"During the Civil War, Gen. Ulysses Grant Began Expelling" Topic

…. Southern Jews—Until Lincoln Stepped In

"The 1862 letter was short, but its meaning was clear—and devastating. "You are hereby ordered to leave the city of Paducah, Kentucky, within twenty-four hours," it read.

Cesar Kaskel couldn't believe it. He had emigrated to the United States after leaving Prussia, where he was discriminated against and financially ruined because he was Jewish. Now, the Union Army was telling him he was being expelled from his new home and his business for the same reason…"

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Armand

"Grant had to deal with numerous speculators who followed his army in search of cotton….In December 1862, Grant's father came to visit him along with friends from Ohio. Grant soon realized that the friends, who were Jewish, were speculators hoping to gain access to captured cotton. Grant was furious and fired off his notorious Order No. 11….Grant later admitted to his wife that the criticism of his hasty action was well deserved. As Julia Grant put it, the general had "no right to make an order against any special sect."

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Grant was a flawed man but he acknowledged those flaws. In my opinion, it is one of the many things that made Grant a great man and leader.

Thanks.

Armand

No man is perfect. Grant was a good man, a good general, and he did what was required for a good cause. He has my vote.

+1 Legionarius

B

I agree, if ever an American deserved to have his history rewritten it has been Grant. Special thanks to author Ron Chernow.

Disagree. I think the traditional history has been fairly kind to Grant.

Bill-
I recall people saying he was a drunk,, a butcher who was oblivious to heavy losses, a failure as President. In fact somewhere in my youth I read that he was drunk for much of the Vicksburg campaign.

But maybe I am wrong and others can set me straight.

Glup!

Armand

But maybe I am wrong and others can set me straight.

Ok, You really need to do a deeper dive into actual facts rather than "recall people saying…"

Yes Grant drank, but it was mostly when bored and there was little action going on. Grant was not oblivious to heavy losses, read his recriminations on the attack at Cold Harbor.

While there were scandals during his Presidency, he did much for civil rights and took other positive actions that were overlooked at the time that modern historians have given him credit for. Certainly was a better general then president, but given the times, not a failure, just not one of the best presidents.

Kim

No, that was not the point. I read Chernow, White. These newer histories are a deep dive and I think they refute previous accounts in many cases.

I am talking about the way Grant was previously characterized in history by some people and I am asking about whether I am wrong about that.

Tortorella: I recall having the same impression based off of what they taught us in school (in NJ) and books I read 30+ years ago. Something to the effect that Grant was a drunk who likes cigars and was willing to pay the butcher's bill in casualties to bludgeon the South into submission. His presidency was handled with even less positive spin. Even then I thought it seemed like a harsh assessment of the man.

The traditional histories I read didn't say Grant was a drunk, or that he was a butcher who was oblivious to heavy losses. What they said was that in Grant was accused of these things during the war.

If you doubt that there were rumors about Grant being a drunk during the war, both Sherman and Lincoln have memorable quotes that played off of those rumors. Halleck had accused Grant of drinking after Donelson and the press reported he had resumed drinking after Shiloh. It is also fairly clear there were perceptions in the north that Grant was a butcher, both after Shiloh and during the Overland Campaign. The traditional histories I have read are correct on what the perceptions were of Grant at times during the war.

As to Grant being a failure as a president, this is a matter of opinion.