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"US says it wants to "help rebuild" Somalia, sends troops" Topic


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SBminisguy17 May 2022 6:51 a.m. PST

The Biden Admin reversed the prior POTUS' policy and has announced it intends to "help rebuild" Somalia and has sent the first batch of US troops for a "persistent" presence. The Admin says it intends to have a "cap " of 500 troops, primarily special forces in that country.

Biden sending US troops back to Somalia, reversing Trump pullout

link

jsmcc9117 May 2022 6:52 a.m. PST

Didn't we do this in the 90's and it went so well?

rustymusket Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 7:02 a.m. PST

So when is "Demo Day", as Chip calls it on "Fixer Upper"?

35thOVI Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 7:37 a.m. PST

I have to ask why, why does he reverse everything that the previous administration did? Even if reversing them is Detrimental to the soldiers and citizens of this country? I am not talking specifically about Somalia, but it does fit the overall trend of his decision making.

0ldYeller17 May 2022 8:07 a.m. PST

35thOVI – yup – childish reactions to the previous administration. Going back to Somalia – bad move.

Tom Molon Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 9:00 a.m. PST

Unfortunately it seems our political system has degenerated into doing everything possible to discredit, demonize, and reverse the policies of the other side, with the good of the country a far, far distant second, if it ever enters into the thinking at all. I know I'm generalizing, stereotyping and profiling, but I think there's enough of a sample size in the never-ending news cycle to justify my thinking.

Andrew Walters17 May 2022 9:16 a.m. PST

I'm sure they've learned the lessons of history and this time will be different.

I am all in favor of helping other countries, and I hope that's what's happening here. But, you know, history.

Pray for our deployed folks.

Wait, didn't Biden just pull out of Afghanistan? Has anyone established that this is different or are they just doing whatever?

SBminisguy17 May 2022 9:43 a.m. PST

Wait, didn't Biden just pull out of Afghanistan? Has anyone established that this is different or are they just doing whatever?

Oh, well, the defense support contracts will be new and different! And rather than shift already-paid-for equipment from Afghanistan to Somalia, since we gifted the Taliban all that $80 USD Billion worth of stuff, we get to buy all new stuff for Somalia! See how that works out nicely??

And the current regime running Somalia has a firm-ish grip on at least the capitol…mostly…so…except for most of the north of the "country" which has declared itself to be the independent state of Somaliland…or the large chunks controlled by various Islamist groups and warlords…but other than that, totally stable you guys!!

Red = Regime controlled, all other colors are contested territory.

Legion 417 May 2022 9:47 a.m. PST

Well … we do have troops all over the world. Just so we don't lose any. That is what is important.

We are in Somalia, again, to help them combat AQ affiliated AS. As we see many in that region can't do it on their own without our help.

I'm sure we will/are using a lot drones hunting AS, BH, etc.

Choctaw17 May 2022 9:52 a.m. PST

What could possibly go wrong?

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 10:36 a.m. PST

It's not a lot of troops but the support will help keep an eye on our terrorist enemies there.

35th, remember, Trump did the same reversal dance when he took over. It's what they do now in this era, I guess.

SBminisguy17 May 2022 10:49 a.m. PST

Trump did the same reversal dance when he took over. It's what they do now in this era, I guess.

Not really. Trump felt the US was over extended, too many military obligations and conflicts around the world that did not directly serve US interests, so his goal was to wind down these deployments. That's what he campaigned on, that's what he delivered on. OTOH, the current POTUS has decided to re-involve the US in a civil war in a heavily divided failed state in a contentious part of the world. Can't see anything going wrong with that decision…

Col Durnford17 May 2022 11:08 a.m. PST

Total waste of lives and treasure.

Gear Pilot17 May 2022 3:18 p.m. PST

It's not like no one ever warned us this would happen.

"The alternate domination of one faction over another, sharpened by the spirit of revenge, natural to party dissension, which in different ages and countries has perpetrated the most horrid enormities, is itself a frightful despotism. But this leads at length to a more formal and permanent despotism. The disorders and miseries, which result, gradually incline the minds of men to seek security and repose in the absolute power of an individual; and sooner or later the chief of some prevailing faction, more able or more fortunate than his competitors, turns this disposition to the purposes of his own elevation, on the ruins of Public Liberty…..
It serves always to distract the Public Councils, and enfeeble the Public Administration. It agitates the Community with ill-founded jealousies and false alarms; kindles the animosity of one part against another, foments occasionally riot and insurrection. It opens the door to foreign influence and corruption, which find a facilitated access to the government itself through the channels of party passions. Thus the policy and the will of one country are subjected to the policy and will of another."

Thresher0117 May 2022 3:52 p.m. PST

Sad, and I suspect it will have the same success as under Clinton.

Systemic Stupidity (Copyright 2020 – 2022) IS real.

35thOVI Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 4:45 p.m. PST

Let's hope we don't have a "Black Hawk Down 2".

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 5:24 p.m. PST

We put people there to help them deal with a bunch of angry America hating vicious terrorists. I am not getting the despotic part of this action. I feel like I have the same rights I had last week and I am generally glad to be here instead of somewhere else.

I am not a big fan of endless deployments and botched withdrawals, or bad deals with Iran. I am not a big fan of isolationist nationalism either. Our recent and current crop of leaders do not inspire me with confidence. My hope is that we survive the next ten years and develop better choices to vote for.

SB, I wasn't being critical of Trump, but yes he did start right off with exec orders reversing OBama policies. That's how it works now.

suka194517 May 2022 5:42 p.m. PST

Don't we ever learn anything from our past history. I feel we keep doing the definition of insanity.

SBminisguy17 May 2022 5:45 p.m. PST

<q.SB, I wasn't being critical of Trump, but yes he did start right off with exec orders reversing OBama policies. That's how it works now.

True, but then that's why he was elected. People voted for him knowing he had promised to end the forever wars. Biden had never mentioned Somalia or Africa in his election run, nor has his Admin articulated any actual policies except – we have to fight bad guys there. Ok, for how long? What does any measure of success in a country in a civil war look like? You know, details…

35thOVI Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 6:03 p.m. PST

Democratic deployments and withdrawals have not given me a lot of confidence lately. Clinton and Mogadishu, Obama/Clinton and Benghazi, Biden and Afghanistan. So my confidence in this at best is skeptical.

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 7:03 p.m. PST

But if you make this political what about Bush/Cheney and Reagan re the things you mention?

Cheney planned Afghanistan with the CIA and the Bush cabinet one weekend at Camp David, I believe. The Pentagon never even had a plan before this

Then there was Iraq, no WMDs, poorly prepared deployments("you go to war with the army you have") I won't speak for how things went there. I know some who were there but I was not.

The worst embassy assault was not Benghazi but Beirut under Reagan, correct? Found to be poorly managed as well, far more American dead, but this one was not politically weaponized like Republicans did with Benghazi.

There were at least 2 or 3 embassy attacks during the Bush years resulting in American fatalities.

You are right to be skeptical. There are plenty of risks… but not just from Dems. The other party has had its own screw-ups.

Prince Alberts Revenge17 May 2022 8:12 p.m. PST

You are right to be skeptical. There are plenty of risks… but not just from Dems. The other party has had its own screw-ups.

Very true. I am a conservative but have been up close to see how the sausage gets made to have any faith in either party to make the best interests of the country the #1 priority when it comes to either domestic or foreign policy.

Both parties have made poor decisions when it comes to nation-building; it's folly to think one can "develop" Afghanistan, Iraq or Somalia when the people don't want it themselves.

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP17 May 2022 8:40 p.m. PST

I don't want us to build any nations. I just want to save this one from AQ types over there.

I have also been up close. There is hardly any difference from one party to the other. As we used to say when a new admin came in: " I hope they don't try to help us too much".

Legion 418 May 2022 4:59 p.m. PST

The Pentagon has been saying AQ & ISIS-K are planning to attack the US. As soon as they get organized, etc., plus jihadis are flocking to join their ranks. We may again, see some form of islamic terrorist's attacks, in a year or two if the intel is correct.

Our open Southern border does not help either. At least 42 were captured by LEOs that were on the terrorist's watch list. Probably twice that number got away.

All that being said, we are not building a Somalian nation. That like in many places don't do well with that. We are just still fighting radical fundamentalist fanatical islam. AS & BH is Africa and ISIS in Syria.

Heedless Horseman18 May 2022 8:39 p.m. PST

If USA wants to 'rebuild ' Somalia,' Good Luck!
UK does not want to know.
Somali 'Gangsters' are some of the worst we have… do not need any more.

Thresher0118 May 2022 9:32 p.m. PST

The USA can't even fix its own cities, so I don't see how the hell they think we can truly help others overseas.

The only successes are/were Germany and Japan after WWII, but that was done by "the greatest generation".

Those following in their footsteps pale by comparison, and have not subsequently succeeded in other efforts, despite even hundreds of BILLIONS, if not TRILLIONS of dollars being spent on numerous pet projects.

Foreigners beware.

microgeorge Supporting Member of TMP19 May 2022 6:03 a.m. PST

Perhaps they're wanting to use Somalia as a test case. If they find something that works they can apply the fixes to Portland, Seattle, Baltimore, etc,

Legion 419 May 2022 7:38 a.m. PST

I think this plan to rebuild Somalia would be, as with most of the region, it would be a waste of time & money, for the most part. Many in the West have been down that path before. And don't want to do it again.

As far as US big cities … I doubt if they ever can be saved. That is fine with some in US leadership positions, it seems. Plus things have been so bad in many of those cities for so long. Don't know if they ever can or will be fixed.

ROUWetPatchBehindTheSofa19 May 2022 8:01 a.m. PST

Is it really rebuilding or merely an attempt to arrest its descent into a BH controlled sinkhole? And a BH controlled sinkhole would destabilise the entire region which isn't exactly brimming with countries noted for strong Ukraine-style social cohesion. Also its a region close to and connected to the Arabian Peninsula. That's probably a region that needs more Salafist lunatics for neighbours like a hole in the head.

Legion 419 May 2022 8:05 a.m. PST

Let there be no doubt. AS, BH, AQ, ISIS, etc. are better off dead than any other option. Seems we can't "talk" to them reasonably. They are religiously inspired fanatics …

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP19 May 2022 12:54 p.m. PST

Is there a plan to rebuild Somalia? I thought this action was about terrorist activity there.

Legion 419 May 2022 4:57 p.m. PST

As I said, if there is actually a plan to rebuilt Somalia it will all be a total waste of assets… again. This sort of "plan" would come from very naive' unicorns and lollypops, etc. types both elected & appointed in leadership positions.

The only reason to be there is to kill islamic terrorists/jihadis … In large numbers & often … IIRC this is the way we were trained to execute this type of mission. old fart

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP20 May 2022 11:15 a.m. PST

Yes. Exactly. If there is some other plan, we can start a different thread.

Striker23 May 2022 9:46 p.m. PST

I hope our new NATO buds can throw in their lot. Nothing like a boondoggle when there's' more languages being spoken.

jeffbird24 May 2022 1:25 a.m. PST

Somalia, desperately needs rebuilding. In the early 80's it was a gorgeous country to travel round. Mogadishu had lovely Swahili buildings, which a couple hundreds of years old. Great times over there.

Legion 424 May 2022 7:05 a.m. PST

IMO … Somalia like many places in Africa and even the Mid East need outside support, rebuilding, etc. Does the West have the $, will, etc. to do this at this time or any other ?

How much $, time, etc. has been spent up to now thru out those nations & regions over the decades since after WWII ?

I have nothing against those nations save for the jihadis that are in some of those countries. But there are many, many, many places and things that need to be "fixed" in the USA. Especially currently … 'nuff said …

jeffbird24 May 2022 8:41 a.m. PST

But what has caused all these Jihadis, the removal of a dictator. For all the bad, they kept every one in check. Remove them, anarchy. Somalia, Iraq, Libya etc etc.

Legion 424 May 2022 9:04 a.m. PST

Can those jihadis, etc. cannot effectively be removed ?

Guess not ?

So they are answer to stability ?

If so we don't need to waste anymore time or $ and more importantly our blood.

Tortorella Supporting Member of TMP24 May 2022 10:49 a.m. PST

Whatever caused them to arise there, they are not good. Going after them where they live makes sense.

Legion 424 May 2022 4:57 p.m. PST

That is the strategy … kill them there not here.

Interestingly, just saw on the news. An Iraqi who was on a guest visa or something like that. What arrested by, IIRC, the FBI. For planning to kill former POTUS G.W. Bush. As revenge for the GWII, etc. He was here "legally" it seems.

We know 42 on the Terrorists' Watch List were caught trying to cross the Southern Border. At least one was caught, let go and ICE had to recapture him. No one knows how many "terrorists" crossed the border. Along with the masses of illegal aliens. And if they plan on doing a terrorist attack ?

So much for trying to kill them over there … An open border makes it too easy for terrorists, criminals etc. to come here to do harm. Or they can just get a guess visa, etc. Seems most of us know that … but the tail is wagging the dog … again …

BTW Gitmo has a lot of open cells …

'nuff said …

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