"Well, I finally did it ... Terminator" Topic

Watched The Terminator to Soldier followed by demon with a glass hand.

Spot on.

Some interesting points:

You can see where (presumably) Cameron is bored with the slow bits, so has people run around instead.

Some really funny line ups (apart from everything else). Probably on purpose. Struggling to remember them now… Oh, yes. When you line up random scenes, al la the algorithm, "there is nothing wrong with your television, do not try to adjust the picture…" I'll let you guess that bit in the movie. And the Twilight zone wavy lines appear in the film, the bunker kiddy fence, the guns under the mattress frame, lightning I think too.

Soldier ends with the arm fixing bit. Demon starts with the next scene, watching Kyle's interagation.

The outer limits titles seem to play their part, however, demon runs over about the same, so I may try it at some point, skipping the titles.

Lots of eyes, red eyes, black eyes.

Ellison was certainly onto something, although he seemed to think it more based on soldier, despite it playing to both chronologically.

Then again all films seem to match others, so it's certainly not a unique situation. Or is it? Following two shows stuck together seems odd. I guess Ellison used the same algorithm for them to begin with.

The research continues…

Sorry I have no idea what you are talking about.

I'll clarify.

When James Cameron was making the terminator film, he gave an interview in which he said he just ripped off a couple of Harlan Ellison outer limits episodes.

People though it like soldier(?) and demon with a glass hand.

Word of this got to Ellison who tried to get tickets to preview screenings, but was denied by Orion pictures.

Ellison snuck in as, I think it was lenard Maltons, assistant.

Upon seeing the film Ellison thought it more like soldier than demon with a glass hand.

He sued Orion. Since then all copies have "acknowledging the works of Harlan Ellison", plus he got some money.

James Cameron always denied that he ripped off the episodes.

Upon viewing the terminator on one tv, and soldier followed by demon with a glass hand on an adjacent tv, they are perfectly in sink.

Although I suspect they are all just based on another text I am yet to discover, possibly including the resurrection of Christ? Hamlet also springs to mind. But it's something I'll have to get to.

As far as more similarities.

At times outer limits mentioned ideal soldier, born to kill, or such like, and Arny is on the screen as the terminator.

So much is the same but opposite.

The bad terminator going into the good guys base and fighting them all where a woman is held captive. V, the good guy going into the bad guys base and fighting them where a woman is not held captive.

All that soldier stuff at the start is so similar to the terminator with the lasers and ruins.

When when quarlos(?) gets his helmet knocked off and has ear pains from the noise, after time traveling, lines up with Kyle suffering in pain after time traveling.

The good family has a cat in soldier. In the terminator it's a lizard. In demon it's…a computer hand?

Of course (spoiler) the guy in demon ends up being revealed as a robot. Hmm… sounds familiar.

Its also like the terminator/Kyle are going through the phone book looking for Sarah, like collecting the fingers in demon, looking for the truth. Both trying to find humanity.

Demon mentioned only 2 can come through the time mirror at once, just like the terminator having 2 come through.

Its endless.

Its Hamlet, or perhaps an even earlier text they are all based on.

Key similarities:

A single ding of a bell in Hamlet lines up with the music change to include the famous metallic ding in the titles.

Roman streets and someone murmering v city alley with the bum murmering.

Lovey Dovey v lovey Dovey.

So much.

Pretty obvious soldier and demon will follow it too, but I'll check anyway.

You can say that's perhaps the reason for the similarity, however, scenes do seem to be direct rip offs. The start of soldier is hard to ignore.

Other things of note are extra characters:

The janitor in the terminators building, (the clown in Hamlet) the women in demon was a cleaner, if memory serves.

Two cops in terminator, the cop and linguistic guy in soldier. I think both pairs even share cigarettes?

At the end of all three shows, and mid terminator with him removing his eye and Kyle's interagation, it's all over and there is information proven that you can't go back from. Possibly Hamlet to, hmm… Should read the end.

And that's a point terminator does not go to the end, but Hamlet probably just folds and reads backwards from that point.

Fun times.

Ok. Now it's getting interesting.

Just watched the first one hour Twilight zone, in his image. (You can see where this is going)

Spoilers.

A guy has head pains amid flashing lights… Wait, there's more.

Acting otherwise normal, he snaps and throws a woman in front of a train like it's nothing.

He just met a chick and want to marry her.

They drive to his home town, but it's like he went 20 years in the future as it's different. They go to his house, but there's a man there who he doesn't know. Also, he and his family never existed.

He snaps again and tells the girl to run and drive home, as he's about to kill her. Another driver hits him…

…cutting his wrist, which he pull the skin away to reveal wires and springs.

He goes to the house of the name replacing his family's. Its him, his creator who looks identical. Two others are on a slab. Failures.

They fight.

One turns up at the girls home.

The robot is dead in the lab.

The end.

Obviously the arm situation grabbed by attention. It looks basically identical to Arny's arm, less some mussel.

That's also the same point we first see the terminators robotics, maybe the eye came first? But it's all about the same point in the movie. Just as this is the first we see of this chap being a robot.

Going to the "wrong" house also smacks of the terminator going to the wrong house in the film.

The very short romance is both odd and familiar.

The suggested time travel, also a nod to terminator.

The beginning with him having pain like Kyle after he first appeared, then going all T800 on the woman, just like Arny's arrival. One being under the city (in a subway tunnel), the other over it is also interesting.

He also suggested he got the creators address from the phone book, if I recall correctly.

It certainly seems possible that James Cameron saw this before writing the script.

It certainly fills in some gaps left by soldier and demon.

The wrist is shockingly similar. I do wonder if other shows/films had that before terminator? And the fact it was caused by a car accident as well, as he was trying to kill the girl.

Oh, no…

So, third ep of one hour Twilight zone.

Valley of the shadow.

Well, it basically starts as the terminator ends, with the hero rocking up at a gas station in the middle of nowhere with a big dog sitting up in a seat. A man comes and fills her up, they chat. Of course, not to be forgotten is a kid with a gizmo. Agizmo that zaps the dog from existence, before appearing from nowhere again via a similar gizmo of her father's(?).

The cars an impaela , ford/Chevy not sure?? However (probably wrong??) I think it's the go too get out of town , go to the lake car (was it used in in his image?? Well there was a lake). Jump to the terminator and what's the 80s equivalent, perhaps a jeep. Both open top, wind in your hair jobs of their time.

A few instances of people appearing from nowhere. Well, him and his dog.

The news paper is from the past.

The dog, of cause, barks a lot, and seems to have a sixth sense.

Gosh it even mirrors blade runner (check the was Deckard a replicant topic), with a line I now can't remember, something about her being at real person? between him and the woman. And him telling her, she won't get far before they catch up with her.

Plus we get a car crash where the dog is presumed dead, until it's alive again. Like in the terminator with arny thought severely injured.

Having a machine, creating a weapon, them using it, as a path to self distraction also seems familiar.

Going down into the computer lab near the end felt like going into the factory with all the machines.

T2 even gets a look in with reversing blood pools/wounds, via machine, of course, and the secret's to the machines hidden in a box on the wall with alarms. Its all very cyberdyne.

Also the interagation of our male lead. Opposite the terminator, as they want him to keep their secret, as opposed to him trying to make them believe his.

He wanted a new new typewriter, buy all they could provide was an older style one. Poo, not even in the 40watt range.

Lots of bits.

With soldier, demon, image, and now valley, I feel most scenes and ideas of the terminator are presented.

Is it possible then that, while watching the last season of the outer limits, Cameron also watched the first hour long season of the Twilight zone?

Thay are both hour long. And if a station was running the outer limits and it ended, it is believable they they would follow with Twilight zone, starting with the matching hour long seasons.

Of course, Cameron could have been watching videos? Possibly? Further Investigation into videos available at that time may be required. As with tv in his area also.

Just watched in his image to the terminator.

Wow.

It works well. Start image from the opening scene at about the point arny turns his head in close up (approx, I had trouble trying to figure where I'd started from because of a remote issue. Technical difficulties). Enjoy the ride.

I know the algorithm/s may be responcible for a lot of the similarity. As with many films. But it's when it's too similar that grabs the attention.

When Ellison kicked up a stink with Orion/Cameron it was because it was too similar.

I feel in his image is also too similar.

Like, when lined up as I mentioned, when they are both talking about the robots at the same time. There are many funny bits

Basically everything. Again, I didn't write them all down.

Talking about going and (a phrase I can't remember) doing something to girls, or such slang. When arny breaks in on the woman's house to shoot her.

The old lady describing Kyle's entrance very well.

Old lady saying he looks sick when the dead punks face is on the ground.

Talking about machines breaking down when arny returns to his room for repair.

Something about being a new man or similar, when arny puts on the glasses.

The technoir flickering sighn as the robot has a headache amid crackling electric sounds.

Its endless. Almost everything is paralleled in some way, picture or dialogue. Feels more than just basic algorithm or structural duplication of the other or of an earlier text.

Remember this was adjusting the starting place as I described. Though the algorithm would work any which way.

Also ,in reference to valley of the shadow. Look at the gun arny uses a lot, a pistol with a big laser stuck on top. Look familiar??

Ok. So 4th Twilight zone 1 hour ep is a bust.

Did learn something though.

Apparently as of about 1978 the hour long EPs were not being syndicated.

So if they did begin replays in the next few years, Cameron would have likely been interested to watch a few.

Hmm.., guess he's late.

I'm surprised I've never heard of the similarity of the Twilight zone episodes to the terminator.

That wrist is still imprinted in my brain.

And that gun thing, just like the terminators laser sight. And that sight is huge! Was that just the 80s tech, or more deliberate? Or was it a special laser for film purposes?

Obviously the start of soldier and vally of the shadow are equally suspicious.

Demon with a glass hand, of course too.

If anyone knows of other instances of scenes I have mentioned, in other films/tv, let us know.

Terminator, along with the hydrolics in Arny's wrist also have the bar code on Kyle's arm and Sarah's bloody teeth, all red bars. Interesting.

Has a tattoo or any form of labelling appeared in Twilight zone/Outer limits? Prison camps, so on?

Quarlo From soldier does state this name, rank, serial number (Qarlo Clobregnny, private, RM EN TN DO). And he grew up in a creach(?). Opposite of a brand and prison camp, while still war related. Interesting.

He is also telling his new "friend" like Kyle tells Sarah. Both in a confined space, car/cell. Both fight to escape (I'd have to check if they try to escape in those exact same scenes, but it may not matter).

So much work to be done here.

Ok.

Wrist mucking.

Alien resurrection sprung to mind with plugging into wrist.

I was right!

It is the same as terminator.

Funny bits:

Cloned you v many Sarah's in phone book.

Wrist guns v gunshop.

Not the man you want to f with v little girl on trike.

Little scare v arny a ladies door

Finger on alien window v finger on phone book.

Are you gonna kill me or not v friend dancing before being killed.

Ripley convo with Android v machines need love too on answer machine.

Gun to ear v phone to ear.

Clone room v mirror room.

Worst bit deformed clone v worst bit eye pulling.

Flamer tip v red eye.

Chest burster bodies v showing body armour.

It's too dangerous for you here v desk cop plowed by car through door.

2 alien mouths v 2 dogs.

Android voice in ship v Arny faking aunt on phone.

Heart to heart v heart to heart.

Ripley on alien floor v love scene.

It's not right v dog barking at terminator.

So on…

They both have wrist holes and wrist tattoos and teeth, but not red ones.

Like most, I suspect swapping scenes around will make an even better duplication of the other film.

On the whole, I think I preferred Terminator 2.

Which follows the trend of upping the coolness.

Like Road Warrior, Aliens, so on.

The second film has a kid, more of the villain, more black, and a bunch of other things.

The third is usually not quite as good, but adequate as trilogy finale.

I did think alien 3 was better than 2, less the CGI alien. Then found out it was practical and it was just the compositing that was at fault. Whoop!