"US Army Rank ..." Topic

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That was interesting

Always a fan of "where did this come from" history. It ties us to our cultural heritage. I do find it funny that the ranks and organizational terms used in the UK and US tend to overwhelmingly come from…..the French usage of those terms…:^))

But I think he might be wrong on the origin of "private." Especially since it is most likely the only term of rank that does not come from common French usage: some research I've found was that it was mostly used as "private gentlemen" from ECW (or earlier) usage referring to men of modest means, paying for their own kit, but serving as a non-commissioned, non-leadership role soldier.

Still neat information, though. Thanks Legion.

I thought that the explanation for "major" being derived from "sergeant major" was wrong and was confused with the derivation of "major general" from "sergeant major general", which explains why a major general is a lower rank than a lieutenant general.

The major general began in 1557 as a "serjeant major" listed below the lieutenant (general) on the staff of the captain general of footmen, and had the same position in 1588. In 1598 he is on the staff of the army commander
By 1620 he had become the "serjeant major general", possibly to stop him from being confused with the serjeant major who now served with each regiment of foot. A serjeant major general is in the army that Charles I sent against the Scots in 1639, by the 1640s the "sergeant" has been dropped and the title is major general.

Major – In 1620 a commissioned "serjeant major" served in each regiment of foot, and this rank carried on through the English Civil War in in the foot, horse and dragoons. By 1660 the "serjeant" had been almost universally dropped, and the rank was "major" (the irritating exception is a grant of arms on 27th May 1672 to "Serjeant-Major John Miller of his Majesties [sic] Coldstreamer [sic] regiment of Foot Guards").

In 1886 Lieutenant F. J. Davies of the Grenadier Guards published a slim book "The Sergeant Major; The Origin and History of his Rank, with notes on military customs and habits of former times."
Davis begins with the sergeant major general, then tracks sergeant majors who were the field officers and became "majors".
"The first mention I can find of any non-commissioned officer holding the rank of Sergeant-major is in an Order issued to the Brigade of Guards in 1724: "The three Regiments of Foot Guards are to furnish a detachment of 100 men as often as due notice is given, under command of a Lieutenant-Colonel, a Captain, an Ensign, an Adjutant, and a Sergeant-major, as Guards for the balls and operas at the King's Theatre in the Haymarket, and to be aiding and assisting in the preservation of the peace, and preventing all manner of profaneness, rudeness, drunkenness, or indecencies, and not to permit any person whatever to enter the said theatre in habits worn by the clergy." Dated 18th January, 1724-5."
the intention of the order may have been to preserve the peace when members of the Royal Family visited the theatre, and sergeant majors may have been included because they had a secondary role as "marshals of the court". Ballets were added to the list in 1725.

If anyone has apre-1724 reference to a non-commissioned sergeant major please let me know!

I always assumed "major" started as "captain major", or the senior captain.

Thank you, John

No, he was a completely separate rank – the officer's ranks in the British cavalry and infantry were:
cornet (cavalry) or ensign (infantry, except fusiliers and rifles, who had second lieutenants until 1854), lieutenant (first lieutenant in the fusiliers until 1854 except the Royal Fusiliers (who stopped having second lieutenants shortly after they were raised and had two lieutenants in each company)), captain-lieutenant (who commanded the colonel's troop or company (without the help of a lieutenant), he got a lieutenant's pay, but addressed as "captain" and when he became a captain his seniority was taken from the date he became captain lieutenant. It was not a required step – a lieutenant could be promoted to captain without becoming captain lieutenant, the rank was abolished in 1803), captain, major, lieutenant colonel, colonel.

And then or course there is Corporal of Horse, which for some reason the Guards cavalry have retained to mean what other regiments call a Sergeant because – as I have been told – the term sergeant originally meant a servant, and God knows all the Guards regiments are above being mere servants

Regiments of Horse (not just the household cavalry) never had sergeants (I have doubts about the story that this was because of the "servant" origin of the rank). Dragoons and horse grenadiers (who were part of the household cavalry) had sergeants and corporals. When all the regiments of horse except the Royal Horse Guards (The Blues) were converted to Dragoon Guards in 1746 and 1788 they got sergeants.

Originally the Horse Guards didn't have NCOs – all the officers were commissioned. 1756 His Majesty appointed the four senior right-hand men of each troop of Horse Guards warrant officers with the title of quarter-masters, and the four junior right-hand men corporals of horse (ranking as sergeants).

The Life Guards were raised in 1788, replacing the troops of Horse Guards. The rank of corporal of horse disappeared. The Royal Horse Guards became part of the household cavalry in 1820.

Household cavalry corporals ranked as sergeants in the army. In 1878 all were promoted to the new rank of Corporal of Horse and a new rank of corporal (equal to corporals in the army) was added.

"By long established custom all full Corporals within the Household division are, from the time of their promotion to the rank of Corporal, appointed Lance Corporal of Horse or Lance Sergeant" (Queen's Regulations 1975).

The long established custom goes back for the foot guards to some time after 1897 (a bandsman was promoted to corporal in 1897 and lance-sergeant in 1898. Long Service and Good Conduct Medal roll 1914 shows only one Guards cpl who was also listed as lance sgt, by 1946-8 Palestine clasp roll Irish Guards only had l/cpl and l/sgt.

The long established custom of the lance corporal of horse goes back to 1971, giving them parity with the foot guards.

The Horse Guards had some wonderfully odd ranks – my favourite are the exempt (pronounced "exon") and captain and the sub-brigadier.

The Royal Artillery had "lieutenants and fireworkers", a commissioned rank junior to second lieutenants, until 1771 and Matrosses, assistant gunners, who became gunners in 1783.

And from 1871 to 1876 the junior commissioned rank in the British Army was sub-lieutenant, not second lieutenant.