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"what if CSN ironclads at New Orleans" Topic


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34 hits since 17 Sep 2026
©1994-2026 Bill Armintrout
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Personal logo doc mcb Supporting Member of TMP17 Sep 2026 5:13 p.m. PST

I asked GROK how many ARKANSAS class could be ready if the resources going into LOUISIANA and MISSISSIPPI were redirected?

The binding constraints are iron, engines, and calendar—not displacement on paper. On those measures you do not get a swarm of Arkansas boats. You get a small, finished squadron.

Size of the resource pile


Louisiana + Mississippi (historical)One Arkansas-classLength × beam264'×62' and ~260'×58'165'×35'Designed displacement~1,400 t each~800–1,200 tCasemateAlmost full-length, sloped; Louisiana two courses of T-railShort box; one course of T-rail (stern often just boiler plate)MachineryLouisiana: tandem center wheels + steering screws. Mississippi: 16 boilers, 3 engines, 3 screws2 riverboat-scale engines, 4–6 boilers, 2 screwsContract / costExperimental one-offs; Louisiana later spoken of as ~$1 million all-in$76,920 each (Shirley contract, Aug 1861)Laid downMid-October 1861October 1861 at MemphisState on 24 Apr 1862Both unfinishedArkansas launched, not battle-ready; sister Tennessee still on the stocks

Hull footprint of one New Orleans monster is about 2.5–3× an Arkansas. The iron bill is worse than that: Louisiana was meant for two layers over a casemate the length of a city block. Arkansas wore a single layer of T-rail on a short box, and Brown still ran out and faked the stern with boiler plate.

The Mississippi plant is the other sink. Patterson Iron Works spent the winter on a triple-screw installation that had never been built in the South. That same shop, left alone, can rebuild two or three ordinary riverboat engine sets in the time it burned on one exotic one.

Memphis is the control experiment: same design, same six-month window, same iron famine. Shirley was contracted for two Arkansas boats in August 1861, due Christmas. By April he had one launched hull and one incomplete sister. Isaac Brown then needed five more weeks at Yazoo City to make Arkansas fight. New Orleans has more foundries and more carpenters than Fort Pickering—but it is also building Manassas, conversions, and competing with the army for every bar of railroad iron.

How many by Farragut?

Assume the decision is made when the historical contracts were let (October 1861), same Jefferson City / Algiers slips, same Leeds–Patterson–Murray labor pool, no Tredegar plate coming down the railroad.

Honest count for 24 April 1862

2 completed to "Brown standard" — T-rail on the casemate sides and faces, ram fitted, guns in, able to steam and steer. Stern and pilothouse still weak. This is what Arkansas actually was in July, pulled forward six weeks because you never moved the yard.

A 3rd launched and fitting out — hull and engines in, armor incomplete, maybe 4 of 10 guns. Usable as a floating battery or a clumsy ram, not as a fleet unit.

A 4th only if you cheat the calendar — keel laid in August with the Memphis contracts, or you strip rails off a Louisiana railroad the way Mallory later did in Virginia. Even then she is not fully plated.

So the wargame number is two fighting Arkansas-class ironclads plus one incomplete, not four or five.

Three finished warships is the optimistic house rule: Mallory kills the Tift "build it like a house" experiment on day one, Murray builds to Porter's Memphis plans, and New Orleans foundries are forbidden to touch the triple-screw fantasy. That is a significant what-if, but it is still only one extra hull.

Four combat-ready boats by April is fantasy. The Confederacy never completed ironclads at that density anywhere in 1861–62.

Why two-and-a-half is still a different war

Two nimble 165-foot rams with 8–10 guns and a real ram bow are worth more in the pass than one 264-foot barge that cannot steer. They can work with Manassas and the cottonclads instead of sitting moored above St. Philip.

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