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"Indigenous Peoples, Metals of Honor & Massacres" Topic


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Personal logo Legion 4 Supporting Member of TMP05 Sep 2022 8:06 a.m. PST

An interesting article in Military.Com :

link

Personal logo ColCampbell Supporting Member of TMP05 Sep 2022 8:33 a.m. PST

Yes, it was. Not wanting to start anything but I do hope that most, if not all, of the medals do get revoked.

Jim (US Army, retired)

35thOVI Supporting Member of TMP05 Sep 2022 9:37 a.m. PST

Revoke them if they like. Maybe in the short term it will appease someone, It won't in the long run change anything. It never seems to.

Both sides, (whites, blacks, Hispanics and maybe some asians) and (Indians), were guilty of Atrocious acts against men, women and children. There were evils Perpetuated by all sides and no one was more holy then the other. Soldiers were awarded war honors for it and some collected scalps. Indians were awarded war honors for it and collected scalps. I am not discounting Indian on Indian violence, as we know that happened as well.

I do not call them Native Americans, as to my knowledge no group originated here, everyone migrated here. They were just the first migrants in a long group of migrants, that is still going on to this very minute.

Just a very few examples:

Subject: August 30, 1813: Worst Indian Massacre of Settlers in the South (Fort Mims Massacre) History and Headlines


link

Subject: Indian massacre of 1622 Wikipedia


link

Wackmole905 Sep 2022 11:19 a.m. PST

Yes revoke all MOH, Let be honest they were all racists through Korea.

McKinstry Fezian05 Sep 2022 2:14 p.m. PST

I can differentiate between broad revisionism and specific corrections for acts of cowardice. The Medal of Honor has become an honored symbol of ultimate sacrifice and courage and in specific cases where the recipient was a coward deliberately killing women and children, I would support a correction.

Korvessa05 Sep 2022 5:25 p.m. PST

I will defer to the good colonel's judgement, but I think that it would be well to remember a few things (speaking generally, not specifically about Wounded Knee):
1) Why soldiers fight and why politicians send them to war is not the same thing.
2) Personally, I think that the giving of medals for valor is just that, and should not be confused with the righteousness of the cause, or lack thereof. It seems to me that most soldiers are fighting for their comrades not for the political aims of the politicians.
3) If I am not mistaken, the Medal of Honor was the only medal of valor available at the time. Had their been others, like there is now, I am quite sure many would have received something else.

Personal logo Legion 4 Supporting Member of TMP06 Sep 2022 8:42 a.m. PST

Yes revoke all MOH, Let be honest they were all racists through Korea.
Hyperbole right ?

IMO FWIW Some time some/many today try to put today's standards, morality, ethics, etc. on past historical events, etc. We should try to protect the honor & integrity of the Army and the MOH. My standpoint, maybe MOHs should not be awarded for a massacre?

We took an oath, and words like duty, honor, integrity, bravery, courage, etc. should mean something. But things were different back then in many ways. Again, we can't put today's standards, ethics, mores, etc., on what happened in the past.

And as always CD, the killing of non-combatants is always possible. Plus, in some cases intentional, in this case probably payback. And then the cycle continues …

Both Indigenous People[AKA American Indians] and US Soldiers died in this battle.

So now if the MOHs are taken away from those awarded in this battle, who and what is next ?


2) Personally, I think that the giving of medals for valor is just that, and should not be confused with the righteousness of the cause, or lack thereof. It seems to me that most soldiers are fighting for their comrades not for the political aims of the politicians.
3) If I am not mistaken, the Medal of Honor was the only medal of valor available at the time. Had their been others, like there is now, I am quite sure many would have received something else.
I think all this should be taken into consideration. Korvessa +1

But if women and children were purposely targeted as it is said that occurred that may change the over "big picture". But remember all the killing if settler women & children by "American Indians". May have influenced what the US troops did. I don't think there are a lot of clean hands and many shades of gray during the Indian Wars.

Legionarius07 Sep 2022 7:48 p.m. PST

Real war, as Sherman said, is hell. Happily, it is not so on our tabletops:)

marco56 Supporting Member of TMP08 Sep 2022 7:04 p.m. PST

Americans developed the method of attacking villages because it was so hard to bring the indians to battle. It may not be a fair way to fight but to save your own you will do about anything. I'm not saying it was right but we never lived on frontiers like they did. Check this book out. link
Taking those medals does not change anything as all those people are dead.
Mark

GamesPoet Supporting Member of TMP12 Sep 2022 6:04 a.m. PST

The Native Americans were "migrants"? No, no, no, they were ancestors of migrants from much further back than their own more recent history. That's not to say they didn't migrate over the land they valued, yet still it's a difference.

steve dubgworth22 Oct 2022 11:43 a.m. PST

if we look at the UK we have been invaded and colonised by wave after wave, romans, saxons, jutes, angles, normans not to mention celts each wave showing appalling levels of barbarity to the "native people" and the invaders.

the we of course is me.

After looking at my dna I have traits, of all of these plus for some unaccountable reason north african, i suspect moorish raiders in the southwest of england

each one fought for what they had and what they wanted and symbols of honour were given and expected as well as loot and human prizes.

we should therefore not be critical of any one side or other as it was how things were in those days.who was there about to tell us it was wrong?

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