"Württemberg artillery in 1870" Topic

Hello everyone,

Since 1864, the Prussian breech-loading system had been in use in the Württemberg artillery.

The steel guns were all ordered from Krupp.

So the old Württemberg carriages of the English model were adapted, so that the new Prussian breech loading could be used.

English model carriages???

Does anyone know how the carriages of the English model were in 1864? If anyone had any artwork?

Thanks

Here is a photo I found of a 12 pound Armstrong from 1865. This is a British piece in South Africa from the information that was with the photo.

So the Krupp tubes of the Württemberg guns would be mounted on this kind of carriage?

Here is another image, an artists rendering of a Krupp gun with carriage and caisson.

I would assume they would use the carriage with possible minor alterations as seen in the first photo.

Thank you for this beautiful illustration, but it is not Württemberg artillery…

I looked at many, many images/photos of krupp artillery. All of the Krupp artillery from 1860 to 1900 were mounted on very similar carriages from nations from Chile to China. I see no reason to believe Wurttemburg would choose a carriage wildly different from what seems to be a common type for nations using Krupp artillery.

I don't understand that either and yet that is what is indicated on page 312 in volume 1 of the book "Franco-Prussian War 1870/71-Uniforms and Equipment of the German and French Armies". edited by Verlag Militaria.

Same problem for the Saxon artillery in 1870, page 264 of the volume quoted above it is written "The Saxon artillery struck the same Krupp guns as the Prussian artillery. The new guns like the old ones, had to be mounted on steel carriages .The old Saxon steel carriages were therefore modified and adapted to the new guns. When the Prussian regulations came into force, the particularities of the Saxon carriages were taken into account".

I would imagine the problem was financial. Your source for both these statements is unimpeachable, and Markus ‘NapStein' of this forum? Is one of the co-authors; and in good academic fashion both of these statements are footnoted.

The Wurttemburg army of 1866 had Krupp artillery

Chad47, it's not about the guns but about their carriages and I would like to know how they were?

Paskal is right with his summary, the Krupp guns were used with the lighter "English style" carriages. As it is easier I give the German text of the part in the regimental history of the 2nd Württemberg field artillery regiment no. 29 (published in 1892):

"Verschiedene Versuche mit Fahrzeugen führten im Jahre 1855 zur Annahme des sog. englischen Blocklaffetensystems. Die Protze hatte eine Gabeldeichsel, in der selben ging das Stangenhandpferd, welches vermittelst eines sog. Lannenträgers das kleine Vordergewicht der Protze trug, letztere war zum Sitzen für 3 Mann eingerichtet und war innerlich mit einer Holzfächereinteilung für die Geschosse versehen.
Die Lafette bestand aus 2 kurzen Wänden, die hinten durch den abgerundeten Schweif verbunden waren, an diesem war der Protzring angebracht, der in den hinter dem Protzkasten sich befindlichen Protzhaken eingelegt wurde. Der Hinterwagen des Munitionswagens hatte zur Aufnahme der Munition 2 Kasten von gleicher Größe.
Das eingeführte Fahrzeugsystem zeigte neben außerordentlich hoher Beweglichkeit große Leichtigkeit. Dasselbe erwies sich bekanntlich als so dauerhaft, daß es nach fast vierzigjähriger Einführung und zwei Feldzügen jetzt noch – nur wenig aptiert – teilweise das Material der Infanterie-Munitionskolonne bildet"

So the old C/55 carriages were still in use during the FPW, some minor modifications had to be done to maintain the Krupp guns.

In the "Strack von Weißenbach" (history of Wurtemberg artillery) I have a sketch of the C/55 (but just from the side) – if you want, I may scan and provide it.

Greetings from Berlin
Markus Stein

Dear Markus,

Yes any photographic documentation or graphic illustration is welcome, thank you.

Now for the the lighter "English style" carriages, if you could tell me which English guns, the carriages were used, that would make things happen.

Pâskal

As the 6& 12 pdrs Whitworth Rifled guns never equipped the British artillery!

I think more and more strongly that the Württembergers used the British gun carriages used in Crimea and during the sepoy revolt because before 1864 the Württembergers did not use rifled guns.