"Romans & Race" Topic

I was surprised to learn that some people claim that the Romans (and more specifically, Constantine and his successors) were 'white supremacists'.

What were Roman concepts of racial identity? Did they think in terms of skin color?

Ask Emperor Septimius Severus.

No. Amy Chua discussed this in her book Day of Empire. Strong sense of prejudice based on culture not race. Looked down on cultures where men wore pants. Denigrated Lusitanians as "butter eaters". Would accept people who Romanized regardless of skin color. It's why they persecuted monotheists before Constantine and pagans/heretics after

The Romans gave not no fig about race but cared an awfully lot about culture, notably citizenship – civis Romanus sum really, really meant something

I just watched a documentary and Rome was extremely multicultural and didn't care about race. The goal for any foreigner was to become Roman.

My understanding has always been that Romans divided the world into us and them regardless of race. Culture not color was their dividing line.

Those making the claim are historical ignoramuses. The Romans were equal opportunity conquerors. As others have said, it was about Roman culture and Roman law, nothing else.

The Romans were not completely oblivious to skin colour. The story of Septimius Severus being accosted by an "Aethiopian" (=Black African) soldier, and being "troubled … by the man's ominous colour" suggests a certain level of prejudice with regard to Black people.

What the Romans seem to have lacked, though, was any concept of a White "race". They would have rejected the idea that nice respectable Mediterranean people like themselves had anything in common with pale-skinned savages like the Germans or Scythians. It's hard, therefore, to see how they could be "white supremacist" in any meaningful sense.

As soon as you see the words "white supremacist" you can assume that science and history have taken a back seat to ideology. I ignore anything related and feel no poorer for it.

There was a movie out last year that had all slaves in the Roman Empire be black. Gee, guess I missed that in my history courses.

Well…..…, Romans are "white."

All "white people" are racist.

So……., they must be white supremacists?

(The scariest thing is that many people today would not see this post as sarcasm.)

They rode around with Confederate flag bumper stickers on their chariots?

What the Romans seem to have lacked, though, was any concept of a White "race".

Surprisingly, the idea of a "white race" is really a 19th century idea. Not that Europeans were oblivious to skin colour before then but the notion of distinct racial identities really accelerated after the publication of Darwin's On the Origin Of Species whose full title is "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life ". Note the second title and the emphasis on race.

I am reading Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes stories and it really surfaces there in subtle ways. Richard Weikart wrote a fascinating book called, "From Darwin to Hitler" that really lays out the precursor development to Nazi racial theory. It didn't come out of nowhere and in fact rests on racial ideas that developed during the Victorian age in Germany that ultimately draws on Darwin's work.

Good points Brutus.

I have a problem with people thoughtlessly foisting their current mindsets on ancient history, expecting their modern views to be wholly applicable and determinative.

As an aside to what Brutus wrote. Wellington supposedly commented about the Irish; "They make good soldiers when led by white officers."