"Jungle LOST CITY Terrain Boards: Need Inspiration!!!" Topic

Though I don't plan to do the Asian theme, this is very similar to the layout I would love to build (wall, entrance, several buildings spread out, etc.):

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Are there any other examples of city ruins in a jungle setting?

I would really appreciate more examples, if they are out there.

Thanks.

CC

Hmm. Just thought of something . . .

Has anyone done a bi-level board, meaning a surface and a matching below-ground complex?

CC

In a small sort of way I did multi-level terrain for my Gold Digger Jones and the Lost Stargate game. there were areas under some temples that went down to underground levels. I used hinged wooden boxes on a side board to do the levels. Opened up, the lid was the first floor below, and the main box interior was the deepest level. The boxes could be closed to keep it a mystery until characters explored the entry points. It worked well enough, as not too much activity happened inside the boxes. It could have gotten way too crowed, otherwise.

Have you looked at photos of temple complexes in the Yucatan to get some inspiration? You get the jungle smell without the Asian flavor.

At Cold Wars or Historicon, someone did a 25mm Stalingrad Sewer battle with above ground/below ground matching terrain. A friend of mine, Paul Hromulak, did some terrain also with a below ground command post that lifted out of the terrain to place/move figues for a game he ran at a con. I don't know if Paul is still on here or what his handle is on here though.

A tip I learned from Mexican Jack Squint was to visit your local Indian community and purchase the cheaper sort of plastic votive statues. I've also seen dollar store Buddha incense burners turned to similar uses quite effectively.

Perhaps perusing back issues of National Geographic?

Seems most home decor aisles in Target have at least a couple Buddah statues, usually as candle holders or such.

Well, your choices for "ruins-in-jungle" are either Mayan or SE Asian, so hitting up some of the MesoAmerican tour websites would be my first suggestion.

CC,

Just do a Google image search for ruins in jungle, mesoamerican ruins, cambodian ruins, etc. and you'll get a bunch of photos.

Jim

I must be getting old. I am forgetting to type half my sentences these days.

What I really need are examples of terrain boards of city ruins in a jungle setting.

Are there any photos of terrain boards like the one in my first post that could give me an idea of how buildings and walls can be laid out for greater effect, without making movement of figures impossible?

I also like the idea of having most or all of the ruined buildings to be playable structures inside (possible removable tops) and not just for show.

Thanks and sorry for the confusion.

CC
PS. Artslave, are there any photos of that multilevel terrain board?

Here are some jungle ideas but not much for ruins:

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theterrainguy.com/juve.html
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I noticed how the board in the first link is basically plain, and that all the buildings are removable pieces.

I've always tried to be overly "creative" with the contours in the board, but that seems like such a simple solution for getting greater versatility in layout of pieces.

These are the main reasons I would like to see what others have done with their jungle city terrain boards:

I want to learn how to get the feel of a city complex without overdoing it, or looking too sparse (park-like) or, worse still, impeding play.
I would like to see how many structures they used. How large the structures. What type of structures(temple/utilitarian/plazas) – to strike a balance. How many structures are in total ruin vs partial ruin. How vegetation is incorporated into the building pieces (as in invasive roots and such). How much vegetation in independent bases.

CC

I took a quest from that place in CC's first link in Silk Road Online once.

This lost temple card model may provide some ideas.

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Cacique Caribe

If you want real-life jungle terrain looking settings, here is a couple of websites to check out from Mexico.

Ek Balam – actually looks like this. It was only recently discovered and has trees, bushes, etc. growing all around the buildings. The backside of the Acropolis (giant pyramid structure) completely disappears within 20-25 ft around the backside as the jungle has completely grown over the building. I felt like Indiana Jones when I went to this site as it was not busy like Chitchen Itza. Find it at:

cancun.travel/en/files/2007/12/ek-balam1.jpg

Tulum – ariel view is very nice…much more wide open on the coast. Parts are overgrown with vegetation, and the walls surrounding the old city are hidden in areas. This was my first visit to an old ruined city ever. Here at:

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bbs.keyhole.com/…/0/Number/485244/Main/485244
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Coba – another city and pyramid structure that has immense vegetation growing all around it as well. Find pics here:

bbs.keyhole.com/…/0/Number/485244/Main/485244

I also would suggest Stonehouse Miniatures found at stonehouseminiatures.com which sells a variety of ruins and temples for Latin and South America.

Hope some of this helps…
Regards,
Hitman

I studied weathering and erosion at uni, so this may be of some help. Sorry, it's a really long post. (plz don't stifle!)

If you're talking an ancient lost city, there are generally three kinds of construction material:

1) Wood. Pretty much everything will be gone within a century. Not very aesthetically pleasing even when half-gone. In Japan they build wood castles on huge earth embankments faced with stone, so that's all you'd find a hundred years later. Wood also tends to catch fire.

2) Mud/brick. Longer lasting, maybe a couple of hundred years before everything goes. Some cities in Africa were built from mud. Brick is usually used in conjunction with wood and as such burns.

3) Stone. With time, even these can be completely lost (say a couple of hundred years) but the main structure will still be present. Depending on what kind of stone is used, there will be a lot of weathering from humidity, rain and acidic soil.

I take it you want to build in stone and as the other two don't last, let's focus on the stone.

-Natives may still live in or near the area, and so will nick stone for their own purposes / still use the facilities to some extent. So there may be some kind of activity there. Notably vegetation will be cleared fairly often – the lost city in the first link looks like that.

-Stone is fairly durable but is subject to both weathering and cracking. Cracking is typically cause by plant roots, so as they infiltrate cracks between stones, they will split them. Stone in precarious positions will fall off. Weakened pillars will cause partial collapses of buildings, especially if only built from small blocks. Rule of thumb: bigger blocks, longer lasting.

-Round stuff rolls, square stuff doesn't. You'll find heads quite a distance from their statues because, well, they roll.

-Ceramics and glazed or painted bricks will quickly lose their colour. In tropical humidity and acidity they will crumble quickly, but they will retain their colour for a century or so. Ancient cities weren't all bare stone, they actually painted the rock and glazed bricks.

-Bronze bits will turn green. This takes less than a century. Usually they are nicked long before then. Gold stays pretty but gets dirty and of course is also nicked.

Part 2:

-Vegetation will get in everywhere almost immediately. Trees will not grow for some time but when they do they will split pavement and undermine foundations of structures.

-Landslides / mudslides. You hardly ever see evidence of this in movies but in cities close to hillsides in jungle environments, landslides are a real danger. The inhabitants clear the trees, plant crops and thus generate conditions for mudslides. Thus part of the city could easily be covered in dirt, with the landslide knocking over pillars and whatnot. So you can use interesting terrain pieces. If it's built on a hill (for defence) then landslides may carry rubble away from the city.

-Shifting foundations. This only really happens with mud/brick or wood cities, because stone is heavy enough to compact the ground beneath it. But sometimes soil movements will cause poorly laid foundations to become unstable and stuff topples. Alternatively, the city might be built on marshland (good farmland if it's drained) and it just… sinks. You may also find collapsed tunnels, which just become rubble and vegetation-filled trenches.

-Rotting timbers. Often stone structures are propped up with wood, especially if there's a shortage of stone, so when the wood goes, the structure collapses. Generally the bigger, more important buildings won't have much wood so they may still be standing.

-Earthquakes. Earthquakes, of course, will knock everything down. Ziggurats and squat structures will survive, statues and stuff will be knocked over. People in earthquake zones either build very strong stone / mud buildings or very light wood ones.

This is a really good summary of what happens to stone over time (sorry no pics on this one):

stonecaretechniques.com/8_m.htm

A lot of the ruins I have seen in pictures look like they have already been restored for the most part, and most of the vegetation has been removed or trimmed back, giving it a park-like effect.

Are there any photos of what jungle cities and temples actually looked like when first discovered by modern explorers and archaeologists?

Thanks.

CC

Generally they are almost unrecognisable. You could walk right through the middle of one and not realise they were there. I will see what I can dig up; there have been a few discoveries recently but generally most jungle cities were abandoned ~500 years ago.

Google images of Tikal. It's a breathtaking place. There is something about pyramids in the jungle.

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Does this look familiar?

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…the rebel base on Yavin.

Palenque has a lot of neat architecture too.

CC, I don't have pics of terrain boards (yet), but I picked up a copy of "The Lost Cities of the Mayas" a collection of Frederick Catherwood's art depicting exploration of Mayan ruins as inspiration just for the purpose of creating a city of jungle ruins. Some of his art can be seen here:

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Not quite what you asked for, but hoefully a source of some inspiration.

Irishserb,

I googled "Frederick Catherwood Maya" and look at all that came up!!!

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Fantastic images.

Now all I need to do is make a game table with the same feel.

CC

Palenque definitely looked different, and not like the manicured ruins I see in all the travel guides:

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CC

CC, I looked through my posted pictures for those terrain boxes, and didn't find anything. If it is a concept you think you might want to pursue, I could set up one of the boxes and shoot a few photos.

Here are some old shots of some of the components I've re-used in jungle settings:
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Here is a oldie you might have already seen of Cycads constructed with pine cone cores. You have to have some jungle to go with the ruins!
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In closed terrain, I scatter all sorts of ground cover, and allow players to move it out of the way to place figures. The only open terrain is clearly delineated or only a narrow pathway through the vegetation that is shown by ribbons of sprinkled scenic dirt.

Hey everyone, look at this . . . about a city called Gran Vilaya (also Kuelap, Cuelap), in Peru:

phfawcettsweb.org/vilaya.htm
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CC

If you want cheap ruins, quickly, I've found that many pet stores/aquarium supply stores have good ruins at about the right scale for gaming. You can usually find Egyptian and Mayan/Incan fairly readily, as well as Greek statues and columns.

I picked up a *very* nice large Egyptian ruin that works great as a central temple. The thing is massive, and weighs a couple pounds, but only cost me fifteen bucks. No further tweaking was required, and it looks great on the table. Particularly with anubis-headed mummies picking off adventurers with bows from the cover of the fallen stone beams.

As mentioned, it's fairly easy to find Hindu statues cheaply too. Make your pieces modular, and fairly plain, then stick the statues in the niches depending on the area you're in. Adventuring in India? In goes Ganesh! Darkest Peru? Some nice Olmec heads should do the trick. If you want to get detailed, just add some 'badly rotted and worn' sections, were it looks like epic frescoes have since crumbled..

Oh, and one other thing. I really should't have to mention this, but some people just completely miss it, somehow: If you need a statue, pick up a mini from the time/place, and paint it stone-colored. Simple. Can even just leave the base on and everything. Plus it makes for a great deal of fun when said statues start closing in on your intrepid adventurers!

I guess you can never have too much vegetation, right?

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CC

Unbelievable!

This is truly amazing, though I would probably go with LOTS of crumbling structures and LOTS of vegetation in between:

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I really, REALLY like the way they have distributed the walls and buildings!

CC

Holy crap.

That ruined city is AMAZING. Wow.

Yeah, that's one of the GW Gamesday displays. IIRC, it's something like 6x12 feet, though.

6x12 feet!!!

No. Mine will have to be a much smaller version of that.

It will have to fit on this 80" by 40" table:

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CC

Hey CC!

Here's an article on how that Gamesday '05 Lustria Jungle City was built:
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More impressive terrain (although in German):
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More "how to build ruins" (German again):
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Regards, the Gorb

Gorb,

Outstanding detail on how they did it! Thanks so much.

Look at this. Add a TON of vegetation and a huge wall and gate in ruins, and you get very close to what I want to do in my very limited space (hope the links actually work):

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CC

Could someone explain to me what they mean here by "balsa foam"?

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Thanks.

CC

Man!, that Palantir Gallery is the kind of terrain that makes Me want to chuck all My stuff out and give up.

Balsa foam is a foam product that is very stable, light weight, easy to cut and shape, and accepts fine detailing. It is reasonably resistent to impact or crushing, much moreso than polystyrene insulation (blue-board, etc), but is very brittle. It particularly lends itself to being cut on band saws and scroll saws, thus making elaborate relief or statues for models "relatively" easy and fast to produce.

DickBlick art supplies sell it:

dickblick.com/zz331/11

More info and examples here:

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And the packaging that I have says it was manufactured by Jiffy Foam, Inc, contact info at:

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Oh, it is also significantly more expensive than something like blue foamboard. I'm guessing they have at least $1,500 USD in balsa foam in that model. Maybe a bunch more.

Interesting. Before you mentioned it was a brand name, I thought it was the crumbly floral foam people use to hold flowers and water at the bottom of vases.

Aparently it can be used to sculpt interesting designs, though I doubt they would ever be durable, as that stuff is extremely brittle:

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I'm glad to see that balsa foam is not that floral material.

CC

Hmm. Just thought of something . . .

Has anyone done a bi-level board, meaning a surface and a matching below-ground complex?

CC

I have toyed with the idea.

I did make a 4x8 table that is a cave system, where I lay panels on top for Zombie/Colonial gaming.

I can either game the cave or the top surface, can't do both at same time. :(

How about an above-ground board and a matching below-ground board, but used side by side?

CC

You can also go for a simpler lost "city" like those of the mound builders

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If I were to make something like that for the gaming table, do you have any suggestions on how to:

1) Make the curved wall;
2) Make it look imposing (how high the walls), without taking over the entire room;
3) Making it as a ruin, not as a pristine city

Thanks.

CC

Lots more inspiration here . . .

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Here's where I found that picture:

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More inspiration for my Opar, particularly the underground areas:

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CC

If I could make out the writing on these sketches, I might be able to duplicate the layout somewhat:

erbzine.com/mag15/1547.html

CC

I would have the surface and underground boards side by side, or try a set up something like this:

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TMP link

CC

I would still want it to have elements from various different cultural groups, much like these "out of this world" ideas:

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TMP link

CC

This looks cool, apparently from Atlantis The Lost Empire:

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I don't know if this model is a theme park ride or something:

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CC

Better photo here:

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CC

For some giant statue decor:

TMP link

CC

Minoan-like wouldn't be bad either, but not as complex of course:

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athenapub.com/11palace.htm
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Or Mycenaean-like, walls and all:

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CC