"Dr Who - current series" Topic

Doctor Who is having a sensational season despite the naysayers. Essentially, it's gotten weird and wacky, which is Doctor Who at its best, but I worry that there are clouds on the horizon.

As good as things have been, the show would be even better if it trusted the audience to understand the moral lessons.

For example, in one episode the Doctor, who portrays himself as standing up for ordinary people, slams ‘cowards weaponising lies' for ‘taking people's insecurities and fears and making it currency'.

The speech itself does leave something to be desired in that it directly addresses the viewer, rather than conveying the message via action and dialogue.

It's a cardinal rule of drama to 'show not tell' & frequently banging the point over the audience's head is by definition, inferior drama/writing.

OK, sometimes it is needed, but it's generally best to let the context do the talking.

I too am enjoying this series.
Of course this is very subjective.
Thus, no definitive answer. Just opinion.
The fact that it is now a co operative venture ight be important?

martin

When "the message" is more important than the story it never ends well.

I'd hardly think the plot is more important than the theme in *any* form of literature, my dear Colonel.

I'm concerned at the WAY the theme is being advanced.

The Doctor has always been on the side of good, and a champion against hate, injustice, cruelty and lies.

Otherwise the show would be Dr Davros and we'd be rooting for another Dalek victory as humanity is slowly ground into dust.

It is kind of what the show is about.

20th Maine.

I stress I am in full agreement with the socio=political messages of the series, just not the "ram it down your throat" delivery of them.

+1 20thmaine

The older series made their points subtly and skillfully. The last several hit you over the head with a hammer and are awash in UK "wokeness."

+1 Shagnasty

This current series is for me a stronger one so far.

We do not live in a subtle age. Positions are shouted on social media. There is little nuance. Disagreements quickly become toxic.
Messaging can be clumsy at times and I agree about trusting the audience.

Its not new but we forget…

Sarah Jane lecturing the Queen of Peladon on "Womens Lib" was certainly not subtle.

"When "the message" is more important than the story it never ends well."

Isn't that the definition of the ultra modern tat?

"I'm concerned at the WAY the theme is being advanced."

And the typical reaction.

"humanity is slowly ground into dust.

It is kind of what the show is about."

Cheeky edit, but it pretty well sums it up.

"I stress I am in full agreement with the socio=political messages of the series, just not the "ram it down your throat" delivery of them."

I'm not going there. But thanks the admission.

"The last several hit you over the head with a hammer and are awash in UK "wokeness."

Just thought it may need repeating for some.

"+1 Shagnasty"

Hang on, like what?

"Sarah Jane lecturing the Queen of Peladon on "Womens Lib" was certainly not subtle."

Well said, but if it's so easy to identify an erroneous exception, why make it the rule?

It seems to suggest, the BBC made a booboo years ago, so now they open a gentlemen's club. Although I use that term loosely in this case.

Well, it's a UK show and it reflects UK values. A lot of the things you don't like the majority of people in the UK are just fine with. Dr Who just reflects the tolerant and inclusive society that makes the TV show.

"Well, it's a UK show and it reflects UK values."

How does one get to this conclusion, if one is not looking at ratings? Tea leaves?

"A lot of the things you don't like the majority of people in the UK are just fine with."

Again, how does one arrive at this conclusion? Perhaps just projecting one's own views on an entire country?

"Dr Who just reflects the tolerant and inclusive society that makes the TV show."

Again. What? Do we need to pull out the history books? Heck they make tv shows about what Britain's done.

Well, it's a UK show and it reflects UK values.

How does one get to this conclusion

I know this because the BBC make it and have done for over 60 years. It's as British as universal tolerance.

How are the ratings? Always good judge of how well a product is selling.

"It's as British as universal tolerance."

Sounds like something a stereotypical English chap may say while reloading after shooting a "pesky native".

Not very tolerant of other countries movements either, Germany for instance.

But, yes, the ratings are low.

What a popular show.

PS

I'm also reminded of a couple of kids, 10 years old, who killed a younger boy with a brick.

The doco showed the footage of the tolerant British mob around the court demanding the police bring the boys out.

Tolerant British public also sent the parents death threats, causing them to have new names and move.

As adults the boys have different names and one has now been moved to Australia for his own safety.

How tolerant of them.

If I'm reading the comments correctly, the debate seems to be on how the "message", whatever it may be, is delivered. I prefer the method of a man I consider the master, Mark Gruenwald. For those who don't know, Mark was a comic book writer. He is most known for writing the Squadron Supreme 12 issue min- series and the story arc of the Captain America comic that introduced the John Walker version of Captain America, that is getting attention currently due to the movie "Thunderbolts*". Gruenwald would essentially write a story that spawned a lot of debate, ask you your opinion, and just soak in your answer. He wouldn't give you feedback on your answer, but you could tell he gave it consideration. I got to meet him and this happened to me. He didn't force his opinion down your throat, he, at least to me, seemed more interested in what I thought about what he wrote. If you want to compare what was shown on TV and what the comic presented, I encourage you to seek out the comics or available reprints. The John Walker we see in the tv shows and movies today gets off easy compared to the John Walker in the comics. Gruenwald was a legend and really made you think on social issues

"a man I consider the master,"

Took me a second.

"He didn't force his opinion down your throat"

What is it with people's interest here?

Not sure what comics has to do with it. However we do need more Quarks.
,
I'm not sure it's the delivery of the message (modern brainwashing), but rather that it's there at all.

Case in point, suffering call the midwife. They have a disabled woman you can't understand, even give her a monologue, no subtitles in sight. I guess it's considered discrimination to not understand disabled people these days? Rediculus. Let's not mention the nurse who's shot at and doesn't flinch. Plenty of gripes with that show. I don't think the first season or two was as bad, probably had a change in staff.

So, if I catch your drift, you're saying that the UK is less tolerant than other countries on a range of social issues and presumably that means the Dr should ramp up the messaging in order to better publicise a tolerant progressive approach to life.

Got it.

Actually, from the sarcasm, I do believe you do.

Doesn't explain why you'd write such a thing.

To quote a fellow TMPer, "you do you."