parameters, what are my options?

The obvious choice is the WRG 1685-1845 set. But I might have trouble getting anyone to play with me using those. I fully admit my affection for them is at least partly "nostalgia goggles". (Hey, I still Like WRG 7th for ancients after all!)

My local group has taken to using Ga Pa for our 15mm games. But I'm not certain that a smaller game like I'm envisioning will play well using that set.

So what say you all?

Henry Martini22 Feb 2017 4:57 p.m. PST


General Kirchner24 Feb 2017 8:02 p.m. PST

Just starting myself in this period and I would be curious about pluses and minuses of some of the rules

I play pike and shotte and actually played a game late 1600's with the rules and liked it

I also have blb

DGT123 Inactive Member06 Mar 2017 11:24 a.m. PST

I like Beneath the Lily Banners, Pike & Shotte & Carnage and Glory II (Computer moderated rules).

cturnitsa Supporting Member of TMP27 Mar 2017 12:11 p.m. PST

Beneath the Lily Banners is an excellent set.

Also, have you checked out Lace Wars by Stephen Danes?


cae5ar06 Apr 2017 7:24 p.m. PST

FYI, TotSK has a new version out and it is quite good. I do not see any holes per se.

Twilight of the Sun King has innovative game mechanics, no doubt about it. I like how streamlined play can be, with shooting, melee and morale all rolled together, an ideal concept for fast play big battles. But "no holes"??? I don't consider it a complete set of rules, more a toolkit of neat ideas (yes, even the latest edition). Check out this review:

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