"Skirmishers in practice... How'd they look?" Topic

Hi Guys,

I hope this finds everyone well.

I'm currently starting to do some work on skirmishing French Voltiguers. I'm having a little bit of difficulty getting my head around the layout of the strips for these guys, as well as the poses needed, the spacing needed, etc..

In general, how close/far apart would the skirmishers deploy? I always imagined they were rather far apart, but some pics I've seen of reenactments show them just sort of strung along in a line looking almost like a continuous single rank.. is this more the norm? I've read that there was a sort of 2-rank skirmish reserve held back behind the main skirmish line also..is this true?

Any help/ideas for poses/etc is greatly appreciated – I just want to be sure I get this done as historically accurate as possible..

Thanks
Bob

What types of poses would you feel would best represent

You're going to do yourself an injury worrying about these things, Bob! :)

The easiest solution might be to supply strips, and let the customer cut them up/base them to their own ideas/rules.

If you want to make them different from the regular strips you could try different "skirmishing" poses (if that's at all possible in 4mm – I realise that I've reached the point of possibly talking out of an orifice between my buttocks, having no idea about the problems of casting such small figures).

As for poses? Standing firing; kneeling firing; loading; looking rather worried about the approaching cavalry (that last one was for Robert le Diable)?

The truth is that most of us would gladly accept whatever you gave us! Hell, I thought that the first ever pic you showed us was brilliant! Never even expected you to try and improve it!

Haha Thanks Quintus.. I sure do appreciate the nod.

The difficulty in just laying out strips for folks to cut up and snip is that the figures are really rather small..we're talking about 1/8" tall and about 1/32" wide.. smaller than the writing tip of a typical pen. So to make things easier for everyone (myself included lol) I think it'd probably help having them sculpted so that they pretty much just need to be painted in place, and they're ready to go. Of course, if people want to cut them off the strips thats fine too, but at least they'd be in the proper placement should they wish to leave them as is.

One problem is there was no 'one size fits all' skirmisher arrangement.

Among others there was
1) Off battlefield, however you darn well liked, from fairly well formed in a chain to all over the place.
2) As a forward unit with enemy line units or cavalry close by – 1/3 in a chain of two slightly staggered ranks 2yds or more between files, the other 2/3rd formed 50-200yds behind.
3) As close cover for a line unit either its own parent as along a Brigade front – as 2 but the line counts as the support.
4) Anything in between.

Really I suppose a mix of two rank formed line, two rank chain standing, and 'a bit all over the place' (but close enough to be worth a strip)

The actual distance between files and supports would vary on circumstance, but using about 2 metres may give the right feel without getting too seperate to be not worth a strip.
At least you have the flexibility to do what looks best and no-one can really say 'they never looked like that!' :)

Remember that skirmishers work in pairs. Because of the long loading time it was standard practice to have one loading and one standing with a loaded musket waiting for the other to finish before firing.
Indeed one can find examples of peasants impressed to make fake skirmish lines by standing in pairs in a line. Standing like that worked at a distance.
And skirmishers are never alone. there is always a formed unit a short distance back. A typical practice would have about half the skirmishers standing i small formed units behind the skirmish line.

Thanks Hornblaeser.. but generally does anyone know how close these pairs stood to one another? Was there a general rule of thumb, or would it depend entirely on the layout of the battlefield?

Hi Bob :

Here is m'al Davout, in detail on skirmishing, in ….. ENGLISH !!

link

:-))))

Yippeeeeee ! I was afraid I was going to have translate this ! Thanks to whoever did the work !

- Evan

Indded they stood far enough apart to screen what they were screening, allowing for terrain.

But some text book examples for close support of line by the integral skirmish element -:

Prussia 1806 20 shutzen in a 140 man company, 5 company battalion.
All shutzen in a close support chain gives ->
600/3ranks*22" /100shutzen*2ranks /36"= 2.44 yards

1809 British battalion using just their light company as a close support chain for the remainder in close files (based on 600 men) – thats 540/2ranks*22"/36" /60lights*2ranks = 5.5yards a thin skirmish line by later Napoleonic standards. But if using both flank companies thats 480/2ranks*22" /120lights*2ranks /36"=2.44 yards

1800 French batallion of (say)600 using one company as close support 534/3ranks*22" /66voltiguers*2ranks /36"=3.30 yards

1809 using voltiguer company as close support
500/3ranks*22" /100voltiguers*2ranks /36"=2.04 yards

1809 Austrians using entire 3rd rank as forward skirmish line including half formed as supports
600/2 ranks*22 /300thirders *2supports *2ranks
/36"= 2.44 yards

So from the math a close support chain looks like having been mostly 2.4 yards between pairs; at longer range from the parent unit keeping the same frontage but dropping half the chain back as formed support it may have been 4 to 5 yards; or for a longer fight and.or independently with two thirds resting/formed that would have been up to 7.2 yards per file of two men.

[PS some may notice that shows 1806 Prussians had equivalence with 1809 Austrian and British and were not so different from the French – worth bearing in mind next time you come across a rule or text declaring the 1806 Prussians had utterly inadequate skirmisher provision]

Forgot to add – a standard distance between the front and rear rank of each file pair was 2 yards.

Instructions for the 8th Light, French, says
3 paces between files covering the march of a column, 100 paces out in front and to the flanks
6 paces between files covering a unit en bataille, 150 paces in front the support, another 150 in front of that the skirmisher chain.

Hey Evan beaut site.. thanks its just what the Doctor ordered! Ahh phew.. I was getting crazy with this lol.

I think the key thing to remember is that skirmishers will be based in a single rank. For this reason i assume your going to use deeper bases on the figures? THe ones you have for your line are good thickness for 2/3 deep bases but would be a little too thin to base in a single rank.

As shown in the link you were given the minimum skirmishers deployed would be 1 company however they would seperate into sections quite often.

I would suggest most people for 1:1 games would base them in a single line of a whole section. This would of course be rather a long line though…

Hey Bluch,

I'd agree with you on the basing.. I'd have to put them on a wider base than the marching infantry, and do poses for the lead rank (firing, aiming, scanning for targets, etc..) and poses for the support rank (loading, standing/crouching on guard, running forward, etc..). Also I'd need strips/poses for the skirmish reserve.. (that's easy though – just 2 ranks, standing at attention). I guess I can make each skirmishing strip an Escouade of 1 corporal and about 11 men (gives me 100 men per company, roughly).

Won't be too long a line though, I don't think.. an entire 1:1 Battalion in line, with Voltiguers deployed, will be just about over 10 inches in length. So if I break down the strips by escouade, and if the pairs were deployed at 15 paces/9.75m apart that would translate to 9750mm..divided by 500 = 19.5mm in scaled length between skirmishing pairs. So if we have a Voltiguer company of 100 men, with the second Voltiguer section held back as a central reserve in 2 ranks, and 20 men of the first Voltiguer section held as left-wing, and right-wing reserves, that leaves us with a skirmish line of roughly 2 ranks of 15 Voltiguers, working in pairs, at intervals of 19.5mm.. for a total skirmish line/chain frontage of 292.5mm, or just under 11.5 inches. Just enough to cover the entire front of the battalion, actually, with a tiny bit of overlap on the flanks. Cool, so it works out just like it looks in this picture I have in my Osprey book.. :)
Hehe.. Ok.. so now I have to start on these s. Oh, and I'm going to include them free with the "marching" battalion packs, and with the single company Voltigeur packs, I think, so you'd actually be getting 2 companies of Voltiguers in these packs – 1 marching, & 1 skirmishing – to cover whatever actions your tiny little Voltiguers may be doing. :)

Best,
Bob

Including them free? You're a true officer and gentleman!

One of the things to remember is that Davout's instruction details French practice only, though other nations adopted same to a similar (Prussia) or much lesser (Russia and Austria ) degree.

In reality you find that even in the French Revolution there are dozens of reports noting Allied light infantry "skirmishing." However in both function and physical deployment these schemes were far different than what Davout details. IIRC, Zhmodikov lists the techniques proscribed by Kutusov for the Bug Jaeger Corps and in at least one situation the term "skirmish" actually referred to the Yegerski assuming a shoulder-to-shoulder formation one rank deep for the purpose of extending the line's width. Hoehenlohe's instructions likewise assumed only a single pace between men forward, back and to the side.

The French also used such similar tactics in special situations, but there seem to be no equivalent to Davout's instructions on the continent until at least 1813 when the reformed Prussian army took the field.

In other words, just because Davout did it that way, don't assume likewise for other countries if you read about Austrian skirmishers in 1794.

Regards, Bill Gray

ageofeagles.com

Hi Bill,

An excellent point, and something that had not even entered my mind. I suppose I'll have to bug everyone again when I start with these other nations.. ;-)

Thanks!
Bob

Typically precise and comprehensive; and list of projected poses are appropriate (one useful pose would be pulling back the hammer, either looking down at the lock or looking forward "scanning for targets"; gives a bit more variety with minimun alteration to basic model). You calculations mean that a little printed paper plan of how to base and place figures is even more essential. Appreciated Quintus' little joke. Incidentally, among your "personalities" (which I assume will be somewhere in the tiny pipette-line) could we have Coignet and Bourgogne &c &c, carrying the dog "Mouton", dunging in full view of the enemy, serving a cannon with one arm blown off, &c &c. With bayonettes always fixed, of course.

Ah, great minds thinking alike, Robert! I've just sent off my e-mail to Bob suggesting the same thing about the little printed plan for basing to be added to the figure packs.

And of course Bob could do special little, humourous "vignettes" now and again, like Napoleon having a pee behind a bush. Just how big (small)is a 4mm scale "", anyway? ;)

Just thought! I suppose that we'll find out the answer when Bob gets around to doing his 4mm Ancients range and sculpts the naked Gauls!

LOL Cheers Gents.. actually some fun ideas there, regarding poses.

Quintus & Robert, as per your input/advice I'm setting up a diagram to send out in the figure packs. Wonderful suggestion, I thank you.

Oh, and Sam – since Napoleon was an Italian I'd say at 1/500 scale you're looking at atleast 10mm for his little friend (OH! High-Five's all around to my fellow Ginzo's)!

Best,
Bob

Apropos Boney urinating (there's precision): I understand that the four Chasseurs a Cheval of the immediate escort were required, whenever he dismounted, to do so themselves and "form square" (bayonettes fixed!), and this included those occasions on which the Great Man lifted his leg….

<<Quelle vignette que ma vie!>>

Austrian usage for skirmisher support is in their 1769 regs, in more detail and with diagrams in the plates for the 1807 regs, but still the same basics.
A very clear and exact layout that should easily translate into matching figure strips for t'other side of river.

East of the Rhine they had long been using part of the 3rd rank as the skirmish element of a battalion rather than the French or British practice which had a specific platoon or company assigned for that purpose, a difference dating back some 50 years, and which continued during Napoleons time as each nation maintained their individual development paths for this aspect of tactics.

Jeff Lewis