"Hamas vs Israel... again" Topic

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Dapeters are you insinuating she was not gang raped by followers of Islam? Or because of her career choices, she deserved to be gang raped? I am confused as to why you linked her Wikipedia page.

Otherwise her career makes no difference. I think that was all Legion said about her, is that Egyptian Muslims gang raped her.

"200 to 300 men," well, if you want to call them that.

An elderly Jewish man was beaten to death in LA by a Pro-Hamas demonstrator. The news media and Mayor of LA are really trying to walk the moral equivalency line by obfuscating what happened by using weasly phrases like "it's uncertain who started the altercation-"- a man holding a Pro-Israel sign was attacked by a Pro-Hamas supporter who beat him with a sign post, knocked him down where his skull fractured when he hit the pavement -- and he has since died.

The Mayor of LA is calling for calm…and to be concerned about Islamophobia…

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Yes SB, it sure seems to be handled much differently than some other deaths have been by the MSM and politicians. The sarcastic side of me says: there is no votes in it for them.

Stories like that are the reason more and more Americans think that "democracy" is the term for "government by sociopath." It's not that there's an inherent problem with consitutional government: it's just that three generations of politicians and their enablers in the culture have driven a lot of the civic virtue out of government.

The sarcastic side of me says: there is no votes in it for them.

Nah, that's just realism in this day and age. And since California is a defacto One Party State, that Mayor only cares about the most active and vocal and likely to vote for her Democrats and special interest and racial groups. Nobody else matters.

I think that was all Legion said about her, is that Egyptian Muslims gang raped her.

Well even according to that link she was gang raped plus the situation and location being in Egypt. I think it is easy to figure out who all the usual suspects are. Even in the link, it was heard they called an Israeli Jew. So … we probably won't need Law & Order SVU on this case.

Pro-Hamas supporters boarded a US Ready Reserve Vessel at the Port of Oakland, forcing US Coast Guard, Port Police and Oakland Police to remove them. The MV Cape Orlando is a Ro/Ro ship and was activated and getting ready to leave Oakland to sail to Tacoma, WA to await further orders.

The Pro-Hamas crowd at the ship numbered over 200 people, hundreds more blocked entry to the Port of Oakland, which is a major West Coast port.

This had to be an inside job, I've been to the Port before and it's not normal to be able for general public to get to the shipping docks. Who helped them? Find out. And attempting to board a US ready Reserve vessel is not 1A protected speech. All these people need to get hammered by the law -- but since Soros got a crazy-a33 leftist elected for Alameda County, doubtful that will happen.

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In years passed … those trying to get on board a USN vessels without authorization … they'd get shoot.

The reckoning after the coming disaster, when the American people finally realize who was on the other side, and what the consequences were, is going to be horrific.

I hope so …

Legion +1

Not sure what the status of a Ready Reserve vessel is, but my first thought was if there was a USN quarterdeck watch any "protester" who attempted to board would be shot. Hopefully it would never get to that though, as it would be very hard to cross the brow with a couple of firehoses aimed at your head.

They can "protest" just fine from outside the gate on the pier.

Don't know whether this will prove to be true or not, but if it does, file this under "there's a reason why people think all the institutions have been corrupted."

It may OR MAY NOT prove to have been the case that the AP, CNN, Reuters, and the NYT had photojournalists who accompanied the Hamas terrorists who attacked innocent Israelis on Oct 7:

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But if they did, is it surprising? Here's Mike Wallace, more than thirty years ago, essentially saying he would do the same thing:

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Yes it's true. I thought I posted that, but maybe elsewhere. One rode on the back of a motorcycle carrying a grenade. Any one of them could have warned the Israelis beforehand and saved so many people on both sides.

The USN Ready Reserve is under funded and understaffed. Thank the House, it's one of the first things to go whenever there is need of a CR or there is a shutdown.

I have no idea what happened here. If they intended to seize the ship, unlikely, but this would require it to be defended. Of course there are protocols for guarding the ship, mostly don't involve shooting civilians and I doubt any firearms were discharged. The fire hoses need to be demoed for these people and a loudspeaker warning issued. A small crew like this, maybe not in shape, would need help, which they got.

Based on the story, a number of these people need to be arrested. I would be interested to know what happens to them. There are clear and serious indications that laws were broken.

Who is in charge of the clattering train?
The axles squeak, and the couplings strain,
For the pace is hot, and the points are near,
And sleep hath deadened the driver's ear.
The signals flash through the night in vain,
For DEATH is in charge of the clattering train!

Like the man from whom that quote comes, we are facing a situation from which our leaders shrink to deal. They know what must be done, but they fear that to do it will change everything beyond recognition. So they wait; which means the outcome will be worse for the delay.

Nine pound, I don't exactly read your code. But there are still a lot of good people here and horrific is not necessarily on the way IMO. I realize a lot of things, just not the same as you do. I don't always see threats quite the way you do, but I share a lot of your values and hope we meet in the middle.

I don't insist anyone agree with me, and I desperately hope in ten years' time, I'm still here to read my old posts, and think, "boy I sure got THAT one wrong, what was I thinking?"

The problem is not that I want to see terrible things happen: the problem is that terrible things ARE happening, and the people who should be responding are not. The most generous explanation is that they simply see clearly, and are afraid of the consequences, much like Stanley Baldwin and Neville Chamberlain sought any course other than war, because they thought another war would bankrupt Britain and finish off the British Empire.

But that's just the most generous explanation. The less generous is that the rot runs deep, and we're sleep walking toward an enormous disaster involving Russia, China, Iran, and heaven only knows who else. There's nothing I want less or fear more; but I am afraid it is coming, and will be the worse for being dragged out.

I hope I'm wrong.

Nine pound round+1 – I think it's a combination of cowardice and corruption. Look at this pro-Hamas attempt to delay a Ready Reserve ship from sailing.

1. Pro-Hamas leaders in Oakland/Berkeley had the knowledge of how the US moves military resources, and information that this particular ship had been activated, and then they decided to delay that ship from sailing in case it was going to be involved in an operation that supports Israel.

How, why and who did this? Who are the leaders of this group, who is their intel/operations leader?

2. They had help inside the Port, somewhere -- because general public is not allowed to get dockside, and certainly not in such great numbers. Who was that? And were they the intel source for the pro-Hamas group?

And to Nine pound round's point -- the real response to this is that our leadership come down on these pro-Hamas groups like a thunderstorm. Arrest them for the laws they broke, question them, grab their electronics, dissect their intel op, see if they have any handlers anywhere and who the trail leads to.

But they probably won't -- they don't want to offend the activists, they don't want to be accused of Islamophobia, and they don't want to face down an african-american woman DA who is a crazy Soros leftist for Alameda county, where this took place.

SB and 9 pound

It's much, much more simple. They don't want to lose their voters and activists. These are their core. The ones who collect the mail in ballots. These are the ground troops. These same people accused the other side of being racist, homophobes AND ANTI SEMITES! But it's the other side that is supporting Israel and the Jews. It's these ground troops, media and politicians, shouting for the death of all Jews "From the river to the sea!". Threatening Jews at schools. Supporting the barbarism of Hamas. Writing anti Jewish graffiti and killing At least one Jew we know of for sure.

My fear is, we will suffer for this in the not to distant future.

I saw the scenes from the 300,000 plus "pro-Palestinian" March in England. Any Brits on here? Is Britain lost, or London? How do you see this there?

"British prime minister Rishi Sunak sacked his home secretary Suella Braverman over her sharp criticism of police amid pro-Palestinian rallies in the country. Pressure mounted on Rishi Sunak to take action after Suella Braverman's article in the Times UK criticised the Metroplitan Police for allegedly going soft on radical elements in Pro-Palestine rallies. The UK home secretary had accused the police of applying a "double standard" to rallies, particularly pro-Palestinian marches"

Subject: What Suella Braverman said on her removal as UK minister: ‘Will say more when…' | World News – Hindustan Times


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Somehow these upheaval discussions keep dissolving into politics and fear of change. I am afraid of change as much as any of you. I am not doing well coping with the domestic disorders we keep facing, issues that are far beyond current leaders in both parties to get a handle on, IMO.

This is also generational. I may be sunnier than many of you, but not always in my heart. The near future is a major test. The solutions some seek are as bad as the problems. This requires cognitive and emotional balance that our aging political candidates do not have. I am not so sure the center will hold. It feels like it has been slipping away.

But there are still too many positives we ignore in our thinking. And our position as a nation relative to the rest of the world is far better that we acknowledge here, IMO. History has answers, perhaps. We have been through a lot worse.

In my youth, I lived near race riots, saw armored vehicles on my street, heard machine guns, saw the smoke of burning buildings. Too many people shot and killed. I was in New Jersey.

Frankly you have all heard this before from me … But this is what I said in a conversation with mostly other Vets … who know the deal …

We all know you put the best man or woman for the job in any postition. Regardless of sex, race, ethnicity, etc. However, with the current trend in the WH, DC, etc. woke progressive, CRT/1619 DEI replaces the logic of the best person for the job. And if they can't pass the height and weight standards, AFQT, etc., they are not fit for the job. And again, race, sex, ethnicity, etc. should not come into play. Whether maint. crews, FA, CEs, tanks, Infantry, MP, etc., etc. They need to meet the standards …

If you set low standards … you get low standards. It does not make the force more combat ready. Which should be the standard – the best combat forces in the world. The enemy does not play DEI … Since we do it makes us less combat ready …

It will be good to get new leadership that understands combat readiness trumps DEI …

race riots, saw armored vehicles on my street, heard machine guns, saw the smoke of burning buildings. Too many people shot and killed.

You remember the BLM/Antifa riots in the Summer of 2020 ? Last count there 574 of these riots … that destroyed entire city blocks, LEO vehicles, Federal buildings, etc.

Tort I assume you are speaking of my comments about the antisemitic base, (I.e. collage students, Muslim emigrants, paid protesters, students, certain politicians and certain MSM commentators). These same people decried Charlottesville, "police violence against blacks", Republican hate and on and on. They decried those who did not want the Confederate monument taken down in Charlottesville as anti-semites. A few examples, including the POTUS.

Subject: Anti-Semitism at the Deadly Charlottesville Protests – The Atlantic


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Subject: Statement of President Joe Biden on the Fourth Anniversary of the Events at Charlottesville, Virginia | The White House


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These are just 2, you can find many on the web if you want to look.

My point; the real anti semites have shown themselves. They hate the Jews because they are, on the whole, white. Hamas and the Palestinians are not. They have been indoctrinated to despise and hate all things white. The Jews are white and therefore colonists and oppressors. Hamas and the Palestinians, the oppressed minority. The MSM ignores this (except Fox). The party in power refuses to openly condemn them as a whole (they have members who support Hamas and the Muslims and the old entrenched of the party fear them).

It was easy to condemn a few fringe right winger nuts and make them seem much bigger than they were. It buys votes.

If the party in power would come out as a whole, condemning the protestors, their members and others who support this hate, I wouldn't write it. So far it has only been a very few of them who have.

So it was political then, As it is now.

Here is another example of the one sided nature of all of this and enforces my beliefs.

Subject: FBI, DOJ Refuse To Label Covenant School Shooting As Anti-White Crime


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What have we brought in?

Subject: Muslim SHOCKS New York with TRUTH! #shorts – YouTube


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35th I was thinking in broader terms, but I know you are too. The biggest shock to me other than the sheer barbarity of the October 7 attacks, is how much our population has changed. And the vehemence of so many protestors.

Those marchers in Charlottesville were very open about where they stood. Chanting "Blood andSoil" and "Jews will not replace us" are clear to me. But they are not the mainstream right. These are not American conservative values. And there is more to the mainstream left than pro-Palestinians.

Can you be pro Palestinian and anti Hamas? Are you anti- Semitic if you are pro Palestinian? I am not well informed enough. Two sides to every story? Yes. But no excuse for barbarian attacks. I separate Hamas from civilians in Gaza, many who probably voted at gunpoint. But right now, the horror of Hamas must be ended. All I can think of is for Israel to get it over with ASAP. Get the bad guys…..then fix Gaza.

Legion I am talking about those 2020 riots and the ongoing chaos of our politics today. We have seen it before and with more damage, more casualties. Civil unrest has killed people throughout our history.

I don't know Tort. I think most Palestinians are like these in our country. This should chill you.

Subject: Darya Safai MP on X: "We are not in a sharia court here. This is not the Islamic Republic of Iran or an Islamic caliphate. It is Washington DC where these extreme threats reverberate through the speaker, where sentences are apparently already being handed down. The demonstrators are threatening… t.co/ABAqdwVjbL / X


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All these people at this rally are into this stuff? Now you have convinced me. This does not exactly have the ring of freedom, more like fight to the death!!
I hate martyr talk. People who would kill themselves to kill you are not gonna talk compromise. This is not just anti Semitic.

As I said before, we have a changing population!

Tort, sadly that is my fear.

The 300000 plus pro Palestinian March in London on Veterans day shock me up.

I am talking about those 2020 riots and the ongoing chaos of our politics today. We have seen it before and with more damage, more casualties. Civil unrest has killed people throughout our history.

Agreed … but I'd think better support of LEOs from local mayors and Governers would have made a difference. The same goes for today. But just like today with Pro-Palestinians/Hamas, the 2020 Floyd riots were both because of a false narrative and agenda. But all that is another topic and OT.

The 300000 plus pro Palestinian March in London on Veterans day shock me up.

Like in the USA today, many of the younger people, don't understand history or care. The UK and France really took a beating in WWI. But for most today it may as well have happened on the Moon.

E.g. I saw a FOX interviewer ask a young woman about the Cold War. She said we fought the Russians and because Russia is cold, is why it is called the Cold War … 😮

Hamas Wanted To Push Towards The West Bank On October 7

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Armand

Tango I was surprised they did not coordinate with hezbollah, West Bank Terrorist and other terrorist, in a coordinated attack from multiple sides. It's good they are not smarter than they are.

Tort, today is a grand opportunity for the White House and the POTUS's party, to take a stand for Israel and to publicly condemn both HAMAS and antisemitism, at the "March for Israel" in Washington today.

Let's see what happens

Mike Johnson is supposed to be there.

Subject: Ariel Oseran on X: "Troops of the IDFs Golani Brigade posing with an Israeli flag inside Gaza's parliament building in Gaza City's main Omar Al-Mukhtar street, after seizing the site. A clear illustration of Hamas' loss of control over Gaza. t.co/U80Z6tXTM7 / X


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Subject: We learn hate for Israel on TikTok and Instagram: protesters


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As I said before, we have a changing population!

And who asked for this much change, this quickly? Not many Americans have, instead we have a deliberate policy by the Democrat leadership to import a huge new dependent voting class from developing countries, and to change the demography of the country. A leading Democrat from Texas even chortled a few years back that mass migration is how they will "turn Texas blue."

And at the same time, the same Democrat leadership promotes policies of social atomization and separation using racial politics and racialist rhetoric to keep the new migrant populations from assimilating into American culture as all past successful waves of immigrants have done. They work to keep them ghettoized as outsiders pitted against general society so they can control through fear and racialist rhetoric and collect into isolated interest groups they pull together under the banner of "intersectionality" and racial politics, each urged to compete against the other as the most energetic victimized class. To stir them up with angry words, to inflame emotions, to get them march, to agitate, to intimidate -- and to vote only D…always and only that.

It's all very immoral and purely for Party political power gains, the rest of the nation be damned. And that's why we have a sea of pro-Hamas supporters marching down Broadway, occupying Lafayette Plaza in DC and swarming the gates of the White House, beating on the doors of a library in which they've trapped Jewish students, and calling for genocide while trying to claim victim status. Oh, and beating and actually even killing Jews and pro-Israel supporters. And not getting arrested. They are the protected Street Soldiers of the Democrat-Left. Few arrested, even fewer punished -- the police told to stand down while they riot and do things the average person would be arrested for, and Leftist DAs refusing to prosecute those arrested.

Some won't believe this… but…

Subject: Exclusive footage from the operations in the Rantisi Hospital – YouTube


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SB.. This is a bipartisan @#$& up. It's about power and money on both sides. Neither party's wealthy have hesitated to use illegal immigrants as a cheap workforce, including immigrant children in the meat processing industry. Who's been mowing the grass on those golf courses?

I don't see any master plan from the left or right on immigration. I don't see anyone with a rational understanding of the negative or positive impact of immigration, what it has meant to our history, how to run it safely and get the best of it. In short I don't see any leadership. Because whatever the Democrat Party wants, the Republic Party also wants. Fighting over the mess is a great vote getter issue for them, which is one reason why it's never been truly fixed.

SB.. This is a bipartisan @#$& up. It's about power and money on both sides.

I don't disagree with that -- the Establishment Democrats want to import new voters, the Establishment GOP wants to import cheap plantation workers. Both are immoral.

I don't see any master plan from the left or right on immigration.

Not true. The "right" advocates a simple policy path we know works.
1. Enforce border security
2. Deport illegal aliens
3. Punish employers for using illegal aliens

That's the framework, you can work from there.

Well that's part of it, but they leave out huge issues like legal status options, integration into society – the whole process, goals and restrictions etc. it's a lot easier to slam the door, even though we cannot seem to move that needle either. But if that's the policy, we miss out on some of the world's best and brightest, and we hurt our reputation as the land of the free…. too free sometimes.

Hamas Wanted To Push Towards The West Bank On October 7

Just like I want to go out with Nikki and Brie Bella … that ain't gonna happen either …

What made Hamas think they'd ever make it beyond what they did ? FWIW, last body count I heard Hamas a lost @ 2000+ KIA …

Subject: U.K. Terrorism Official: There's A ‘Real Acceleration' By Iran To Assassinate Enemies On Foreign Soil


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I'm surprised too… not good feelings between those two…

Armand

Subject: About 300 Jewish people headed to DC Israel rally left stranded by bus drivers staging 'deliberate and malicious' walkout


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"According to the report, pro-Palestinian protests and outrage are heavily funded by wealthy US-born tech entrepreneur Neville Roy Singham and his wife, Jodi Evans. Since 2017, Neville Roy Singham has been the main funder of The People's Forum. It has coordinated at least four protests since the first attack by Hamas on Israel on October 7

But Neville Roy Singham was not just an ordinary Marxist. He is also a Chinese sympathizer living in Shanghai. He has close ties to at least four propaganda news sites that promote the Chinese Communist Party's image abroad, The Times reported."

Subject: Neville Roy is the lion who funds pro-Palestine protests!


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Our response?

Subject: US Navy destroyer shoots down drone from Yemen in the Red Sea | Fox News


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So will they be out of jail today? 🤔

All wearing shirts with the same slogan. Organized? Who paid for things? 🤔

Subject: Pro-Palestinian violent protest erupts outside DNC headquarters in Washington DC, Capitol police injured


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