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"Game of Thrones Theory -SPOILERS!!!" Topic


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261 hits since 30 Jul 2017
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ScottWashburn Sponsoring Member of TMP31 Jul 2017 4:41 p.m. PST

SPOILERS!!!!!!

After watching the first three episodes of Season 7 of Game of Thrones I have to say I was a bit disappointed. At the end of season 6 I was thrilled to see Dany leading her fleet and armies and dragons to Westeros and I looked forward to Cersei being crushed and finally getting her just deserts. In the first episode of Season 7, things looked good and the strategy discussion between Cersei and Jamie seemed to confirm that things were very dire for the Lannisters.

But then in episodes 2 & 3, everything seemed to be going to hell for Dany. In Episode 2 the Iron Fleet crushes the rebel Grayjoys, captures the Dornish women, and appears to take Dorne out of the war, at least for the time being. In Episode 3 the Unsullied are outwitted and left stranded, while Jamie takes the Tullys completely out of the war. Dany is now stuck at Dragonstone with not much fleet and only the Dothraki left as a striking force—which she scarcely dares to use for fear of uniting all Westeros against her. Plus her dragons—which we suddenly fear aren't as invulnerable as we'd hoped.

So how could this happen? How could Cersei and Jamie—both proven in past episodes to be poor strategists-- suddenly turn the tables so quickly? How could the Iron Fleet be in just the right place, not once, but twice to crush most of Dany's navy and how could Jamie know it was safe to move against the Tullys when by all rights he should have been totally preoccupied with the security of King's Landing?

I can see only two choices: 1. Poor writing :) This is a distinct possibility, of course. There is a lot of ridiculous stuff going on with huge fleets and armies sailing and marching vast distances with no mishap and apparently no logistical support. And how could Euron possibly have built this enormous fleet on a bunch of islands with no trees and find the 100,000 men needed to man it when the Ironborn are a small and scattered people who should still be reeling from their defeats on the mainland in earlier seasons? So it could just be poor writing.

But there is another possibility. The more I think of it, the more likely it seems.

Dany has a traitor in her midst.

How DID Euron know exactly where to ambush Theon and his sister? How DID he then catch up with the Unsullied's ships just in time to crush them? How DID Jamie know that there was no imminent threat to Kings Landing and feel free to move against the Tullys?

Because Varys told them.

There is a traitor in Dany's high command, and the only one it can possibly be is Varys. None of the people she brought with her from the east would have either the motive or the means to transmit the information. Tyrion couldn't have done it because he has no reason and it would be so totally uncool if he did :) But Varys still has his network of little birds in place to send and receive information. As for his motive, I'm not sure. Perhaps he just doesn't see Dany as the one to bring peace. Perhaps he just sees this as a way to get his old job back.

And finally, there was that cryptic and very disturbing comment by Mellisandra in Episode 3. Is she on to him?

I hope we will find out!

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP31 Jul 2017 5:06 p.m. PST

Someone check Varys's cell phone history, stat!

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP31 Jul 2017 5:10 p.m. PST

Hmmm…
Now, why would Dany make such a point about warning him about the penalty for betraying her?

I think the Dothraki and dragons of War will be let slip this week coming up.
We can't have Chekov's Dragon, now can we?

Personal logo Patrick R Supporting Member of TMP01 Aug 2017 12:58 a.m. PST

Then the Dothkraks and at least one dragon will be drawn into a trap and wiped out.

I expect that Cersei will be standing on Daenerys' throat before long.

And that's when either the White Walkers really get into the game to the point that everyone will drop whatever they are doing to save their own lives or someone pulls off another amazing stunt and completely reverses the situation just in time.

Earl of the North01 Aug 2017 8:06 a.m. PST

I'm pretty sure that Tyrell gold is going to be taken before it reaches Cersei since they have made a point of showing it being transported in a coach with minimal guards in the clip for next week.

It also shows a certain Iron Islander (who is missing a sister) landing on a beach with men following him……so great coach robbery perhaps?

Personal logo Doctor X Supporting Member of TMP01 Aug 2017 10:24 a.m. PST

I pretty much agree with Patrick.
I also like the Varys traitor theory.
At the end of this season he, Dany, and probably Greyworm will both be killed off with the White Walker army now breaking through the wall and Westeros in deep peril.

PaddySinclair02 Aug 2017 12:25 a.m. PST

But Varys still has his network of little birds in place to send and receive information.

A major plot point was made of that previously. His little birds now work for Cersei's maester (can't remember his name). If Yarys doesn't know they are compromised (he surely should…) and is still using them, then he's the traitor but doesn't know it himself. But Cersei is getting a lot of pretty solid information on Dany…

138SquadronRAF Supporting Member of TMP02 Aug 2017 7:53 a.m. PST

Jamie did point out that having been beaten by Rob he learned a thing or two. History provides solid examples of that, for example compare the performance of the Austrians in the 2nd and 3rd Schlesische Kriege.

Cersei also no longer has to work through a small council or willful child. Her father was pretty much the embodiment of the "only sane made" trope so maybe she had a chance to reconsider her actions too.

Must admit I would prefer the series to return to the more glacial pace of seasons 5 & 6 though.

ScottWashburn Sponsoring Member of TMP07 Aug 2017 3:07 a.m. PST

Well, Episode 4 seems to tilt things in favor of the 'bad writing' explanation. :)

If Varys was tipping Cersei off about Dany's plans, he surely would have warned her about this latest expedition.

It was surely a very cool battle! But looking at the maps it is ridiculous that fleets and armies can just effortlessly move from point to point like moving pieces on a chessboard. Logistics dammit! :)

Earl of the North07 Aug 2017 4:58 a.m. PST

I've given up trying to make sense of the teleporting troop movements around a continent.

Time seems to suddenly move differently in Westeros with armies and navies zooming around at breathtaking speeds.

Gunfreak Supporting Member of TMP07 Aug 2017 10:09 a.m. PST

So a giant balista is firing at dragon. In the background lots of dothraki are riding about. None of them even thought about chucking a spear at the guy trying to kill their queen and pet dragon.

Also why waste the dothraki? Three dragons would have destroyed the army in about 30 seconds.

ScottWashburn Sponsoring Member of TMP08 Aug 2017 3:09 a.m. PST

Yes, I was struck that none of the Dothraki came flocking to help their queen. I guess they were having too much fun killing Lannisters. Which is probably why Dany brought them along: they were getting pretty damned bored (not to say hungry) sitting on Dragonstone.

Personal logo Der Alte Fritz Sponsoring Member of TMP22 Aug 2017 7:23 p.m. PST

I think that the teleporting is just a device to speed up events and,cram a
lot of open plot points into the series before its final episode . The show never tells you how much time has passed between events.

I like your theory that Varys is the mole.

Finally, the series would be better if they just ditched the whole White Walker jazz and let Westeros have its death fight.

ScottWashburn Sponsoring Member of TMP24 Aug 2017 3:20 a.m. PST

You are no doubt right as to the reasons for it, but it makes it a lot harder for us armchair strategists to come up with reasonable predictions when none of the real-world constraints on the movement and supply of armies seems to apply here :)

And of course it reached the heights of ridiculousness with the latest episodes with ravens and dragons flying a thousand miles in just a few hours.

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