"Chariots in Comitatus" Topic

I'm looking forward to giving my Picts an outing using Comitatus.

The thing is I have chariots and I would like to use them. Chariots, understandably enough, don't feature in the Comitatus rules – no one used them except the Irish and Picts.

So I'm thinking that I will rate them as Heavy Javelin Cavalry A3/D2/S.

Am I missing anything or does that seem about right?

Any thoughts or suggestions are most welcome.

Sounds reasonable. As an extra, don't allow them to go into woods or any sort of rough ground. Vehicles with wagon wheels are murder on the riders when going over rough terrain.

Oh ,

if you post on the commitatus forum page, then Simon is usually on with a definate ruling very shortly. He is here regularly as well and is very prompt at rules support.

Phil

Earlier than your Picts but worth a read PDF link from their testing it seems that the suspension was a bit more effective than we normally credit them to be.

x42

Thanks for the replies boys. I'm thinking woods are to be avoided but, curtesy of x42's link, rough ground is not a problem.

Now I'm wondering about dismounting in line with Ceasar's description. Of course there is no evidence Picts did it but it does seem part of the British chariot package. So maybe.

I'd missed the Commitatus Forum so thanks for that Phil.

Most Chariot tactics seem the same
1.) Charge full speed at enemy , yelling, screaming and firing/throwing stuff.
2.) If the enemy breaks and runs. ride them down, if not either
a.) Turn away and fall back at speed, or
b.) Dismount and fight on foot keeping chariot nearby to leap into and run away in if things do not go well.

I had considered making provision for chariots to cater for the Celtic fringes in Comitatus but in the end decided against it on the grounds that they were so rarely used in the period.

My suspicion is that while a Dark Age Celtic warlord may have ridden into battle on a chariot as a mark of prestige, he probably would have dismounted to fight on foot. I can picture a couple of great men charging up towards each other, hurling insults, and challenging each other to single combat before the battle proper begins, but I am doubtful there were wings of ‘chariot units'.

Even in Caesar's day it seems more than likely the real fighting was done on foot and the charioteers withdrew to the rear as per Caesar's description:

"firstly, they drive about in all directions and throw their weapons and generally break the ranks of the enemy with the very dread of their horses and the noise of their wheels; and when they have worked themselves in between the troops of horse, leap from their chariots and engage on foot. The charioteers in the mean time withdraw some little distance from the battle, and so place themselves with the chariots that, if their masters are overpowered by the number of the enemy, they may have a ready retreat to their own troops."

Truscott Trotter's comment is pretty well on the money.

That said if you do fancy deploying Pictish chariots I would say treating them more or less like Heavy Javelin Cavalry as you suggest is not a bad idea and I would restrict them to a leader's Comitatus. And definitely give them the option to dismount.
Simon

Don't underestimate the ability of chariots operating in woods. Caesar mentions chariots charging out of woods, and you want to see some of the terrain that modern carriages go through in various cross country events.

All very hepful. I can now see my Pictish army.

Leaders comitatus (chariots)

2 units of light cavalry

Sub commander

2 units of shieldwall

1 unit of archers

1 unit of javelinmen

An image of Dux of Hazard flits though my mind…

That should work nicely

Yes I'm looking forward to it.