"Ukrainian Patriot system downs Russian bomber" Topic

The Ukrainian military has used the Patriot air defense system to shoot down a Russian bomber…

Ukrainian Pravda: link

The headline in the Russian media was "Russian Bomber Destroys Patriot Missile"

I guess all of the guff the Patriot has gotten through the years was a tad bit off. I wonder what air frame was shot down? Bear? Backfire?

Also where was that bird? I doubt it was over Ukrainian air space. It was probably in Russian skies and heading towards its firing point (?) when the Patriot sniped it. The Russians have been using a lot of SSMs and glide bombs to do stand off attacks.

Sounds like Ivan has another problem to sort out.

Did see a headline saying Ukraine was denying it but can't immediately Google anything to corroborate that. Also seen it suggested it was inside Russian airspace… which is interesting on a number of levels.

We'd all like to know what happened, but I don't think we can know. Googling around, I read that they shot down a Russian bomber with a Patriot missile, that they *deny* shooting down a Russian bomber with a Patriot missile, that it was a fighter bomber, that it was a fighter, and that it was two fighters. You have a wait a few days in these cases. The people publishing these stories just want clicks, and they don't know which aircraft are which anyway. The last thing they care about is getting details right.

Well that is what the Pats were designed for. To shootdown enemy air assets.

I await further intel on this downing …

The pastor of my church was a computer programmer before he became a pastor. He did some contract work for the defense industry. He held a security clearance at one point. He told me that whatever the stated range on a weapon system is, you should double or triple it if NATO made. Capabilities are always downplayed and kept quiet.

Assuming he is telling the truth (I do because I know the man) and apply that with patriot missiles that we gave Ukraine and you get a 200-300 mile effective range. If the Ukrainians hit an aircraft in Russian airspace from that far away it will raise eyebrows and maybe give away capabilities our adversaries weren't aware of. Good reason to downplay.

The best way to destroy enemy military equipment is journalists and bloggers. The costs are minimal, the range is not limited, the effect is loud, albeit short-lived. Yes, this is not true, but who will remember this in a couple of days?
When did people stop demanding proof? ;-)

When Russia is involved. Can't trust anything that comes from Putin, Peskov, or Prigozhin.

Capabilities are always downplayed and kept quiet.

Yes standard OPSEC … you never show the enemy your entire hand. Or better yet any of your hand.

Can't trust anything that comes from Putin, Peskov, or Prigozhin.

That should be on a T-shirt …

You cannot believe Putin, Peskov and Prigozhin, and therefore you do not need proof of Ukrainian statements?
You have a flawless logic :)
Congratulations!

You cannot believe Putin, Peskov and Prigozhin

Yeah … what else is new ?

I don't think anyone said they believe the Ukrainians outright on everything. Just that we know the Russians are lying. Makes it easier to trust the guys who didn't start this war and lie about everything along the way

Yeap ! Sounds about right !

smithco +1

Editor Bill: Why is an (unnamed) propagandist for a terrorist regime, led by a terrorist dictator who invaded an independent, sovereign nation and has and is committing war crimes on that nation, allowed to post here at all? Would you allow an acolyte of Osama Bin Laden to post here?

Asking for a friend.

Yeah Bill…. what's with all those banners about your bullying policy all about? You know… people that want other people cancelled? The people that believe opinions are offensive and violence…. A policy clarification might be necessary to those that can't puzzle it out…

Would you allow an acolyte of Osama Bin Laden to post here?

Killed him + 2 of his sons !

Along with :

AZH
AZK
Baghdadi
Suleimani

To name a few …

The pejorative boomer got thrown around earlier which tends to have a particular meaning in the US context and is typically used by people on certain side of the political spectrum….

Glass houses and all that.

But the fundamental problem is that everything the Russian state says or their media projects, and media in Russian is not free, is considered to be lies by quite a lot of people in the West. And that reflects who somehow feel that Putin has any rational or morale right to his position. That makes people rather cross in the context of a conflict that has resulted in stolen children and dead bodies buried with their hands tied and bullet wounds to the skull.

Old habits …

Fixed because apparently I can't construct a coherent sentence…

And that reflects on those who somehow feel that Putin has any rational or morale right to his position.

No one in the West could actually support Putin's invasion of the Ukraine. And the Russian War Crimes that are going on there now.

No one in the West could actually support Putin's invasion of the Ukraine.

Unfortunately… though it is perhaps questionable to what extent they support Putin's regime and to what extent they are simply 'outrage merchants' looking for clicks and views.

link

link

There will always be some like that …

"War is good for business."…
"War is bad for business." …
But no matter how bad it gets … someone makes a profit." …