"Fairfax and I am fairly confused !" Topic

I'll start again . The bug has struck I think as everything got duplicated ,actually quadrupled

I am just wondering if one of you ECW experts out can give me a definitive list of the Fairfax Foote Regiments that could have been at Marston Moor or was actually there ?

Wargames designs do 2 flags .One on Sheet 9 labelled as Sir Thomas Fairfax but it was Sir William Fairfax's regiment that is listed in my Orders of battle? . The other flag is labelled as Lord Fairfax's Regiment of Foot on sheet 10. Again blue but a different design .
Some authors I have noted are very vague as they dont want to get it wrong and so label everything as "Lord Fairfax" but as most of the clan had titles its difficult or vague as to which unit they are referring to .
I am sure I am not the first person to be confused by the Fairfax Clan references nor the last I suspect .

Have you tried the BCW wiki?

link suggests that William F's regiment was indeed at Marston Moor but its flag is unknown.

link suggests that Thomas F was Lieutenant-colonel of Lord Ferdinando F's regiment.

There was also a Sir Charles Fairfax his Regiment of Horse, which I think missed Marston Moor because he was helping the Scots out at Sunderland.

Thanks Guys

I did try the BCW but there are units that they say appear but not in the orders of Battle .

Sir William Fairfax's Regiment of Foote is one . Its listed in the Regiment section as being at Marston Moor but doesnt appear on the Orders Of Battle on Wiki !

As regards Charles Fairfax there was 2 of them! Neither I think had a part to play at Marston Moor thankfully as I would be more confused than I am now lol .

Lord Ferdinando Fairfax – commander of the Northern Association. Colonel of RoH and RoF. RoF led in the field by Sydenham Poyntz. His RoH were understrength at Marston Moor, most likely led by lieutenant colonel Spencer and/or brigaded with
Norcliffe's RoH.

Colonel Charles Fairfax, Ferdinando's brother. Reticent soldier, better known as an antiquarian. Raised a RoF in 1648 during the Commonwealth. Not at Marston Moor.

Sir Thomas, later Lord General was
Ferdinando's son. Lieutenant general of Northern Association. Colonel of his own RoH. Led Northern Association horse at Marston Moor.

Colonel Charles Fairfax, Thomas's brother/Ferdinando's son. Commanded his own RoH at Marston Moor, where he was killed.

William Fairfax – Ferdinando's nephew (son of Philip Fairfax who I believe was another brother of Ferdinando). Had a RoF (led in the field by Colonel Thomas Morgan – RoF 'probably' at Marston Moor), William led a wing of horse (including his RoH) at Marston Moor. Killed a few months later at Montgomery.

Yep those Fairfaxes can be a pain!

Foot of Lord Fairfax's army at Marston Moor:

Lord Ferdinando Fairfax,
Bright,
Constable,
Overton,
Thornton,
Dodding,
Lascelles,
Ashton (Assheton)
Sir William Fairfax (probably?)

The first 8 are given by Brigadier Young in Marston Moor, where he also adds Rigby, who it now appears didn't make it but remained back in Lancashire, the regiment having been severely mauled at the storm of Bolton. Possibly Ashton as well??

Sir William Fairfax's foot isn't mentioned at the battle but he was there leading his horse so it seems likely.

Regarding flags you likely have the ones ordered for Charles Fairfax in 1649 after the 2nd Civil War (blue, stars, Fideliter faeliciter etc) but Charles wrote to Sir Thomas mentioning they were like the ones Tom had used previously. Sadly that's pretty much as close as we can get to any flags from this army apart from Doddings.

I must admit that the Fairfax's army hasn't received the attention it deserves and my wiki entries are looking pretty thin – any additions gratefully received!

Just a quick question to KYPD, iirc Poyntz was still abroad at the time of Marston Moor?

So to sum up for wargaming:

Coat colours – Bright's might be in green lined yellow (a shaky reference), William Fairfax's might be in grey (based on a guess about their predecessor Edgehill Rgt) and that's about all we know. Grey seems quite common Up North though.

Infantry flag colours: Possible one of the Fairfaxs' regiments might have had blue colours with white stars, like Charles F several years later. Doddings' Rgt had blue flags with yellow estoiles (wobbly stars) according to Fahnen & Standarten – for the rest no info survives afaik.

I hope someone's going to write a nice book on the Northern Association!

Thanks guys a lot of Fax to digest ,

Fair play to you and thanks

Hi Tim, away from books so can't check. Wrote above from memory. I was under the impression that Poyntz was back before Marston Moor. Could be wrong

If it wasn't Poyntz in field command, I wonder who was? Sir Tom was lt-col having just taken over from Wren (but Tom was busy elsewhere that day); no idea who was major.

Hi Mike,

Our old friend from Grantham's, Lt Col Holman had left to start his own regt (although what they got up to I don't know). Wren was nexr in line but left in May 44 to start his own horse Rgt. Tom Fairfax didn't get the Lt Colonelcy till autumn 44, so must be someone in between.

"Curious and curiouser" said Alice.

I am now officially intrigued. (Alas busy with something else at the moment) Thanks Tim

p.s. are you off to Worcester on Saturday for the Helion beano?

Sadly not Mike, this one passed me by and they're sold out now :-(

Keep us posted on what Ed Furgol says especially :-)

Hi Timbo

I do wish someone would do a book on the Northern Association .I also use the rule if in doubt use grey .

I have just nearly done Colonel Rigby's regiment of foot and again its one of those that could have taken place at Marston Moor but nobody appears certain as the unit as mauled in my home town of Bolton by Rupert's Royalists .

Some say he led his unit at Marston Moor and recruited numbers on the way to Marston Moor . So I would imagine they would be quite green. Anyway I am using this unit because of the local connection to me .

I will also be having a pint or two in the Man and Scythe pub in Bolton which is the 4th Oldest pub in England and Lord Derby was executed just outside. The pub has in a cabinet the chair he sat on and an ephagy of his head .One day I intend taking pictures but there is always someone in the way . There are lots of civil war stuff on the walls as well .

If anyone is in Bolton it is worth a visit and the beer and cider all real is very nice.

Yup Ashton and Rigby I've heard both ways. Just checked 'the Road to Marston Moor' where they're included but not with great certainty.

All the best for Saturday and say hi to Ivor Carr if you run into him, he's our Parliamentarian expert on the BCW wiki and usually attends.

Hi Tim, will do

(I believe that Ed is reworking and revising his history of the Covenanting armies)

Mysteron – there's quite a lot of sites with a Civil War connection in Lancashire. Just north of Bolton is Turton Tower. Lots Blackburn way. See
link for more details. (Old Man and Scythe appears in my Rupert's March North part 2 link )

Just visited a few more sites that will appear on the Lancashire entry later this week

Thanks mate