"Please help Christy Brom" Topic

Good afternoon SMG and friends,

As you all most likely know my friend Larry Brom author of the famous The Sword And The Flame rules had passed away some time ago. Shortly there afterwards his eldest daughter and family bread winner had suddenly and unexpectedly passed away from heart disease. With all the medical expenses and what not his youngest daughter Christy could never get back on her feet.

Christy's close friends are trying to assist her. If anyone of you have enjoyed the numerous rules sets Larry and his family put on the market please consider contributing $20. USD

She has been evicted today so she's looking for a place to live so every dollar helps.

She lives in New Orleans, Louisiana, if anyone know of a place she can stay temporarily please let me know. Here's
a Go Fund me page, if you can donate anything.

link

Thank you,
JB

Very kind of you to help.

link

nowcs.org

It is not my intention to kick anyone while thy are down, but she has not, and probably never will, do anything with the rules that she has inhereted. She needs to sell the rights to someone who has the capacity to carry on her father's legacy, which will allow her to make a little money to help get back on her feet.

A few other links

link

findhelp.org

Sadly, I do agree that selling the rights to Broms work, would be a quick way to raise money.

I agree, it would be an expedient way to get some money. And yes, there other avenues to get help. I appreciate the links, I will forward to her now.

SgtGuinness,
I have been in regular contact with Christy for a year.
She has exhausted most long term venues there in NOLA with little success. I hope these links will help. I have been a family
friend for over 30 years, but with distance, age and major health issues, have primarily been limited to morale support.

She has desperately been working to return to North Carolina
even prior to the passing of her sister Lori.

Bismarck, I know everyone has been trying to help in whatever way they can. I know they were trying to move back before Lori's passing. I truly hope she can make that move to a place where they had happier times in her past. Many of us wish we were closer or wealthy so we could do more. It's a very sad situation, unfortunately not limited to our community and friends.

Agree with you 79th PA – even if it is a partnership agreement or she receives royalties on sales – somebody should continue the work that her dad started.

I am sure there are a lot of unfulfilled subscriptions outstanding. She has gone through some horrible times – but
there should be some sort of plan for carrying on and fulfilling existing orders.

To be honest, TSATF et al has never seemed to me to be a viable business operation. If handled professionally, it could generate a lot more income. There seems to be no distribution plan. All the various titles seem to be stored in a single computer, with a single printer. It's one disaster away.
It's an asset that is generating very little income. 🤷
It may be the greatest rules ever written, which I think it is by the way, but it needs to be better handled.
My suggestion is to sell the entire library off, for a fair price, to someone who can better market it. With royalties of course.
I know she promised her father to not do so, but this is a different situation.

Make of this what you will, and judge me as you will. The way the 40th anniversary edition has been handled for the past few years says it all.

No judgement here John. I think you are spot on.

John is very insightful in his comments. It was a good rule set in it's day p, but I believe that day has past and past long ago. It may still be viable if handled correctly, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I wish all involved well and hope for a positive outcome.

Done

With many Colonial gamers now playing Black Powder and The Men Who Would Be Kings, TSATF is going to have limited appeal. There will always be a core audience who will purchase any new edition, but the proceeds from that aren't going to change anyone's lifestyle in any kind of significant way.

I paid for and pre-ordered The Sword and the Flame 40th Edition on September 6, 2022.

It's not my era, but there is so much affection and goodwill for this ruleset that I can't wait to share in the experience.

I mean – how could anyone not want to graze through the rules, where there are fan-generated supplements with titles like "The Sword and the Haggis" and "The Sword and the Heather?"

Cheerleading for a good solution – a continuing publication legacy for the ruleset family, and resources and ongoing income for Ms. Brom.

Happy to help.

I am not close to the situation, but if she promised her father not to sell the rights she really can't sell the rights. But could she license them to someone with the infrastructure to publish them? Shifting to print on demand would seem to make sense.

There are more modern rules for the period, but TSATF is still the pinnacle for two reasons: design that reinforces narrative, and rules text that thrills with evocation of the game itself. I can't tell you how many rules I've read for exciting and interesting periods that are dull to read. And I can't tell you how many rules I've read and thought, yeah, you could play that, and the outcomes would be reasonable, but these rules don't add much.

The thing about minis games, and I think this is true of RPGs, too, is that the core activity – pushing your figures around and bashing your opponent's army – is *so* much fun that you can have *terrible* rules and still have a good time. This leads too many people to think that their bad rules are good rules or that rules don't matter. TSATF are the antithesis of this, they make it more fun to play, they don't just allow fun, they contribute to it.

The spirit of TSATF can't die, even if my hopes of seeing the 40th edition eventually do.

+1 to Andrew Walters. He stated it perfectly. Black Powder and the Men Who Would Be Kings might be more popular right now, but that does not mean they are as much fun as TSATF.

So many new rules sets actually owe their existence to TSATF, borrowing its original ideas (variable order of movement, fire, and distance, etc) that suggesting Larry's work is somehow old fashioned isn't really fair.

Consider, until the disasters piled upon the Brom's over the last decade or so and the more recent collapse of "Sergeants 3's" ability to fill orders, how many other rules sets can anyone name which have otherwise been in constant print since 1979? Rules sets come and go, and many are great successes, but Larry Brom's pioneering work keeps delivering and has never become some arcane item played only by a few geriatrics in the back room of a minor convention--and it won't be for a long time yet.

That said, a couple of points to ponder about the suggestion that Christy would do better of with selling out her rights for "royalties" needs to be looked at very directly.

First, the "traditional" royalty on the sale of a title is 5%. That's it. While the sales of a "44th Anniversary" edition would be initially high, they would drop off to a low, but likely steady, volume for a long time to come--just as the previous edition has. At that rate, Christy might only see lunch money a few weeks of the year, which would hardly solve her immediate crisis.

Lest we forget, "Yaquinto Games" frankly screwed Larry out of any amount of unpaid royalties back in the 80's until the rights reverted to him with their frankly deserved demise (that despite publishing some other good products--none still popular except TSATF). Having been badly burned, the Brom's understandably chose to keep their legacy tightly in hand, not allowing distribution by any other potential "Royalty Rats." (The only exception being a fine Aussie Gent by the name of Gerry Webb of "Castaway Arts" whose character was/is unassailable.)

Not having placed the ms with a POD Publisher was a choice I make no accounting for. The only alternative of printing a large run of new copies required a sizeable amount of cash in hand up front, thus the need to offer a subscription for the planned "40th Anniversary" edition.

But with Covid lockdowns, Lori's health issues, etc, the subscription money inescapably turned into rent and food. This poor but perhaps unavoidable choice had been made before regarding some joint projects around the time when Christy's Mother passed from CJD. As a result, a tacit understanding allowed TVAG to publish game accessories and two TSATF Dependent rules sets, all with due accreditation to "And That's The Way It Was…," originally, and "Sergeants 3," subsequently.

Under the present circumstances, all who paid their subscriptions for the "40th" must consider that investment lost.

And damn the eyes of any twit that now thinks of suing Christy for their money back.

I have no magic bullet for how best to help Christy at what must now be the lowest moment of her life. She has several beloved family pets to care for right now, besides herself and such possessions remain. Giving as generously as possible to the Go Fund Me project is a given, but I can't stand the idea at this moment of someone trying to cajole her out of the only material legacy left to her--TSATF and its many variants.

Yet, without the capital either to print the new edition, or a publisher who can both pay her something substantial up front, plus a decent royalty, for printing "Sergeants 3's" library, there seem few other options.

Perhaps the best viable alternative would be putting the new edition up through Amazon Kindle Direct Printing (KDP) which can bring royalties closer to 60% with no cash outlay required. (Understand, while Kindle editions are possible, too, I am referring to actual, hard copy books). The rights still belong to the author (here, Christy), and she can redact publication at any time. Should her circumstances turn dramatically around, and she can afford to Print On Demand on her own, she might yet make even more return per copy.

However, any KDP hard copy title must have a minimum of 50 pages, and the "40th" is certainly much smaller. Then again, by increasing the font size a bit (a blessing for we OLDER fans), adding more relevant illustrations/diagrams/etc, and even colorizing the original uniform sketches, plus adding extra for players new to Colonials (in keeping with the spirit of the original), this is easily resolved.

There may well be other options, but none come to this Old Duffer.

Certainly, the new edition will need an edit--not to change a word or add anything not put there by Larry himself--but just to put it in ready to print format. Frankly, if permitted, I'd do this without any form of compensation beyond the satisfaction of helping Christy and my fellow followers of Larry Brom's drum.

TVAG

Good points TVAG. We need a way forward which will get Christy an income (and make the rules available again) or there will be another Go Fund Me in the very near future. Agreed, the 40th Aniversary money is gone. I think most of us would sign some sort of waiver if it would make later publication more likely.

As for the KDP, consider making the page count by adding some of the scenarios. Sergeants 3 has a large collection already with maps and suitable for the armies mentioned in the classic rules.

Agreed. The "Go Fund Me" campaign is a short term answer to a long term problem.

I am sure that everyone who contributed to the 40th anniversary edition knows their money is long gone.

Those who know Christy need to have a tough love conversation with her about TSATF production. She needs to get something in production (through someone else) before what's left of the fan base dies off. I think most gamers will view the totality of the circumstances and be willing to try again, but only if a known entity is producing the rules.

Oh, yes indeed, Brother piepenbrink!

Scenarios, with maps, OB's, and scenario specific rules, would all go to make the "44th" (?) a respectable product with greater value.

There are some old articles Larry wrote for "By Jingo!" over 25 years ago about the origins of the rules and related info that might well be included (if I can find them!). A brief bio of The Immortal Sergeant would also be in order (I have some old photos of him, too).

There are also freebies that can be made accessible. The Unit Record Sheets I designed for the TSATF20 can be included, and my link for people wishing to have the whole set of them as editable PDF's could appear, too.

Indeed, two more of his variants, "A Day In The Palms," and "Volley Fire!" would be short but worthwhile additions.

For that matter, "800 Fighting Englishmen," a short but dependent variant, would really complete the package.

The original "Wargames Tool Kit" would then be an invaluable and unique resource for bringing both old and new Colonialist into the fold.

And what figure manufacturer would not be willing to spend some money to advertise in such a magnum opus their lines of Colonial figures and related products? All that cash would go straight to her. Not a fortune, but more cushion than she has now.

Meanwhile, anyone following this thread, please follow the Go Fund Me link and drop what you can. The goal is $5,000 USD and they're about 20% of the way. Any player of TSATF over the last 44 years ought to be able to volunteer a lousy Jackson (plus GFM's bite) for the fun they've had. I'm going to have to break the piggy bank and give some more, myself. I owe her and Larry's memory AT LEAST that much.

TVAG

TVAG, when you mentioned "adding more relevant illustrations/diagrams/etc" I thought you were thinking of another page (or two or three) of "uniform" illustrations. Expanding to have two or three Zulu pictures, Afghan regulars as well as Pathans, and several more British regiments would certainly be justified.
That's not even considering all the strange things we've all adapted these rules to over the years.

Grelber
Who has charts for battles between Greeks and Turks based on Patrick Leigh-Fermor's book "The Mani."

AMAZON KDP has published my rules in paperback since 2012/2013. I am pleased with their methods.

It would seem to me that since "generating income" seems to be a central theme here, publishing a new version of the rules as a hardcover/softcover would have limited impact. An easier way is to release it as a PDF for a modest price ($10-15?), then that way about 90% of the proceeds could go directly to her. If you sell 300 copies, that could generate $3,000 USD-$4500. Publishing it, then shipping the copies might generate less than $1,000 USD for those same 300 copies. Either way, no one is getting life changing income off of this thing.

Nobody ever said it was "life changing".
It would merely be a much needed source of income.

When you are homeless, $3 USD – $4,000.00 USD can make quite a difference in the quality of your life.

With the right people and marketing (includes editing, bundling, etc.), this is simply a much needed revenue stream.

Again, this is just part of the answer as good will and nostalgia only go so far. You can only tap that well so many times, especially if you don't have any personal relationship with the Brom's.

"Grelber!"

Dave, as the one man who, outside Larry himself, made the "20th Anniversary Edition" the success it still is, who made
"Darkest Africa" a new genre of gaming (not forgetting the coincident and brilliant Copplestone figures), you are automatically as committed as I or anyone, to saving TSATF for the next forty-some years.

One of the old Mississippi play testers and family friends told me in a private E-mail that efforts have begun to return her to North Carolina, the Brom's original home. While that's the best bet to give Christy some stability, he agrees that trying to convince her to go the KDP route is the way to go to protect her legacy and see that she gets at least some benefit from it.

When/if that happens, making the new edition of TSATF into something more than just the "next edition" would be the ideal way to increase its value. Added pages of simple uniform plates seems a natural progression--there are so many more uniforms of the classic five opponents (Zulus, Egyptians, Boers, Mahdists, Afghan/Pathans), plus others contemporary with the rules, not to mention those of Imperial forces, that these alone would help expand the rules utility.

Do you know who created the original drawings for these in the 20th (and previous) editions? They had a charm and simplicity that would be ideal to keep, if possible, and retaining their style for additions would be ideal. That said, more "formal" presentations from contemporary sources would actually be easier, and already in hand in abundance.

Meanwhile, thank you, mahdi1ray for your vote of confidence in KDP. I quite agree with you and have had the same good experience for as long as you.

aegiscg47, your point about additional returns by offering PDF Editions is well taken. However, Kindle Editions, while generating smaller royalties per sale, have the advantage of being offered worldwide. While I have not gone that route myself with any of my titles, that's more a statement of laziness on my part. Formatting a Print Edition for Kindle Editions is a separate process which I've so far eschewed, but partly because I'm not sure how many wargamers actually play games while referring to the rules on their phones or I-Pads. If that's actually a "thing" out there, I'd be grateful to be brought up to speed by those who do so.

Finally, a "Thank you" to John, too. You hit the nail. Again.

Followers of this thread! Please contact everyone you know who ever bought/played/supported TSATF and share the Go Fund Me link. Let them know that any amount they can spare will help someone very much in need, proving their appreciation and gratitude for the decades of gaming fun Larry Brom gave us all.

TVAG

I have often written about my modifications for FIW and AWI gaming. Plus I will be using them for Comanche vs Spanish in Mexico.
Perhaps, if only to flesh out the pages, a few "out of period" suggestions might do well.

Afghan Regulars are available from Foundry and a few others. Afghanistan was not just Pathans. Treat them like Egyptians. I use Egyptian artillerists as Afghans, because from illustrations they appear identical.

Abyssinians vs Italians?
French in Dahomey? Should the "Amazons" be rated as Egyptians?
US Cav vs Dakota, or Comanche, or Apache.
Canada's Northwest Rebellion.
Balkan Wars.

There are many ways to "add pages" to reach 50 than just using the old High School trick of triple spacing. 😄 "The Men Who would be Kings" has extensive lists of possible matchups.

That's a good idea, John. House rules and fan generated thoughts/notes could make for some interesting reading as an appendices. In order to save time and work, I don't think I'd even edit these. They are what they are.

Your point well taken also, John!

As most TSATF fans know, there is a long list of generally short, simple variants for a wide range of other subjects--by no means all "Colonial"--that were available through "Sergeants 3" for years.

Some of the subjects you list may, for what all I know, have been addressed by someone(s) already. Your own FIW/AWI variant figure collecting and game variants were long a feature of your posting in earlier days, and if committed to paper are likely as intriguing as all those previously available.

For whatever it's worth (and we're definitely dividing the bear's skin before it's been shot, here), I've envisioned a
book containing the entire collection of all those variants from before, plus any that have been well thought out and presented on other subject the TSATF game system can be applied to.

Which as has been well proved for years, is damn near anything.

Any new edition of TSATF itself can easily be expanded, as suggested, by including more variants of itself as written by Larry Brom, himself. (By the by, this would NOT include, in MY version of The Koran, the old "Boxer Rebellion" variant which he had nothing to do with, a frankly silly add-on by some geek at Yaquinto, which Larry hated.)

Again, talk about the Wargamer's Tool Kit, a collection of so many variants in one volume of its own would be the perfect adjunct to the original rules in nearly ideal form.

Why don't you start typing? Your product should be able to show up somewhere….

TVAG

Great ideas Pat! Best rules I've ever played.

It's "relatively straightforward". 😄🙄
For my FIW AWI variant:

Any "good" Regular, like British, French, Continental, Hessian are rated as British. This applies to in period Regulars too.
Rate newly raised Continentals or Loyalists as Egyptians. This can also apply to European Regulars fresh off the boat, or Garrison.
Play with Grenadiers or Highlanders as you wish. You can't get much better than British in TSATF, so leave them at that.
For musket periods, all long weapons use Carbine stats. The very few actual "rifle" units can use the Rifle lines.
Are your Indians "shooty" or "chargy"? Choose the Irregular force to match.
Give bows a 12" range. Or more or less. Your choice.
Militia use Boer morale, but shoot as Egyptian carbines.

Spanish vs Comanche? As above. I would note that buying Comanche, or any Plains Indian mounted gives you a wide variety of weapons and poses. You can go by they are armed as shown, or decree that half have bows, or rifles, and the rest have melee weapons. Nobody will be happy, but you're the GM.

I can write this up better if anyone is actually doing this in a template, and I can communicate via email.

My suggestion above is not intended as a full blown supplement, codex or whatever.
I'm merely suggesting how the existing rules can be used for a different period, without changing or tampering with the "engine" in any way.
I was asked how to classify Tarleton's British Legion, light dragoons. That's easy. They were very good, so British. 😄 Ditto Lauzun's Legion. Lancers? Give them a +1 if they charged. Spanish lancers, Comanche lancers, etc.

I'm proposing an Appendix, "Suggested Troop classification in other periods".

Abyssinia is definitely in period. Here, the Italian Bersaglieri aren't really the elite troops. They can be Egyptians, while the Arditi can be British.

How about utilising the rules variants, hints and tips found in TSATF Scenarios 2000 pack for the 40th + edition?

Fascinating thread. I learned a lot and I'll contribute to this fund.

I definitely think The Sword in Africa should be incorporated into an expanded TS&TF rules edition; the French colonial wars mirror the British and the Foreign Legion is always popular.

For that matter, a collection of Appendices of the best variants would be a terrific resource. Indian Mutiny, Boxer Rebellion (I always enjoyed those games, don't know why they weren't liked by Larry), Sword in Gaul, F&IW, and I'd selfishly like to see my "The Sword in the Heather" Jacobite variant included and wouldn't ask for a penny.

I have aspirations to collect armies for King Phillip's War and devise a variant to cover that conflict as well. It's the perfect clash for these rules.

I would like to see the core rules reorganized and incorporating the errata for the 20th edition.

Anyone remember the random event deck once sold for TS&TF? I had a set once upon a time -- long since sold off, I wasn't using it but now I kinda regret not having it.

TVAG handles the card decks for TSATF.

Thanks.

John

I think it's unrealistic to believe that, under present circumstances, TSATF has any future.
Larry wanted to keep it in the family, but with Lori gone, it's effectively passed on into history.

It would need to be sold or licensed on to people who are capable of managing it, publishing and selling it. It wouldn't hurt to give it a slick presentation, include scenarios add some history, organization, uniform guides… The kind of thing that people like to sit down with, be introduced to something new. Instead of photocopies of mimeographs, how about a higher quality set of expansions, that help new players develop interest into the conflict?

Can I ask a dumb question. Are the rules for sale or is the talk about the 40th edition difficulties a sign of broader problems for the sale of these rules?

I would like to buy them but would be happier if doing so meant this poor person is assisted, and of course, a copy of the rules could be obtained.

It's 40th Anniversary, not 40th edition. That smacks of Warhammer silliness. 😄

The first set was some 43 or 44 years ago. Somehow Yaquinto got the rights, and screwed Larry Brom out of royalties.
Then when the 20th Anniversary came around, Larry got hold of the rights. It's a vast improvement. That's what I currently use.

"Vanilla" TSATF is how I handle my adaptations, doing minimal changes. It's a fine engine as is. My "The Sword and the Haggis" would have probably treated Highlanders as Dervish. Period. 🤷
I don't use Black Powder, nor do I use The Men Who would be Kings. No animus. I prefer the tried and true.
There's a veritable plethora of published "supplements" out there that aren't sanctioned, but use 8 man units. Heresy.
I vary unit size by what I have. In my AWI "variant", if Perry sells in 6 figure packs, my Volunteers of Ireland have 18 figures. Why buy another pack?

Anyway, the 40th Anniversary has been talked about for years. But it's in what they call in Hollywood "In Development Hell". I'm in no way responsible for it, and I never "invested" in it, so I have no axe to grind. Had it come out a few years ago, I would have bought it. 🤷
So, take all the suggestions here, including mine, with a grain of salt. If there's movement, I'll chip in. If there's none, I'll muddle through.

I recently have it from an unimpeachable source that the ms for the "40th Anniversary Edition" has been in the perfectly capable hands of a trusted friend of the Brom's for the purpose of applying all changes and additions.

As the project is now being called the "45th Anniversary," the implication is clear that publication is planned for next year.

That said, the prospects of Christy being able to keep control of the rights, and still enjoy meaningful royalties via publication through Amazon KDP, depend largely on how soon she can be resettled--thus the second importance of donating to the Go Fund Me linked in the original post of this thread.

We get to move from topics and projects of our choice every day, but she is stuck in a very special hell that doesn't change--and won't--until we fans of her Father's work pitch in our bits.

PLEASE donate now!

TVAG

I just added a little more to my donation to round the funds up to $1,900.00 USD

At 2 grand now.

TVAG: if you are the "trusted friend" of the Brom family, designated to publish the 40th/45th anniversary edition of The Sword and the Flame, we ask you to honor payments already made for the product.

We may choose, as a separate matter, to support the family via gofundme.

I don't know why Patrick should do that. Your deal was with Lori Brom, who is deceased. Essentially, you invested in a failed kickstarter. Patrick (nor anyone else who may publish these) received any money. Why should the publisher lose money on this project?

79th PA. Not sure I remember the 40th anniversary edition being presented as a Kickstarter. Was it? Normally in failed kickstarters participants are reimbursed their money

I do feel for the Brom family but people did plunk down money in good faith. And despite any circumstances however severe the issue should be addressed.

If it is decided that anyone who 'subscribed' to receiving the 40th anniversary edition is not going to receive their copy they should be told, at the very least.

This should not be taken as a slight to anyone, it's the right thing to do in business. This is my opinion and is not meant to disparage anyone.

Dadster: Thank you; you are a class act. You're right; we don't have to alienate the good-faith purchasers. There are lots of ways to leave everyone feeling proud and happy.

I surmise that the intellectual property rights for The Sword and the Flame (TSATF) was owned by Larry Brom. On his death, I surmise the intellectual property rights devolved to Lori Brom and Christy Brom, jointly, either by will, trust, or by intestate succession. On Lori Brom's death, I surmise that all intellectual property rights devolved to Christy Brom alone. I don't know if there was a formal probate or trust administration to resolve any outstanding ownership or creditor issues.

TVAG informs us that money taken for TSATF 40th Anniversary Edition (and maybe other related publications?) was diverted for rent and food. TVAG characterizes this as a "poor choice." We do not know how much pre-order money was taken, and we do not know how long the website was actively soliciting orders when fulfillment was known to be in question.

Okay. A not untypical situation. Here is what I suggest as next steps:

1. Christy Brom should be the one making the next communication. Ms. Brom should take "ownership" of this situation.

2. Ms. Brom should honestly communicate to TVAG her debt picture. How much money was taken for product not yet delivered? Are there other unsatisfied debts by other creditors, placing the intellectual property at risk? Just be transparent about how bad the situation is; there's always a solution. Worst thing you can do is understate a problem, and let your helpers wonder what else you may not have told them.

3. Ms. Brom and TVAG should reach some kind of publication agreement for the TSATF family. It might be a copyright assignment; it might be in the form of a license. Some agreement which allows for re-publication of past published works and future derivative product, which gets value to Christy Brom, and makes the venture well worthwhile for TVAG. (We don't want TVAG to get into an insolvent situation, either!)

4. Ms. Brom and TVAG should agree on how to handle the unfulfilled obligations – whether originating from Larry Brom, Lori Brom, or Christy Brom herself. It could be a promise to perform in the future, a credit to purchasers who already paid in good faith, or some other means to make them feel whole.

There is so much goodwill associated with the Brom family and the TSATF family of rules, that there are all sorts of paths forward which keep everyone happy.

I'm happy to help if someone wants to reach out to me.

Gaius,

I consider Patrick (TVAG) a good friend.
He is a stand up guy and is always willing to help others in this hobby.

I think your points are very valid and would have to say I agree. I am sure that goal one is to get Ms. Brom back into a nurturing familiar environment and then address the future of Edition Whatever of TSATF. It is truly a wonderful simple rule set. And I hope everything works out for everyone involved

Nobody made a "deal" with Lori Brom or participated in crowdfunding here, and you aren't doing anyone a single favor by mischaracterizing it that way.

People placed preorders with Sergeants3, a company still "open" and taking orders, despite being incapable of fulfilling them (apparently for some time). It doesn't matter who is at the helm at the time and that debt is still owed.

I realize that some of us have a personal history with the Broms and feel nostalgia, but it's not ethical to take orders and use that money for anything outside of fulfilling those orders. It's unfortunate what has happened, but getting a job would have also helped Christy with her monetary problems.

Sergeants3 is not a charity.

Jeff,
How is Christy doing? Has she found a place to live?

RA Cunningham +5

Ah, I am afraid that I wasn't aware of the particulars. Yes, you are correct. It is certainly inappropriate to divert pre-order funds to personal expenses.

I also think it is inappropriate to expect Patrick to be on the hook for a venture that he wasn't involved with (assuming he will be the publisher/provider). He is not buying a business and assuming their debt.

I agree that the issued needs to be addressed, and that there needs to be some transparency from the Brom side. That said, if Patrick is chosen to bring this product to life, he is a stand-up guy who will do his best to do right to the people who lost their money.