dogtail | 24 Feb 2025 6:29 a.m. PST |
@35thOVI could it be that you just copy and paste your former postings? If three german ladies tell you that they are afraid of going out, that does not mean that the german youth votes predominantly right. The left (literally Die Linke ) got an awful lot of votes from younger voters. The freedom of speech thingy is BS. We have laws against hate speech, and as Social Media is rather new, laws have to adjust. A house was searched because somebody called a politician literally a p6nis, but of course a court called the house search way over the top. But of ccourse we have our kind of freedom of speech. Try to deny the Shoah and you will find out where it ends. I have no problems with that. Can you show me proof that the identity of the syrian stabber was hidden? By chance I was there shortly after it occured, and within 24 hours I knew where he was from. The AfD is in parts a danger to our german democracy. We Germans actually learned from our past, so we will not stand idle when a party wants to crush our economy and make Germany a nationalistic kindergarten in fear of strangers. |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 6:57 a.m. PST |
"Can you show me proof that the identity of the syrian stabber was hidden? By chance I was there shortly after it occured, and within 24 hours I knew where he was from." For the first 2 days they refused to release it, although they knew immediately who did it. I will give the French credit, they release almost immediately. Free speech is suppressed in multiple areas, even here. Try silently praying within so many feet of abortion clinics in the UK. Try complaining about migrants on the web or elsewhere in certain European countries. Try saying anything that someone deems "homophobic". What if Germany decided that speaking anything that can be deemed positive about socialism or communism was deemed hate speech, worthy of arrest? Positive about Homosexuality? You can laugh, but just the reverse of Policies you currently say you support and are happy with |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 7:02 a.m. PST |
Case in point Dogtail. I want her arrested for "hate speech" against a group of people!! She should not be allowed to speak such hate!! Subject: Citizen Free Press on X: "ILHAN OMAR COMMITTED IMMIGRATION FRAUD TWICE. She married her brother so he could get a green card. Omar is not her real last name. Look into that story. ‘These people are just idiots. The dumbing down of America has arrived. How else could Trump win.' t.co/PqYicDZZCl / X link 😂
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dogtail | 24 Feb 2025 7:35 a.m. PST |
Fun fact: the stabber was 19. It means he will be prosecuted under youth law, cause in Germany you are an adult before criminal law only when turning 21. As I said, I knew it within 24 hours, so I guess it was rather a technical delay than a try to hide something. I will not say that UK laws makes sense, IIRC there are waaay more court cases of "forbidden talk" in the UK than in Russia. But that is a problem of the UK, none of mine. There is actually only one party I can imagine to outlaw positive talk about socialism or communism. That would be the AfD. You can actually talk about trying to install communism in the FR of Germany. The communist platform was part of the Linke (The left). But as it was no danger to democracy, every government had let them have their dreams. We have a court that oversees our government, and there are also european courts. So you can talk positivly about homosexuality, but you are not allowed to compare homosexuals to animals in a derogatory manner, I guess. I am not sure I really get what your point is. |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 8:12 a.m. PST |
Yes, Germany is better than some. The problem with restrictions, especially related to "hate speech" and what constitutes it, is "who" makes the decision what it is? An AFd judge may not see something said as hate speech, while a Green Party does and arrests the person for it. You made two comments about migrants, Afghans specifically in the other thread. Can a fellow German see that as hate speech and report you? You should be allowed to say it, but restrictions on free speech may not allow it. Should a Scot or Brit be allowed to pray silently within so many feet of an abortion clinic? I say yes. But what does the law say? I jokingly said I believe what Omar said above is hate speech. But if you take it technically, it is belittling and hateful of a group. BUT that is not a pet protected group. Restricting free speech is a slippery slide down a bannister that has razor blades imbedded in the wood. "Germany's criminal laws limit free speech in cases of hate speech, defamation, and incitement to violence. These laws apply to both online and in-person speech. Hate speech Section 130 Prohibits inciting hatred or insulting others based on their race, religion, ethnicity, or nationality Volksverhetzung Prohibits speech that incites violence, hatred, or despotism against a group of people Defamation Chapter 14 Prohibits defamation of politicians and malicious gossip about private citizens Insult Prohibits insulting others, which can include public insults, insults in meetings, and insults spread online Incitement to violence Volksverhetzung: Prohibits speech that incites violence, hatred, or despotism against a group of people Other restrictions Content that endangers children or young people can be restricted or banned Speech that is abusive criticism, or not primarily used to debate a topic, is not protected Germany's constitution guarantees freedom of speech, but these rights are limited by general laws. "
"As prosecutors explain it, the German constitution protects free speech, but not hate speech. And here's where it gets tricky: German law prohibits speech that could incite hatred or is deemed insulting. Perpetrators are sometimes surprised to learn that what they post online is illegal, according to Dr.Feb 16, 2025"
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35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 9:00 a.m. PST |
Tort a poll for you. 😉 Subject: End Wokeness on X: "NEW Harvard-Harris Poll: 🟢 Trump approval: 52% (+9) 🔴 Trump disapproval: 43% 58% say he is doing better than Biden 81% support deporting criminal aliens 76% support eliminating fraud, waste 76% support closing the U.S. border 70% support merit-based hiring 61% support" / X link |
Legion 4  | 24 Feb 2025 10:56 a.m. PST |
"ILHAN OMAR COMMITTED IMMIGRATION FRAUD TWICE. Of course, being a female, minority and moslem(IIRC). She is Teflon as some would say it is racist, sexist, xenophobic, etc. to say otherwise. "All animals are equal" 🐷🐮… you know the rest … |
Grattan54  | 24 Feb 2025 11:22 a.m. PST |
A poll on X. The platform run by Musk. Yeah, don't think I am going to entirely trust that one. |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 11:47 a.m. PST |
Grattan54… your blue knickers are showing. 😉 You didn't even look to see it was a Harvard/Harris poll? Automatically X/Musk?? Back when it was Twitter and they black balled anyone with an anti party in power stance, including the current President, did you trust them then? When they sad the laptop was Russian disinformation and if you disagreed you were blackballed. If you said masks didnt work, they blackballed you. If you said that the vaccine did not prevent Covid or had side effects, they blackballed you. If you said Covid came from a bio lab in China, they blackballed you. You trusted them then? When the last administration dominated all social media platforms and the majority of the media, you trusted them then? Grattan you are better than that! 🙂 see below… happier? "A poll on X. The platform run by Musk. Yeah, don't think I am going to entirely trust that one." Subject: Press Release: February 2025 – Harvard CAPS / Harris Poll
link X is the most open platform I know of right now, everything is out there. |
dogtail | 24 Feb 2025 12:13 p.m. PST |
I think if she (ILHAN OMAR) says those guys are idiots she is protected under the § whatssoever: telling the truth might hurt, but you have to swallow it just kidding :) Hate speech is different from insults, so if you say all white people should be killed it is different from saying white men can´t jump. Being blackballed on Twitter as far as I understand it is totally different from getting a visit from police and having to pay a fine. So what do we discuss here? If you watch the 60minutes video that was linked I strongly support the case of Renate Kuenast. If she can sue you because you post an invocation to rape her I don´t see a problem. Do you? |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 12:26 p.m. PST |
Dogtail if I said: "Transgenderd individuals have psychological issues and need mental help". Is that hate speech, free speech or truth? Depending on your answer, why? One persons free speech, is another's hate speech. Or even truth. Should you be able to publicly sell a WW2 German wound badge? If yes, why? If no, why? Can you in Germany? Could sell a WW2 Purple Heart? What's the difference? |
dogtail | 24 Feb 2025 12:59 p.m. PST |
Dogtail if I said: "Transgenderd individuals have psychological issues and need mental help". Is that hate speech, free speech or truth? Depending on your answer, why? Disclaimer: I am no lawyer, I only state my opinion: It is free speech. Having psychological issues and needing mental help is nothing to be ashamed of in my society anymore. Would have been different when I went to school, but nowaddays this statement alone is not derogatory. If you say to a single person in public that this person specificially needs medical attention from a psychologist it might be true but it still could be derogatory. It is not "the truth" because you cannot prove it for every transgenderd individual, so it is an assumption. How many points did I score? I can only guess what is legal in Germany: I guess you could sell a a WW2 German wound badge but not in public because of the swastika, but I simply don´t know. You can have a big Reichkriegsflagge in your living room, but not on your balcony. The showing of Nazi symbols is only allowed for educational purpose and art. And maybe if you protest against Nazis, for example you might show a picture of a swastika thrown into a bin. I guess you cannot sell a WW2 Purple Heart, because you get it from a government not as a property but as an award. So technically you don ´t owe it. |
35thOVI  | 24 Feb 2025 1:35 p.m. PST |
My point I was trying to make (I assume you are German since your profile says that), is if you stepped out in public, on the steps of a high government building and said: "Transgenderd individuals have psychological issues and need mental help". Not for an individual, but as a whole, and it was reported by the media, would you be arrested for a hate crime? Because I'm sure some people would turn it in as hate speech. You should be able to, in my opinion. But many dont see it that way when against a "protected class". It has been my understanding "German law prohibits those items that have any swastikas on them to be owned within Germany" or sold. I can here. I can also sell or buy a Purple Heart. You should be able to, it's history. Owning a German wound badge with a swastika will not suddenly make someone a Nazi or an anti semite. It will also NOT prevent them from becoming one. Those views are inside the person. My point: by making certain things or words forbidden, will not stop the views from being there or in a persons heart. They just make them hide them and then the hate simmers and gets worse. Better to have it in the open where they can be challenged. I am obviously not a fan of hate speech laws or hate crimes. Nor almost any restrictions on free speech, unless those using it are physically endangering others, destroying property or impeding others access or from doing business. So although I oppose the law saying someone cannot pray silently or out loud near an abortion facility, I would oppose them doing it in front of the door of the facility and impeding business. |
dogtail | 24 Feb 2025 2:21 p.m. PST |
My point I was trying to make (I assume you are German since your profile says that), is if you stepped out in public, on the steps of a high government building and said: "Transgenderd individuals have psychological issues and need mental help". If this is done in Berlin people around you might think you have psychological issues and need mental help. Do you expect the German hate speech police to come down on you and send you to prison? No way. Nobody would care. And if some german Karen would file charges against you it would be not be prosecuted because there is no interest in that. If this Karen would sue you in civil court this Karen has to prove that he/she/whatever was harmed. If you would tape it and put it on youtube you might get angry postings. As far as I know the public display of swastikas is prohibited as I wrote. You can paint as many swastikas on the walls of your home as you want. You can be a Nazi and you will not be prosecuted, but you might not be a member of the police etc. I can say in public that Adolf Hitler was a nice guy and a good painter. But I am not allowed to say all gypsies should be executed. I might say that at home to a single person, but I am not sure about that. |
35thOVI  | 25 Feb 2025 12:49 p.m. PST |
Ok, I've been hearing this complaint on TV since he issued the letter, and this article finally took me over the top and addresses all the anti Musk posts on TMP recently. Subject: Veterans Affairs staffers denounce OPM email amid Elon Musk's DOGE push: 'People have no clue how this is impacting us' Cry me a ####### River! 😭 You spoiled entitled individuals! For my 40 plus years in the private sector, I either had to fill out a weekly or daily paper on what I worked on and send it to my boss. Then I had to put a yearly document of basically the same, for my yearly review. Yes I had to get my job done too, and with substantially less of a work force then in the government. I could be fired at any time or replaced by oversea contractors. If I told my bosses I wouldn't do it… boom I am fired! Boo Bloody Hoo, I have no pity for you. Take that outside and chant it with your picket signs. What this will find out is, if people are reading their emails. In other words, not really doing anything but bilking the taxpayers, or even working another job. It is past time to bring the private sector into the bureaucracy of Washington DC. link Want to see some of them work on? Subject: The NSA's Secret Sex Chats link Or where some of that money Doge is cutting was going? Subject: Transing the Gay Away link
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Legion 4  | 25 Feb 2025 1:08 p.m. PST |
OVI +1 One persons free speech, is another's hate speech. Or even truth. That seems to be the case at least in the USA. It happens all the time with BLM, Antifa, KKK, Neo-Nazis, etc., etc. I abhor those types, but in the US our Founding Fathers allowed freedom of speech and peaceful assembly. However, today much of that is up to interpretation. What BLM, Antifa, etc. did in the summer of 2020, was not what the Founding Fathers were intending. E.g. burning down city blocks, looting, attacking LEOs, their vehicles, precincts, etc., etc. IMO both those mobs should be considered domestic terrorists. I guess you cannot sell a WW2 Purple Heart, because you get it from a government not as a property but as an award. But it still happens … I still have my Father's CIB, Silver and Bronze Stars plus Purple Heart he was awarded in the ETO fighting the Nazis. He passed decades ago. I should have buried them with him … |
dogtail | 25 Feb 2025 2:08 p.m. PST |
Subject: Transing the Gay Awaylink
is it kind of satire? I find it hard to listen to, actually. And I am only three minutes in. |
35thOVI  | 25 Feb 2025 2:24 p.m. PST |
Dog, short answer, no it's about a waste of taxpayers money to further the agenda of the government of the time and buy votes. I did not listen, I read the story. |
35thOVI  | 25 Feb 2025 2:33 p.m. PST |
Legion not sure if you know, or not. In the US you can buy any military medal except the MOH. I have them all except it, all WW2 issues and some WW1. I thought better someone who cared owned them. Most were sold to a shop here when the family member died and no one cared any longer, or no one left. Also estate sales. So that's how I acquired them. I used to be heavily involved with WW2 vets and was a member of the 8th Air Force association. My buddy and I, used to set up displays in museums and reunions of WW2 gear and uniforms of all types. |
dogtail | 25 Feb 2025 2:37 p.m. PST |
Thanx anyway, it gives me ideas for incoming or ongoing discussions here on TMP: eternal instrumental victimhood That is what those MAGA guys are using when they say we Europeans steal and stole their defence money and think they are stupid. That is brilliant!  |
Legion 4  | 25 Feb 2025 8:37 p.m. PST |
In the US you can buy any military medal except the MOH. Yes I know that. It was not rare to buy your earned ribbons, wings, etc., from the PX. To have more than one set for Class A's, B's Dress, Blues, etc. Or even from catalogues, many online now. FWIW, I left the ROK in '85. The military finally figured out the start and end dates for a Korean Service Defense Metal. So they mailed it to me in like 2015. And they even asked if those qualified wanted to receive this metal they earned. I said yes, after 22 months in the ROK and two tours on the DMZ. It came in the mail I opened it up. Looked at it and put on my books shelve. With some other stuff from my past. You can get all metals[save for the MOH], wings, badges, Tabs, patches, etc. from non-gov't companies. But these companies must be authorized to do this. Everything has to be in accordance with US Military Specs, Regs, etc. of course. |
Legion 4  | 25 Feb 2025 8:43 p.m. PST |
That is what those MAGA guys are using when they say we Europeans steal and stole their defence money and think they are stupid. Where the Hell did you hear that? Some in Gov't basically stole $ from the US taxpayers. To give to other nations for things that were not authorized to do so. But since only very recently did anyone actually look into this. And many in the US gov't are fighting tooth & nail to stop these investigations. Guess they may be afraid the DOGE may find these "honorable" elected and appointed leaders had their hands in the cook jar(s) Or knew what was going on, and did 0. |
Tortorella  | 26 Feb 2025 6:46 a.m. PST |
35th, I usually check out the aggregate of polls on 538, which I think is the best way to look at polls. Both Trump and the direction of the country are not getting the kind of approval you might expect during the honeymoon period, but he is doing better than he has done in the past. I think his personality drags him down…his margin of victory was historically quite small. But if he delivers on policy he should get a boost. The Putin as a buddy thing is not working for me, and Musk has not done his homework on who needs to be fired. Looks at the rehires after he finds out what he has done. But look at the border…just him getting elected must have turned away thousands… a big +1. |
35thOVI  | 26 Feb 2025 7:29 a.m. PST |
Yes the border numbers are astounding. Done without that bill being passed, just the will to do it. 😉 |
35thOVI  | 26 Feb 2025 7:31 a.m. PST |
Follow up on yesterday's stories in this thread Subject: DNI Gabbard revokes security clearances, fires employees tied to explicit chatrooms link Subject: How Trump's government-cutting moves risk exposing the CIA's secrets | CNN Politics So you can't fire them, they might turn into traitors to our country. What does that say about them? link
Yes! Your taxpayer money was financing this in the UK and elsewhere. 🙄 Subject: Trump aid freeze ‘may force Stonewall to cut up to half of staff' link |
35thOVI  | 26 Feb 2025 8:15 a.m. PST |
Ok maybe they should change the animal that represents their party to the ostrich. 😉 "A staggering 75 percent of Democrats do not believe President Joe Biden's deputies deliberately kept the border open for migrants, according to a February poll by Harvard Harris. The February 19-20 poll of 2,443 registered voters comes just weeks after President Donald Trump deliberately shut down Biden's destructive, expensive, and deadly migration during his first few hours in the White House. Fifty-two percent of Americans and 80 percent of Republicans recognize Biden's Democrats — led by pro-migration border chief Alejandro Mayorkas — deliberately encouraged the inflow of up to nine million southern migrants. Those inadmissible migrants entered via a bewildering number of illegal and quasi-legal routes, such as "parole" and the "Welcome Corps at Work" programs. They were aided by billions of dollars in government funding and frequently welcomed as a boost to the economy. Amid the massive evidence of a deliberate policy, 75 percent of Democrats said the inflow "was not their deliberate policy."" |
Legion 4  | 26 Feb 2025 3:37 p.m. PST |
OVI +1 The Biden/Dem/Soros. etc. open border policy was one of the worse things that has happen to the USA. By elected and appointed Federal officials. In a very long time if not forever. They broke the law … and got away with it. |
Tortorella  | 26 Feb 2025 4:28 p.m. PST |
The worst part about it was the delay in addressing it. Biden gave no reason why it took him until June of 24 to begun tightening the border. Essentially there was not much left for Trump to do when he took office. The border was already getting quiet and just Trump's name alone was enough to lock it down. All this makes me think you are right about a deliberate policy by the Dems. It's circumstantial evidence but it makes sense. I don't really know what the massive evidence is. But the delay in plugging the holes could be made into a dereliction of duty charge. And we still have no clue about where all these people are. |
Grattan54  | 26 Feb 2025 7:23 p.m. PST |
It was a knee jerk reaction to what Trump did while he was president. Trump wanted to build a wall and stop illegals crossing into the US. So, when Biden became president, his hatred of Trump meant reopening the border. Once this got out of hand the Biden admin then lied and said it wasn't a problem. Foolish all the way around. |
35thOVI  | 26 Feb 2025 8:03 p.m. PST |
Gratten, yes definitely part of the reason. |
dogtail | 27 Feb 2025 2:05 a.m. PST |
@Legion: I even used the troll symbol in my posting, it was not totally serious :) |
35thOVI  | 27 Feb 2025 6:27 a.m. PST |
That's a troll? I thought it was the Incredible Hulk. 😉 "Hulk SMASH!!" |
SBminisguy | 27 Feb 2025 8:14 a.m. PST |
The worst part about it was the delay in addressing it. Biden gave no reason why it took him until June of 24 to begun tightening the border Of COURSE we know why -- that was the final home stretch of the 2024 Presidential election, and polls showed that Trump's message of Border Control resonated with 80% of the public. So Biden's team tried to do damage control. |
Tortorella  | 27 Feb 2025 12:48 p.m. PST |
I said that Biden gave no reason – cuz there was no good one! |
Tortorella  | 27 Feb 2025 12:48 p.m. PST |
I said that Biden gave no reason – cuz there was no good one! |
SBminisguy | 27 Feb 2025 2:07 p.m. PST |
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Tango01  | 27 Feb 2025 10:20 p.m. PST |
Could Artificial General Intelligence Adoption Start a Civil War in America? link Armand |
SBminisguy | 28 Feb 2025 4:40 p.m. PST |
a Civil War in America -- you mean we'll all start being more civil and polite to each other? |
CFeicht | 01 Mar 2025 3:50 a.m. PST |
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35thOVI  | 01 Mar 2025 5:46 a.m. PST |
"that time is over" That time ended the day the parliamentarians landed in New England and the Cavaliers in the South. This country has never been civil to each other. 🙂 |
Legion 4  | 02 Mar 2025 6:05 p.m. PST |
I even used the troll symbol in my posting, it was not totally serious :) You Trolled me !?!?!? 😯😏 OVI +1 SBm +1 |
35thOVI  | 02 Mar 2025 6:43 p.m. PST |
And this is the illegal healthcare cost in just 1 state? Subject: Blue state's 'gross mismanagement' cost $1.6 USDB for illegal immigrant healthcare: audit link "Taxpayers funded $1.6 USDB healthcare for illegal immigrants in Illinois, audit shows" |
35thOVI  | 02 Mar 2025 6:46 p.m. PST |
Subject: TRUMP EFFECT: Mexico Abruptly Extradites 28 Cartel Bosses to U.S. -- Including DEA Agent's Killer link |
35thOVI  | 03 Mar 2025 6:32 a.m. PST |
"NEW: Sen. Pete Ricketts says Elon Musk and DOGE found "stunning" waste like 37,000 software licenses for a government agency with 13,000 employees. "Many of the licenses had never been used." "We got 2.4 million federal employees. We have 4.6 million credit cards out there. That just leads to opportunities for fraud." "He said there are 22 million people in our Social Security system that are clearly dead. These are the kinds of things that open it up to fraud." "Subscriptions that aren't being used." "You have a contract officer who retired but didn't turn off the faucet. The money was still going out. Most companies getting federal dollars probably don't say anything." "Even if they wanted to say, 'Hey, we're not supposed to get this money anymore,' you'd have almost no way to find out who to contact to get the money shut off and make sure taxpayer dollars weren't being wasted." " |
Tortorella  | 03 Mar 2025 6:56 a.m. PST |
And we have almost no way to check on the context or validity of the findings. Get some forensic accountants and vet a new head of DOGE. They are on the right track, but you need professionals for a job that will go on for years. Bring back the IGs and let them do their jobs. If you have ever had a deceased relative on social security, you know how fast those payments are stopped. Stop misleading us into believing millions of dead people are getting payments. DOGE is a dodgy political entity without real Congressional oversight. It reports only things that sound good for the WH. Who will be going over Elon's government contracts? 76 billion in new contracts planned since Trump took office. 21 billion over the last decade or so. We are desperate to get rid of government waste and get some transparency. We can do better than this. |
35thOVI  | 03 Mar 2025 7:03 a.m. PST |
"We are desperate to get rid of government waste and get some transparency. We can do better than this." But Tort after all these years and many administrations… it never happened. There were oversights and Congress investigations out there ying-yang. Nothing. When the deep state gets involved, it will continue. You know that. They are vested in it all. |
Tortorella  | 03 Mar 2025 9:04 a.m. PST |
Yes, of course, 35th. But I don't call a plumber to take out my gall bladder! A cost cutting agency needs legal powers conferred by Congress. It needs to be transparent and deeply impartial. It needs expertise in the services being investigated, a basic principle of getting to the truth.(like the IGs, who are not the enemies). The head of this agency cannot have billions in tax payer dollars in income -duh…. Do you agree that a massive new deficit increase is on the way after seeing the new budget plan? How can we find someone to run an investigation Trump and the Dems would accept? Impossible with the current leadership just as in the past. Any politically unfavorable finding will be ignored. |
35thOVI  | 03 Mar 2025 9:15 a.m. PST |
Tort Subject: Citizen Free Press on X: "$300 BILLION FROM TAXPAYERS GOES TO NGOs EVERY YEAR. Nice work from @DataRepublican t.co/3dLGg0oT2d / X This is why you can't trust the Washington bureaucracy to clean up itself. link I honestly have not read the new budget, as the Senate passed one and the House another and now they have to rectify both.. to my last understanding. |
35thOVI  | 03 Mar 2025 9:19 a.m. PST |
Some more good news. And the tariffs have not even taken place and no attacks on the cartels. Subject: Reuters on X: "Honda decided to produce its next-generation Civic hybrid in the US state of Indiana, instead of Mexico, to avoid potential tariffs on one of its top-selling car models, according to three people familiar with the matter t.co/nAeDtcrzcu t.co/YXKC4eYcvv / X link Subject: Report: Mexican Cartel Leaders in Fear After Trump Admin Designates Them as Terrorist Orgs link All! English now the official language of US. Took long enough to make it official. 🙂
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Legion 4  | 04 Mar 2025 10:23 a.m. PST |
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