"Tank Suspension collapsed?" Topic

I have been working on a burnt out Sherman III (M4A2) and I do have the resin tracks, with just the steel remnants and I have ground down the bogies to remove all the rubber.

However many an image of a burnt out tank shows a collapsed suspension, something I have not seen on a Sherman.

What puzzles me is what could possibly burn out to allow the collapse of what may be springs or torsion bars, but are surely steel? Would a VVSS Sherman show this? Grateful for any advice

I think it is purely the heat generated by an ammunition and/or gasoline fire which heats the metal sufficiently to cause it to lose its tension. Particularly noticeable on torsion bar systems. This is why the Airfix Panther comes with a ready collapsed suspension. Apparently the Airfix draughtsmen went to to measure a Panther that had been burnt out and assumed the tracks were meant to be like that.

Now that makes sense. The external springs suspension of a VVSS Sherman should be less vulnerable. Appreciated

The VVSS "stack" was attached to the hull. Perfectly possible that the heat from the internal fire weakened the weld/bolts when the weight of the upper hull collapsed the "stack". Just an educated guess adding to what Fred already posted. The M4A2 – did it still have the return roller on top or to the rear of the "stack"? Just wondering…

Deadhead, where did you get the resin tracks? I have several Shermans with rotted out rubber tracks. I've searched for resin tracks, but only find German ones.

I have 20mm scale models (1/76-1/72).

Not cheap but:
link

Also:
link

Many others:
link

OKB indeed and Marc's links just above are perfect, esp the last showing just what a range is available ( I go that site almost daily, why did I not think of seeking out tracks there?)

Resin tracks are simply incredible models, but will make you weep as you try to take them over the drive sprocket and return roller. You can boil them in oil until they melt to a mush, but will they bend to shape? Superglue will stick the parts to your tools and fingers and the model, but not to the bogies. OK I got there in the end by breaking the tracks into individual bits and sticking them on one by one. Burnt out tracks do look a mess so that is fine, but my next project, a Jumbo, with the extended duck bills I will plan ahead.

Be sure that the tracks will fit into the drive sprockets. For a Heller M4A2 they proved slightly too wide. Disaster, until I removed the inner teeth on the few in contact.

The return roller? Those on top I also got from abroad, in resin, for a Dragon M4A1. It will need the three piece casting for the differential housing from one of several I have left over from the Heller kit, to make an El Alamein Sherman. Then is the upturned return roller which I need for the Jumbo, but I have many of them already. I have seen French M4A2s with an old style return roller as a replacement and, of course, the SP gun the M7s in my 2eme DB collection have both, but you need the photos to know hich to use….and can get it wrong…weep.

Shermanology is a seriously dangerous rabbit hole, just ask Grace Slick

Wow! Thank you all very, very much.

Well the MIG tracks are individual links which takes care of the "boiling" issue and do come with a set of drive wheels but assembling those individual tracks? Madness may lie that way! I have done individual with 1/35th (both resin and metal tracks) and it is quite the task, 1/72 may be a little too finicky. Check out the PDF on the MIG link to see what's involved.

Best compromise is usually link and length. Long one piece runs for things like top and bottom of run and then individual for wrapping around the ends.

Happens all the time. Check out almost all the German tanks now in Normandy, especially the Tiger at Vimoutiers. All have sunk nearly to the ground.

All a great help and I do now understand why German "Cats"and Soviet T34s and their modern successors, in Vietnam up to Ukraine, look like that. But M4s do not