"Red Dawn Gaming....(Minus the Wolverines)" Topic

I admit it, love Red Dawn, however I love the Red Dawn that takes up about 1/3 of the film (The Non-Wolverine parts:-)

For it's time, Milius did a wonderful job at replicating Soviet uniforms and equipment long before you could go to Slovakia on a shoestring and film any tripe with authentic WP equipment that you wished (SFC anyone :-)

For that alone, the attention to detail, it should get some kudos, although there were still some oddities (Soviet Naval Yak-38's forward deployed in Colorado? ;-)

But the idea of a large scale, conventional land war in the US during the Reagan era is interesting. Gaming wise, it could work in any scale (although I would be doing it in 15mm myself). From sweeping 6mm armored games on the US plains, to 15mm town battles and 28mm skirmishes, it's all there.

I may actually give it a go in 15mm, as I already have most of the armor and infantry I would need, could always build some 1980's VDV and Spetsnaz to add in, along with US National Guard with M60's and M113's.

Cool thing is, in HO scale all those normally useless "Small Town" USA buildings suddenly have a lot of value! VDV attack on KFC anyone? :-)

I'm seriously thinking of doing this. Anyone else dabbled with this idea?

Paul

P.S. As an aside, does anyone know where I can attain any further info on the builds they did for the film? Am curious about base chassis used, methods of scratch-building, etc.

Really am impressed at the job they did on the armor, and heck, even the Hinds and Yak's were nicely done.

We play modern USA vs Russia in micro armor scale. We did a couple of games that were set on US soil but most of them are Europe scenerio's. If you like reading check a series called The Zone. Its a series of books that cover a NATO unit in Europe fighting WARSAW forces. The author's name is JAmes Rouch. I heard there is a company that is reprinting the series.

They are available to buy as PDF downloads, but no reprint as far as I am aware. Books 1-7 are easily avaialbe second-hand, books 8 and 9 are quite expensive….

Geoff & Ironwolf,

Actually never heard of this series before, and am longing to discover a new Cold War series. Is it better than Ian Slater's books? ;-)

They are based on a post-Soviet invasion of the West resulting in vast areas of Western Europe becoming semi-toxic wastelands (The Zone). Outside the wasteland people try to live normal lives, inside there are abandoned towns, refugee camps and roving battles. People outside try to keep those from within, within (sort of non-contamination self-preservation).

The books revolve around a special force comprising Brits and Americans in a hover APC who go on little missions. Some of th battles described are bigger set-piece engagements.

Downside is the heavy 'all Svoiets are communists and all communists are evil' feel to it, but quite enjoyable reading. Details are slightly outdated now (T84 armed with turreet mounted missile) but other than that, quite good.

Watched it again last night; IMHO, it still holds up rather well. And bless their hearts, they really did try to make everything look like WP equipment. The vismods, while a touch crude in places, worked well. For mock-ups, the Forgers and Frogfoots (I *think* there was one in the attack on the airfield) were neat. And the Hind-As…I still wonder how they got a hold of real Hind-As in 1984. I also wonder where I can get one in 1/48.

Also – it looked like some of the tanks later in the movie *weren't* vismods. IMDB trivia says that they were very, very good vismods.

For The Zone books and the wargame rules to come, check link
Sounds great but for the fact it is a year since it was updated, so I guess it is stalled.

As for Red Dawn, I loved it. However my new idea is a fictional European country using AK47 & all the new figures in plastic 20mm now out.

I emailed Ian only Sunday for an update :-)

I've toyed with the idea several times, but have never purchased any figs. I would game it in 15s or maybe 25s, depending on what scale of game I wanted. With all of the stuff coming out in plastic, you could probably do it pretty cheap in 1/72.

I believe those weren't real Hind-As. As I recall they were heavilly modified Puma helicopters.

Yep, they were definitely Pumas.

Aw, darn.

We can do you a Puma in 15mm if you want to modify it to look like aHind ;-)

Surprisingly difficult to find any details on the movie-mods that were used. Several reports that there were quite a few Soviet vehicles made or modded, and that a T72 was so realistic that it was (allegedly) followed by the CIA who wanted to know where it had come from…

Read that Milius somehow managed to use a legit T-72 for one scene in there. First video I ever bought. Loved it. William Smith as the Spetsnaz colonel,since he actually could speak Russian(trained as a communications specialist in the U.S. military in his younger days.)made quite an addition. I've envisioned gaming scenarii inspired by the pic. And if you recall,the Combloc force only occupied,with any significant miltary force, the area between the Rockies& the Mississippi River;in the storyline. Good job doctoring the Pumas,though.

Yep, not bad at all: picture

15mm would be the largest scale that I would want to do this with. Modern equipment is quite a bit larger than WWII equipment, so even at 20mm, a T72 or M1 would be huge on a table. I have been considering doing this era with 10mm stuff, but I would probably stick to Europe myself, along the lines of Red Storm Rising or Team Yankee.

Not that much bigger, but the ranges are generally longer. Just depends on the rules/ground scale you are using.

If you're going to do something like Red Storm Rising, I agree you probably want to think about 10mm, or even 1:300

The fun thing about doing Red Dawn has to be gaming a fast Soviet strike against the second line US equipment of the day. (The film was produced in 1984… wow, 22 years ago!)

Nice link to the ZONE and superb for just in the future wargames. If any of you are drawn to this genre of gaming you must consider our Metal Storm, its bang on for creating vehicles as it has a vehicle design points system so you can build vehicles to suit. there is a page on future wars on the web site in the Galleries. And a few photos of our stuff… worth a look if nothing else. I shall be hunting down The Zone books… cheers Iceaxe

Roy

hammerwargames.co.uk

Roy – email me
Geoff

Actually this would be great for AK47 Republic (minor changes to the flow charts and name generator). I think I may go down this road.

I thought that i had read somewhere that one of teh HInds was real, brought back from Central America, and the others were mods. I also seem to recall that you could tell by their windshields.
I can confirm that the FBI followed the production crew around, as a friends uncle was on that detail (he mentioned it to us a couple of years back when he saw us watching the movie. Passed away from throat cancer 3 years ago). They apparently were more worried about the Shilka than the tanks.

I've actually been thinking of playing TW2k again, or something similar, maybe a Nuts!/FNG/CR2.0 skirmish game, set either in Europe or the US. (I always did like the idea of Germany trying to invade the US in WW2, as impossible as it would have been…)
I think that perhaps I should get to writting.

"I always did like the idea of Germany trying to invade the US in WW2, as impossible as it would have been…"

I've been contemplating a late war invasion by/from Mexico, under the assumption that Germany tried the trick from WWI again, and managed to find a sympathetic governor or similar. Given the condition of US highways at the time (pre-Ike), a few key railroad objectives would allow the German-supplied Mexican forces to run rampant over the Southwest. If you posit that Axis intelligence had turned up evidence of the US nuke program and a couple likely locations, the campaign takes a pretty clear form in the deserts of the southwest, including possible end-run strikes towards "glamour targets" like California's Central Valley and/or Los Angeles. Fun terrain, and a couple good battles that would have Allen digging up Axis artifacts in his backyard today…

A played a similar scenario after seeing the movie- but I used my own highschool and 1/72 moderns (I made the building out of lego lol).