"News about The Sword and the Flame" Topic

Christy Brom has asked that I post this statement from her concerning the current status of "The Sword and the Flame."

I have had my share of "trials and tribulations" many times these past three years and I'm slowly getting back on track thanks to a strong core of gamers who my family and I have known for nearly fifty years. No need to name them, they know WHO I am talking about. Thank you, gentlemen!!!

The 40+ anniversary edition of TSATF is progressing well, thanks to a devoted group of six gamers that my sister, Lori, pulled together for the task before her death. She talked to some via email about what she wanted done and they are complying with her wishes. The cover will be tweaked a bit, nothing drastic. We both thought, why change something that is so well recognized to this day. There will be a Contents page, Dedication, Memorials, Foreword, Afterword, Errata and Updates, Commentary from some of the original TSATF play testers, photos, etc. We're looking into t-shirts with TSATF/1979, TSATF/20th and the anniversary edition printed on the front, not together, an individual shirt for each cover and tote bags.

In addition, there are plans for some new variants including one about Dad's ancestor, Trooper Robert James Kincade. Trooper Kincade was one of a few survivors from the Battle at Isandlwana in 1879. He was with the Natal Mounted Police. Dad's cousin, Jeff Kincaid from Wisconsin, just happened to mention it on a visit down here a while ago and Dad went off like a rocket. We didn't know about this. Jeff laughed and said he thought that was the reason Dad wrote "The Sword and The Flame" to begin with.

Lori and I talked about another variant that we will need contributions from the wargaming community to accomplish. This one was mainly her idea and it's a good one. It'll also be a lot of fun!

Submitted by Jim Pitts

That's good news!

Yes, thanks for passing on the update.

I'll let B B King speak for me.
YouTube link

I knew what it was before I clicked on the link.

Good news indeed!

Hey John….BB is speaking for me also….

I wish her well, but what I find disappointing is that not once in any of her second party statements has she acknowledged the gamers who lost their money, and if there are any plans to make it right. I think most people would be satisfied with, "Hey guys, I was mentally and financially in a bad place, and I spent all of the money on food and rent. I ask for your forgiveness as we move forward with this project." Instead, there has been complete silence on the subject. Has anyone from this core group of gamers counselled her to address the elephant in the room, or does she consider the matter to be unimportant.

Nicely put, 79th.

79thPA: +1

This brings out the cynicism that I try so hard to hide. 🙄 (I probably fail at that…)
Nothing in the "News" suggests anything new or exciting.

The chance that people could lose money on a failed investment is why I never tried a kickstarter.
Good luck to TSATF

Ditto TimePortal
When I want to pay for something is when it's available. Not before.

I was one who did the pre-order. Not because I wanted to be part of a kickstarter, but because Lori had been screwed over by a gamer who placed a large order and then claimed he didn't get it. She was out the cost of the order at a time when she could not afford the loss.

Lori needed help and several of us stepped up. My personal situation is such that I can easily afford the loss and, no matter the outcome I do not regret my decision.

Well, you're a better man than I am.

One question I have will there be enough of a difference in the rules as we know them to warrant all this attention and drama? IMO, this constant updating and giving the impression that it's close to publication is becoming very tiresome without a firm commitment.

@Long Valley Gamer

There will be a Contents page, Dedication, Memorials, Foreword, Afterword, Errata and Updates, Commentary from some of the original TSATF play testers, photos, etc. We're looking into t-shirts with TSATF/1979, TSATF/20th and the anniversary edition printed on the front, not together, an individual shirt for each cover and tote bags.

There will be swag. As for the rules themselves… 🤷 That seems to be uncertain.

Glad to hear it; I preordered way back when and assume that money is long gone. Other than perhaps token acknowledgment for those who did so, at this point all I want to see is a successful launch of the 40+ Anniversary edition. The family has suffered more than enough.

I gotta admit that I am still surprised that they don't have a pdf option. Easy to prepare and sell. You could even give a free copy to those who previously paid earning a LOT of good will. Cash in hand pretty quickly then a Print on Demand option. Easy peasey and win win!

But what do I know.

Thanks.

John

Well… something would be better than nothing. Without some sort of official publication, the black market copies and variants will only proliferate and the core rules will languish until a copyright expires.

Pardon my ignorance about publishing but why would there be a need for an errata? Wouldn't the errors be fixed in the pertinent text in the book?

Taking the most charitable possible interpretation--as many will tell you, not my usual approach--perhaps the errata would cover the original and 20th Anniversary editions? Or the rules themselves have already been printed?

[PARAGRAPH OF LESS CHARITABLE SPECULATION DELETED.]

WRG rules would wait until at least a month before publishing "errata" for "the most heavily playtested rules ever."
But errata for rules that haven't even been published yet? 🤷🙄

John, you have to admit that normally you have to wait months for the errata, and now you'll have it from "go."

Col Campbell, I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say that no one really wants to hear how great it's going to be. We want to know WHEN it's going to be.

Within my lifetime would be nice.

piper909, my understanding of the Mickey Mouse Copyright Extension Act is that TSATF will enter the public domain in 2085. At the present rate of progress, that might be our best shot. (Unless Disney pays congress to extend it further, of course. Don't bet against that. Remember that in the absence of copyright extension, Disney could be reduced to making movies people want to see.)

Hey Robert P. --
I have to think there's some clause in US copyright law about games/publications that go out of print that lets someone (original designer?) reclaim the rights -- Steve Jackson successfully reclaimed rights to The Fantasy Trip RPG materials in court by such a strategy. Metagaming is long defunct, and the game long OP. Now TS&TF would be different because the original designer is deceased. But would the rights legally devolve to heirs? Or heirs of heirs? There must be some constraints to that, or nothing would ever go into public domain.

This is all a job and money-making scheme for lawyers.

The copyright automatically passes to the estate or heirs of the deceased author. It takes many decades for a work to go into public domain. We will all be long gone, as will most of our children.

"This is all a job and money-making scheme for lawyers."

The lawyers get their cut, but it's actually a money-making scheme for Hollywood studios living on "content" and "intellectual property" a generation or more old, aided and abetted by authors eliminating competition. Something like 80% of everything ever published in English is out of print--but still under copyright. This is how and why the Google Settlement crashed and burned.

Let's be real here. Just how much money is there to be had with a 40+th anniversary issue? What will it sell for?
Who is the market? "The Men Who Would Be Kings" is a fine set of colonial rules from Osprey for less than $20. USD
I'm perfectly happy with my 20th. Nothing in the past few years has convinced me that I need to upgrade. This isn't Warhammer where I MUST upgrade to the latest edition.

This is really much ado about nothing.

Lawyers? It would just waste their time, and your money.
How much would it cost to litigate a tenuous copyright/intellectual property dispute?
How many rules out there are "cousins" of other rules?

I'll tell you what MIGHT interest me in the ever just out of reach "40"th edition.
Adaptations for other periods, like FIW, AWI, etc.
A while back, there was that possibility, but that seems to have gone away. Nothing in the OP's first paragraph hints at anything remotely similar. 🤷
So, as a certified card carrying Okd Timer, I don't see anything here very interesting. Just a lot of congratulations.

John the OFM, much of what you say is spot on. However, the only reason it matters is that many of us, I for one, already plopped down our cash for the 40th edition (and in my case, another $100 USD or so in an order for variants that was never fulfilled). So, while the world goes on, I certainly would like to see and own the final product.