"Regulations of the Year XXII (La Bataille Rules 4th Edition)" Topic
11 Posts
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| GeorgBuchner | 05 Aug 2023 9:59 p.m. PST |
i forget if i asked about this previously – maybe tangentially, but the la bataille games seem so enticing with their complexity – could they work for miniatures? could one just use the regulations of the year XXII book or would the actual games be needed for unit stats – no way else one can get those details is there? |
 Dal Gavan  | 06 Aug 2023 12:34 a.m. PST |
I toyed with a miniatures version of them (pre the Regulations) for a while, Georg, but they made for a long, fiddly and slow (never finished) game. The ratings (morale, fire multiplier, melee rating) change from game to game and while it was fairly easy to average out the French, it was much harder for the Russians, Prussians and others because the ratings varied so much from the earlier games to the later ones (eg Wagram to Dresde Austrians). Yet I've played several of the boardgames to completion (Moscowa- 2nd Ed- several times) and enjoyed them. We were using multi-base units, which may have created a lot of the issues. The rules may work better with just one or two bases per unit, like Might & Reason. If you give it a go then please let me know how it went, mate. PS It may be too "chart heavy" for a lot of gamers these days. |
| GeorgBuchner | 06 Aug 2023 5:22 a.m. PST |
thanks Dal for your reply – i like chart heavy stuff, and fiddly rules i like too
could one work it out without owning the games – they look very nice, but are very expensive – i prefer games with just 1 or 2 bases a unit, – ie regiment and division level stuff |
| Dal Gavan | 06 Aug 2023 5:11 p.m. PST |
You can get some of the counter values from photos on BoardGameGeek (eg link ) but some of the information is on the charts or in the game-specific rules book. You can get a lot of information by downloading the Vassal module for each game (you'll need to install the Vassal application as well), but not some of the specific game rules, such as the line firepower multiples. I sold off most of my collection (the joys of divorce), but is there a specific game/campaign that interests you? |
| GeorgBuchner | 07 Aug 2023 10:13 p.m. PST |
the 1813 and 1812 period interests me most – ie campaigns in russia and germany
-Borodino, Polotsk Luetzen, Dresden, Hanau, Grossbeeren etc |
| Dal Gavan | 08 Aug 2023 3:36 a.m. PST |
1813 is covered pretty well- Lützen and Dresde from CoA, and Leipzig and Hanau from Didier Rouy, but 1812 only has Moscowa. There's a vassal module for Dresde and modules for both the Didier Rouy games. These are probably your best bet, mate, as finding someone with the games who is prepared to collate all the counter values and the special rules (ie line firepower multiplier, formation restrictions, etc) is going to be difficult. I only have Moscowa, now, and it's in a box, in storage, with the rest of my board wargames. But from Vassal I can tell you that 1/13 Legere has a strength of 300, a fire value of 8 and range of 2 hexes, melee value of 8 and morale rating of 15. For 2/17 Ligne the values are 500 men, a fire value of 8 and range of 1 hex, melee value of 14 and morale rating of 15. The DoW 3/3 Linii is 500 men, a fire value of 8 and range of 1 hex, melee value of 14 and morale rating of 22. Now multiply that lot by 900+ unit counters….. Or you could use those random samples as a base, varying the numbers by one or two for each unit. PS With the morale it's a form of base 6, so the levels are 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 31, etc. |
| GeorgBuchner | 08 Aug 2023 5:13 p.m. PST |
thanks, though looking more into it there is just too much to put together and too little info on the counters and one would have to do it for each and every title, – a shame as i like the apparent complexity of the rules and what they cover.
also not sure how one translates stacking into miniature versions either |
| Dal Gavan | 09 Aug 2023 12:49 p.m. PST |
What you could do is average it all out, mate. The French Ligne in Moscowa and Wagram have a morale rating of between 15 and 25, so make it 22. Firepower (in column of companies) is 8 +/-1 for nearly every army, and while the British are higher, the line firepower modifier of X3 is about average (from memory). Melee value is strength related, of course, but a value of 2 for every 100 men in the unit. Stacking is easy because the miniatures units' bases define their position and the space they take up. Stacking is a result of the shape of hexes and counter sizes- it's a way of indicating where in the area defined by the hex each unit would be, if it was not a 5/8" cardboard square. So "top to bottom" in a stack usually translates to "front to back" with miniatures. Artillery can be deployed between the units, as it was historically, not as the top unit in a stack. |
| GeorgBuchner | 09 Aug 2023 6:33 p.m. PST |
okay yes maybe that would be the way to do it – coming up with suitable general conversions of the values. I would though like to know alot of the what the actual ones used in the games are – for all the units, cavalry artillery etc also
- would be good to get the details for a few battles to get an idea |
| Dal Gavan | 10 Aug 2023 4:23 a.m. PST |
As I said, mate, you can download the modules for Vassal and have all the counter values. Moscowa will give you French (including the complete Garde), Poles, some minor German states, Italians and Russians. Dresde gives you Prussians and Austrians. Talavera gives you British, Spanish and Portuguese. It will take a bit of time and effort, but I can't see another option unless you buy the games. |
| GeorgBuchner | 10 Aug 2023 8:44 a.m. PST |
ah yes, sorry i keep forgetting about vassal – i have used vassal before to play the old Waterloo wargame with someone, so i will check it out |
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paints the Dogman from the Flintloque starter set.
