"Chinese spy balloon the size of three buses is spotted" Topic

… floating over Montana for DAYS as US mobilizes F-22 Raptors to intercept: Biden wanted to shoot it down but Pentagon advised him not to because of falling debris

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This spy balloon has been over the US homeland for 3 days!!!! The Chinese are clearly testing US AND Canadian political and military responses. What is astounding is that the US is permitting the Chinese to keep their spy balloon in American airspace. The right thing to do is to immediately shoot down this spy balloon…

Armand

Why is it even a debate? Shoot it down or capture it if it is over our skies. It is violating our airspace and is unmanned- so I don't get the hesitancy.

Exactly, blow it out of the sky, then pull an SR-71 out of mothballs and send it over the length and breadth of China, just for grins.

I do, TG. Bought and paid for.

"but Pentagon advised him not to because"
…the NSA is probably mining the spy balloon for signals intelligence. They'll learn more about it's capabilities and networking if it's operating than from pieces on the ground…

Shocked a Chinese Ballon is being permitted to fly over the US, you might think the Chinese have something on the US government to be able to fly with impunity

So capture it. Letting it continue allows China to continue to receive intelligence.

No it does not. Its basically a cheapo satellite and can be managed as far as intel gathering, from what I undertand. These guys are chronic and compulsive spy geeks.

You may have heard the Chinese are very upset right now with us over the four new bases we are building on the north coast of the Phillipines, not too far from you know where. Not the time to shot down the balloon.

I noticed the British newspaper reporting on this thought it was fine to print maps of US positions in the upper Midwest.
The balloon could have saved a trip.

But…. Blinken has now postponed his trip to China because of the balloon. That'll show 'em!

"but Pentagon advised him not to because"

…SecDef Austin owned stock shares and a position on the Board of Directors of the Chinese company that manufactured the balloon…

Say, nice of the Pentagon and Biden to confirm for the Chinese that they could float a series "harmless" balloons carrying lead shielded EMP Nukes across the US for a poor man's first strike EMP attack, or to release a bioweapon, or perhaps a drone swarm strike. Way ta go team!

And now our friends to the North have their own:

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Well, I hope you are wrong SB. I am guessing we know what this ballon has and does not have, but if they keep em coming, we will take them out if we are not using them for our own counterintelligence and they could be weaponized.

I hope the Intel we are getting on the Chinese from this ballon is useful in the future.

None of the media coverage is giving us a clue, just the usual know it all stuff. The Fox military advisor ignored a question about whether we were neutralizing this ballon, wanted it shot down. The military was concerned about collateral damage, but who knows what else is going on with this thing.

I am guessing we know what this ballon has and does not have, but if they keep em coming, we will take them out if we are not using them for our own counterintelligence and they could be weaponized.

There's no way we could know what's being carried on such a balloon if it is properly disguised and shielded. So all our Pentagon can do short of an in-person visual inspection at 60,000 feet is guess what they think is onboard.

From the Cold War we know of Soviet plans to put EMP Nukes in orbits that crossed a specific grid across the US, under the guide of a satellite's onboard radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG) power source. Oh look, those are just low orbit weather sensing and comsats, no need to be concerned. What's that you say, the satellites all cross orbits over the US several times a day in a very particular configuration and altitude that would be ideal for a national-scale EMP strike? That's just crazy talk!

Just started a thread on this. I Posted – "IT IS BAAALLOON !"

For us old timers That quoted is from the old TV show "F Troop". From the Chief of the Hakawee tribe upon seeing a US Army Balloon. Floating in their Direction.🎈

All kidding aside, just saw a Pentagon Briefing about PRC civilian "Weather Balloon"[ah yes the old weather balloon a ploy !]over the USA. Right now over Montana, IRRC Malstrom USAF Base which has nuke ICBMs. The PRC didn't ask if they could fly a civilian[yeah right!] weather balloon over the USA. The Pentagon said this has happened before[?????!?].

The balloon is 2-3 Gray Hound buses long with a payload underneath full of "weather instruments" … The Payload is about the size of a Gray Hound bus too.

It is pretty clear this is a PRC/CCP surveillance aircraft.

This is/could be considered an act of war.

They violated our airspace. Which is against international law. They must know that. NO They do know that …

The PRC/CCP said it was an accident[yeah the dog ate my homework too!] I was going to say how stupid do they think we are. I think that is pretty obvious to all of us.

I think they are testing, etc. our leadership[don't get me started on that!]

They're seeing how far they can push us. They see/know the capabilities of our elected & appointed officials. You all know my assessment of that.

We can't shoot it down over our airspace, as it might fall on civilians and structures, etc. We may have to wait until it is over the ocean. But at this point, the Gov't is working on it[!?!?!]. It should have been shot down over the ocean before it got to our shores. We can say we thought is was aliens.👽 Two can make up outrageous stories, Yes ? 🛸

Are the PRC/CCP taunting us ?

The PRC/CCP asked us not to shooting it down[!?!?!!??!].

But the PRC/CCP said they were very sorry this drifted into US airspace.[Can you believe how stupid they must think we are !!!!?].

The balloon is heading East now across more of the US. … But the Pentagon says they are tracking it and gaining intel(?).
Plus, the PRC/CCP are sending enough drugs to wipeout everyone in the USA according to the CBP/DEA, etc. Thru our totally open Southern border by the Cartels, using the masses of illegal aliens as cover. IIRC Mao said on Guerilla Warfare about " swimming with the fishes". Good example here IMO.

So, IMO again, very, very weak feckless, incompetent, etc. US leadership … Drugs & now this intel gathering balloon floating West to East over the entire US.

WDF !!!!!

As a vet, I find this demonstration of incompetency to be completely embarrassing.

And their story is they don't want to shoot it down because it may fall on something. In Montana. One of the least densely populated states in the Union. Yeah, right.

The entire JCS should be fired or resign over this.

The entire JCS should be fired or resign over this.

And INVESTIGATED for financial and influence ties to China!

If it's an intelligence platform, it is capturing data- even passive data has use. There are ways to bring it down without blowing it sky high.

Just put a small hole in it and let it drop to a more manageable height where a helo could retrieve it, or bring it down more quickly over a location where we can just nab it.

They are definitely testing us, and apparently have been for awhile. Letting it just keep on trucking- or worse letting them keep doing it from here on out whenever they want sets a really bad precedence.

But, hey, I was only in intelligence gathering, what do I know?

To be clear. I don't ascribe to the nuts who are saying it's a virus carrier or claims like that. I also don't think we need to retaliate or do anything stupid- just bring it down and figure out what intelligence we can gain from the hardware that it is carrying (and see what we can do to tap into what data they are interested in).

We did this to Russia all the time- and they were within their rights to take our balloons down if they found them- so let's keep it in perspective, but we cannot just let them run balloons across the country whenever they like without trying to stop them.

I don't ascribe to the nuts who are saying it's a virus carrier or claims like that

Why is it nuts to observe that these platforms being floated across the US unchallenged are largely of unknown capability, from a nation whose top national leaders and military frequently opine about how they will win the coming war with America?

From the Cold War we know of Soviet plans to put EMP Nukes in orbits that crossed a specific track across the US, under the guise of a satellite's onboard radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG) power source. The satellites all crossed orbits over the US several times a day in a very particular configuration and altitude that would be ideal for a national-scale EMP strike.

The Soviets declared intent was weather observation and communications, but their capabilities included EMP strike sats. It wasn't "nuts" to be aware of that.

And it's not "nuts" to be aware that China could do the same thing via high altitude balloon if we are so complacent as to allow it to happen. Short of shooting it down or somehow getting an in-person observer on-board we can only assess this by China's stated intent (winning a war against America) and capabilities.

I said it was nuts to assume it is carrying viruses into the US. That's crazy town and something a few people are claiming.

Calm down. I am FOR taking it down and seeing what it is all about.

The entire JCS should be fired or resign over this.

The reports are they wanted to shoot it down, but was denied by CinC … I'd like to hear a confirmation of this …

Again, a threat aircraft crossed into our airspace … and it was not authorized. Our top leadership really has done 0 …

As I wrote in the other thread:

Chinese didn't have any issues knocking our spy plane down in 2001, dismantling the plane and keeping he secrets on it and holding our men for 11 days.

"The Hainan Island incident occurred on April 1, 2001, when a United States Navy EP-3E ARIES II signals intelligence aircraft and a People's Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) J-8II interceptor fighter jet collided in mid-air, resulting in an international dispute between the United States and the People's Republic of China (PRC)."

I would especially like to hear how the decisions to manage this were made. I don't mind if they leave out the mining of intel from it or other secret stuff.
I want I know because if there are parties who want to fire the joint chiefs I will go along with this if they can back it up. And by that I mean reality based information. There still is such a thing.

Nashville, I have to give you a +1 here and another for the Graceland post.

I said it was nuts to assume it is carrying viruses into the US. That's crazy town and something a few people are claiming.

Dunno what it could carry in the future, or now. But we do know it was launched by a regime that has runs ethnic cleansing campaigns & concentration camps, has an extensive gulag, conducts Mengale-style experiments on political prisoners and uses slave labor in many of the factories producing goods for the West. And they hate us.

Look up in the sky. It's a bird. It's a plane. It's a Chinese spy balloon. Nothing to see here. Go back and leave are heads in the sand or up our 'you know what'!!

Comments at the bottom of article are interesting in some cases. But it is the Chinese year of the Rabbit and it should make a good meal for an Eagle. Hopefully we are still Eagles and are not controlled by a different barnyard bird. 😉

Subject: China spy balloon shows country is preparing citizens for war that could come at ‘any time': expert | Fox News


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And the view from the other side of the table from my previous post, is only fair.

Subject: Chinese spy balloon poses 'no imminent danger,' top Foreign Affairs Democrat says


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How do you shoot it down?

I'm sure they can figure it out. 🙂

A little humor for the moment:

"Since "Chinese Spy Balloon" is trending: In 1945, the crew of USS New York spotted a sphere that they thought might be a Japanese balloon weapon. The captain ordered it shot down but none of the guns could score a hit. Finally, a navigator realized they were attacking Venus."

I said it was nuts to assume it is carrying viruses into the US.

Could be a dry run.

…SecDef Austin owned stock shares and a position on the Board of Directors of the Chinese company that manufactured the balloon…

Any proof on that claim?

Any proof on that claim?

That's sarcasm, but who knows since SecDef Austin has been a Board Member of Raytheon and multiple other defense contractors for whom he now approves contracts, and our system is awash with Chinese money and influence. And certainly the Biden family has taken millions in Chinese cash.

I posted this on another thread here –

IIRC a couple of F-22s were launched to observe or intercept. If fighters couldn't shoot it down, I'd think we have SAMs that could take it out. Again, it should have been KO'd over the ocean. Before it crossed into our air space. Over the Aleutians, etc. or in an unpopulated area of Alaska. I think we want to get the devices in the payload. So overland would make it a lot easier. Betting the payload has some US tech. I'd think we'd want to get this balloon & payload for intel.

Note: the US had used "balloons" over A'stan for intel, etc. purposes. So, we have "balloon" tech. Balloons have a lot of loiter time. So, I don't think as some in the media, etc. mentioned there may be a balloon "gap"… I don't think that is true.

Former SecDef Mark Esper interviewed this morning, said it may be the PRC Military launched this without Xi's OK ? That could be an "interesting" scenario, if true.

As I have said, the Pentagon reported they are "jamming" the device so it can't send intel back to the PRC/CCP.

Another Chinese "weather" balloon has been reporter over Venezuela.

This is clearly a Chinese "plan" to have this seen. As they have like us have orbital assets that can do the same job AFAIK.

What is the PRC/CCP reasons for this obvious balloon flights ?

If we are jamming it, they now know we have the tech to do so. I'd think they'd know that already ?

Is this a diversion, feint, demonstration, etc. ?

Are they testing, mocking, etc. the USA's top leadership ? I think those reasons may be valid. They again are making it clear to everyone, they can enter US airspace for intel gathering, etc. and the weak Betas, etc., of our leaders are allowing it.

They are taking a Big Dump 💩💩💩 in USA's yard and we are letting them …

Just like with COVID, the Chinese drugs coming across our open Southern Border, and now the intel gathering Balloon. Sounds like they the US gov't has failed in its #1 mission – protecting its own people. And they PRC/CCP knows it.

Just heard the Balloon has been flying at 30,000ft. also … that makes it an easier target. But they seem confident we won't shoot it down. I hope the Pentagon has a plan to deal with this. Will the current leadership allow the US Military to execute this "Top Secret" plan. If in fact, we have a plan ?

The PRC/CCP is the Predator i.e. the wolves and we are the sheep … This is embarrassing to me and I'm sure others who have in their youth have taken an oath to defend our Nation against enemies both foreign & domestic. A very, very sad state of affairs …

I have heard multiple military people say this is navigable. If so, why haven't the Chinese steered out of our air space as quickly as possible, instead of a cross country "Around the World in 80 Days" trip?

If these are are so difficult to bring down (if not impossible based on the Canadian F18's attempt), and we fear civilian casualties, what happens the next time? What will they load them with next time? What if they send tens, hundreds, thousands?

We know what the Chinese, Russians and North Koreans would do if we penetrated their air space. We have precedence based on 2001 to take any action we deem necessary.

Right now China is testing out our administration and they are found wanting. China does nothing without a reason.

Remember there is another of these floating below the border.

Subject: Joe Biden Should Be Embarrassed By That Chinese Spy Balloon – 19FortyFive


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News says it has been shot down link

Damon.

So not that hard. 😉 should have been downed off Alaska originally.

From what I understand, the President wanted to shoot it down right away, but as advised by the Pentagon officials that it wasn't a good idea. So I think it is important to point fingers at the right people, rather than make assumptions.

The balloon was shot down over the Atlantic, so they were consistent in their concerns about debris landing in occupied areas.

Damon.

Also there is a balloon that was also spotted over Venezuela. I wonder what the Chinese are spying on here, or in Colombia. It is also possible it overflew Ecuador. I can guarantee there is nothing here the Chinese are super interested in. Except a hydro Dam project that they are declining to correct problems on…

Damon.

Sorry Garand, I don't put much faith in what he says. He has not in the last 2 years plus, given me many reasons to believe much of what he says. Others are welcome to believe him. But that is my opinion.

After all, he is the president. He has the final say, not his advisers.

Alaska is next to an ocean too.

Waiting until it had crossed the US, was weak. But maybe they knew something dangerous was in the payload. I doubt that, but that gives the administration an out if they are looking for one.

Considering the military wasn't the first to bring it up that it was flying over the US but a civilian in Montana, my guess is the military wasn't even thinking of bringing it down

From what I understand, the President wanted to shoot it down right away, but as advised by the Pentagon officials that it wasn't a good idea. So I think it is important to point fingers at the right people, rather than make assumptions.

Do we know that for a fact ? The JCS waited ? The Pentagon said they jammed the signal being transmitted to the PRC. Reports said the Military was getting intel from the balloon.

I have little faith in what our elected & appointed officials. If the Military did jam it and got intel from it, then I could see why they waited. But again, based on the top leadership's decision cycle … I'm skeptical …

Before we point fingers I want more information.

I have heard multiple military people say this is navigable. If so, why haven't the Chinese steered out of our air space as quickly as possible, instead of a cross country

Yes it could and was steered. The NORAD track saw that, I'm sure. E.g. it flew around Russian territory. Then over US bases … it was not just floating around based on the winds.

my guess is the military wasn't even thinking of bringing it down

NORAD, etc. started tracking it as soon as it left the PRC. Again we knew it was coming. The Military said they jammed the signal and was getting intel. If that is true, I can see why they waited to shoot it down. As any intel the Chicom balloon would have been getting was jammed. But it still maneuvered over many of our bases?

I posted this on Facebook – it may be "germane" :

It should have been shot down over water or in the wide open spaces of Alaska. Before it could float over many of our bases.

Who was going to get hurt but some fish if it was shoot down near the waters of the Aleutians. They are US territory. If is was shoot down over the open huge swaths of empty areas in Alaska. Maybe some trees or Bigfoot might have been hit. … Also The F-22 can fly up to 65,000ft. And in many cases the balloon was flying lower than that, e.g. about 30,000.

"President Joe Biden tried to take a victory lap Saturday afternoon after the U.S. military shot down a Chinese spy balloon that Biden allowed to travel across the entire country before destroying.
Biden claimed in remarks to reporters that he "ordered the Pentagon to shoot it down on Wednesday as soon as possible," but that the decision was made to not shoot it down over land because debris could cause damage when falling to the ground.

U.S. officials were reportedly "well aware" that the balloon had crossed into American airspace on January 28 and that it was over Idaho on Tuesday, but decided not to inform the public to not upend Secretary of State Antony Blinken's diplomatic trip to China.
Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin said that the spy ballon was sent to the U.S. "in an attempt to surveil strategic sites in the continental United States."
Sen. Susan Collins (R-ME), the Vice Chairman of the Appropriations Committee and a member of the Intelligence Committee, said in a statement that Biden should have taken out the balloon much sooner "over remote areas of Alaska or Montana.""

over remote areas of Alaska or Montana.

Just so they don't hit Dutton's Yellowstone Ranch if they chose Montana !

My God that's it!!! They were afraid of destroying the rest of this season!! 😱😫😉

FYI Legion, you're not close to the massive train explosion are you? Pretty big, I saw the films.

So they shot it down over the Atlantic when it didn't matter and nobody can recover the wreckage. Gee, that's not suspicious at all!

It's in less that 50ft of water. It can be recovered. So I understand they are doing just that.

Damon.

I mean, even an Imperial Probe Droid did not last as long on Hoth as that spy balloon did… ;-)

warm up the icbms