"Haupt. Zoller on the outskirts of Stalingrad" Topic

Played the second battle of my campaign with my motorized german company led by Hauptman Zoller.
Found here: link

If that link gives you problems try this more generic link:
platoonforward.blogspot.com

Enjoy

Joe

"Very rare for me to play with the same unit a consecutive time…"
I don't know how to say this, but…. I think I'm developing feelings for you Joe ;). I very much appreciate you sticking with one unit for a bit and letting things develop.

On a serious note, wow man, no kidding, that was one of the best batreps I've ever read! I knew it was gonna be good when you busted out the LOD! ;)

It really felt like a company-level fight with all the pushing and shoving, platoons getting chewed up and having to fall back and regroup, flopping the main effort from one platoon/flank to another, the CO having to stick his nose in to help get things straightened out, detaching a squad and an AFV to lock down a sector in an economy of force action. Absolutely awesome man, and then the aggressive young NCO getting out past his appropriate phase line and getting lucky to not eat some of his own supporting fires!

It's funny (and I'm sure we've talked about this before), but when playing solo it feels like the losses actually give us better stories and character development. Super cool man, I'm really looking forward to the next one.

V/R,
Jack

Thanks for the kind words. I am taking after you and using more pictures. I do think it makes it more interesting.
It really did feel like a company level fight!
What I am doing is each leader gets a card. Good leaders get a second card therefore should be able to activate sooner. Bad leaders get a command confusion card so they go last.
Agree the losses certainly build character.
Sorry but the next post is Capt LaDuc 1997! I really did try for a third fight with Zoller but AK 47 came out and I got distracted again!

Cheers
Joe

Joe,

Thanks for replying, I wasn't getting worried I'd scared everyone off from replying. Next time I'll keep my silly jokes to myself…

"I am taking after you and using more pictures. I do think it makes it more interesting."
And here I am thinking about reducing the amount of photos because it's taking me too long to write stuff up! ;) I've played four games the past two weeks and uploaded all the photos but not found time to write and post. In any case, I think you've hit the sweet spot with regards to the amount of photos (whereas I tend to have too many, trying to document every single little thing).

"It really did feel like a company level fight!"
Excellent! It certainly read that way.

"What I am doing is each leader gets a card. Good leaders get a second card therefore should be able to activate sooner. Bad leaders get a command confusion card so they go last."
Very interesting. One thing I've been curious about; it's been hard for me to figure out your basing scheme. You've got 4-man bases, 4-man bases with only two men on them, two-man bases, and multiple singly based troops represented. If you don't mind, what does a full platoon consist of?

"Agree the losses certainly build character."

"Sorry but the next post is Capt LaDuc 1997! I really did try for a third fight with Zoller but AK 47 came out and I got distracted again!"
You're killing me! But not really, as I certainly enjoy me some French Foreign Legion!

I've had a few distractions of late: you've seen the Bolt Action games and the brigade-level fight I posted, and I also tried some squad-level stuff with Brit Airborne in Normandy, and then a platoon-level fight following a US rifle platoon in southern France (platoon-level rules are the ones I just cannot seem to figure out), but I think I've finally got my groove back; I played a company-level game with my (infamous) "Kampfgruppe Klink," starting up Operation Barbarossa, and it was a blast! I'm poised and ready to go on a tear and rip off 15 to 20 fights with them. Assuming I don't get distracted ;)

V/R,
Jack

Jack, no worries about the joke. I thought it was funny. My delay in reply was because I kept thinking about my reply.
Basing for PBI is normally 3 stands of 3 figures each. Way too many figures for me! So normally I have 3 stands per squad with 2 figures per stand but as you see I will use what I have. I have some old stands with 3 figures already based so they still count as a base. To further confuse things squads with more than 10 men will get a 4th base occasionally while squads with less will only have 2. ( Panzergrenadier platoons have 1 squad with only 2 bases. ) Clear as mud? Look at the picture of the company before the game; that is their TO&E.
Would be good to see Klink again. 15mm?
Still have your boys involved?

Cheers

Joe

Joe,

"Clear as mud?"
Yes, it is ;)

"Look at the picture of the company before the game; that is their TO&E."
I did! But with your explanation of platoons/squads below T/O it makes sense. It's interesting to me that you get that detailed playing company-level fights; bravo! I'm much lazier, simply go with 1 base = 1 squad.

"Would be good to see Klink again."
I certainly hope so.

"15mm?"
Yup. I thought about trying it with 28mm, but I'm having a bit of a crisis with my 28mm stuff, it all feels too big…

"Still have your boys involved?"
Negative, back to my old solo ways. School's back in session, as well as baseball (younger) and JROTC (older), and the little bit of free time they have they prefer to spend on video games…

In any case, so on to the Legion with AK-47. How are the rules different from PBI? And why go away from your Piquet/PBI mix that seems to be working so well?

V/R,
Jack

Jack,
I was sceptical about three bases per squad for a company game myself but other than needing figures it works well. The two advantages are: incremental losses are easy to model so a "disrupted" type of result is no longer needed; just pinned or okay. And using just a platoon or two works just as well as a whole company. Plenty of toys on the table.

Hopefully you'll get the boys back to the table next summer. You still have baseball. Just went to a nationals game with my son last week. Hope your daughter is enjoying school.

How are the rules different from PBI? Wow that would take a couple of paragraphs but it boils down to activation. I still use PBI for everything but armor. I went away from the piquet/PBI to activating by leader because a friend named Jack was trying to figure out how to activate his units by leader and I had an idea I wanted to try out. Turns out it works! You can model the quality of the leaders with different cards and really replicate the OODA loop. I can give you the specifics of the cards via email if you want. As to how I am integrating them with PBI I can answer that with a separate message here.
I am not sure I like activation by leader better than the piquet way. It is easier to model hesitation with the separate action cards ( piquet) because then the leader doesn't do that action. If you activate by leader you just lessen his action points or have to decide what he doesn't do. The other thing I like about the piquet way is the uncertainty of the order of the sequences. Is the squad going to move before they fire? The downside is the piquet way is a bit slower.
As you can see both activation systems work well with PBI, not sure which one I like more.

Longer answer than you wanted.

Joe

Part II. How does my sequences integrate with PBI. In PBI one side picks their units in any sequence, rolls their action points and executes actions. Nice, orderly and fair. I actually like the way platoons roll up their APs. There is a nod to officers. But … Way to orderly for my taste and hard to model the OODA loop and much less flair for the dramatic.

With cards to activate leaders when the leader's card is drawn his platoon activates per PBI. I add one card for armor activation as it is extremely hard to coordinate armor and infantry. You can increase/decrease odds of a leader going first through additional cards or command confusion. All other rules per PBI.

The piquet way the various phases are all all the cards and each side has its own deck. Exceptional good/bad leaders also get a card. When that phase card come up for your side you perform that action. I roll a D 6 to determine how many action points each unit has. If your leader card comes up you get to perform one additional action for free ( OODA loop again) or you miss the next phase that you would normally perform. ( Remember 2nd platoon missed moving into the train station 2 battles ago? Yup, bad time for the CC card move card combo.). If the leaders card comes up before the CC card ( 50%chance) there will be no confusion this turn. Company commander issues orders before the turn. If you don't have a new order follow the last one. If you want to go off script I use AKOT.

Another long post but hope that gives you the overview at least.

Joe

Joe,

"Longer answer than you wanted."
Not a chance, I appreciate you taking the time to explain.

"I was sceptical about three bases per squad for a company game myself but other than needing figures it works well. The two advantages are: incremental losses are easy to model…"
Yeah, sounds like a LOT of bases and figures, I'd have to re-base a bunch of stuff to give that a shot. Or go with three Flames of War-style bases, but that would make the unit footprints huge with a company on the table. Something for me to ponder…

"Hopefully you'll get the boys back to the table next summer. You still have baseball. Just went to a nationals game with my son last week. Hope your daughter is enjoying school."
Yes, the boys and I will absolutely get back to the table again, and she's doing great, home again this weekend so I'm getting to enjoy some time with her.

"I went away from the piquet/PBI to activating by leader because a friend named Jack was trying to figure out how to activate his units by leader and I had an idea I wanted to try out. Turns out it works!"
Wow, he sounds rather debonair and, dare I say, brilliant? And look at you, talking about the OODA loop, like a REAL military man ;) Must've heard me rambling about it previously (yes, it's a joke, and yes, I'm aware the OODA loop concept actually originated from pilots)
;)

"In PBI one side picks their units in any sequence, rolls their action points and executes actions. Nice, orderly and fair. I actually like the way platoons roll up their APs. There is a nod to officers. But … Way to orderly for my taste and hard to model the OODA loop and much less flair for the dramatic."
I'm with ya!

"The piquet way the various phases are all all the cards and each side has its own deck. Exceptional good/bad leaders also get a card. When that phase card come up for your side you perform that action. I roll a D 6 to determine how many action points each unit has."
Wow man, that's quite an involved system you've blended/evolved into, very impressive. Sounds like you kept flipping the Rubiks Cube until you got exactly what you were looking for.

I tried Piquet once, albeit in a Napoleonic setting as opposed to a WWII (or later) one, but it didn't resonate with me as, for me, "getting inside (the enemy's) OODA loop has to do with the pace of your operations, but the card phases effectively slowed my own OODA loop. Again, it's all about ‘feel,' which is entirely subjective, so what didn't ring my bell could absolutely do great for someone else, and I am still interested in giving Field of Battle WWII a shot, based off of many excellent batreps by my buddy Darren.

You've definitely given me a lot to think about, thanks for sharing your methods and thoughts.

V/R,
Jack

Jack,
Glad you have heard of the OODA loop and it's origins. Guess Air Force Colonels are pretty smart. : )
You provided a great description of Piquet. It is great in theory but can drag in practice. The secret is to not have too many cards in the deck and to have both sides drawing cards. ( Brent has figured this out as well). Piquet normally has a deck of 25 ish cards. I limit the deck to 10 cards; 7 or 8 if there is not armor or artillery. Plays faster so your OODA loop doesn't drag! : )

I enjoy the discussion!

Joe

Joe,

"Glad you have heard of the OODA loop and its origins."
Yuk-yuk. Strangel enough, we are taught quite a bit about the conduct of warfare ;)

"Guess Air Force Colonels are pretty smart. : )"
Well, OODA was developed back when it was still ‘Air Corps,' not Air Force. Probably the last time a pilot brought something useful to the table ;)

"You provided a great description of Piquet. It is great in theory but can drag in practice. The secret is to not have too many cards in the deck and to have both sides drawing cards. ( Brent has figured this out as well). Piquet normally has a deck of 25 ish cards. I limit the deck to 10 cards; 7 or 8 if there is not armor or artillery. Plays faster so your OODA loop doesn't drag! : )"
Indeed, I need to give it another shot, most likely under the FOB WWII guise, which I bought a few years ago but still haven't tried…

"I enjoy the discussion!"
Me too, always good to knock the rust off my dilapidated brain-housing group, and certainly nothing is rather be talking about.

V/R,
Jack