"NATO Has Already Crossed Vladimir Putin's 'Red Line'" Topic

"Russian President Vladimir Putin has repeatedly warned NATO about interfering in the Ukraine war, even going so far as to bring up retaliation if Ukraine becomes a threat to Russia because of Western help. According to some experts, NATO has already crossed the line that Putin has said would justify an attack from Russian forces.

Last week, the Russian leader said during an address to lawmakers that any countries that "create a strategic threat to Russia" in Ukraine can expect "retaliatory strikes" that would be "lightning fast." Even before Russia began its attacks on Ukraine on February 24, Putin made public warnings. Last November, he said his country would respond if NATO crossed "red lines" by providing Ukraine with certain missile strike systems…"

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Armand

I find it interesting that leaders like Putin and Kim expect others to behave differently from how they act. Putin attacked the capital of Ukraine, how about Ukraine attacking the capitol of Russia? No, can't do that, that's an escalation.

How about Japan start test launching ballistic missiles into the waters off the coast of North Korea. No, that would be irresponsible and provocative.

Mike Bunkermeister Creek

+1 Bunkermeister.

'Red Lines'are just words… but things are very dangerous.
Pretty sure NATO personnel will have been on Highest 'Alert' level… for over 2 months… they will be getting worn down… and nowhere near troop numbers as WW2… or 'Cold War'… for rotation.

IMO NATO has done much more than Putin thought. And the Ukrainians have out soldiered the Russians way beyond what Putin and his GENs thought.

+1 Legion 4 – this has all the signs of a classic miscalculation and an underestimation of what NATO and the EU would be willing to do short of getting formally involved on the ground.

+2 Bunkermeister…

They are ridiculously cynical…

Alas, sadly, Putin doesn't seem to have crossed NATO's or the U.S.' red lines, despite committing genocide, war crimes, a naked act of aggression against a peace-loving neighboring society residing next door, killing civilians including women and children indiscriminately, and leveling whole cities to the ground with artillery fire.

A pity that once again, after WWII, a rogue leader is permitted to commit such wanton mayhem and murder in Europe, and the world won't stand up forcefully enough against him to put a stop to it.

this has all the signs of a classic miscalculation and an underestimation of what NATO and the EU would be willing to do short of getting formally involved on the ground.

There was talk about ending NATO, many were not paying their dues, etc., etc. But the old & new NATO showed Putin this is not 1945. NATO should take full advantage of supplying the Ukraine with all they need to weaken Putin so that he can't do this sort of thing again.

That was not the original plan how to handle this[If there ever was a plan other than an OPLAN at the Pentagon]. But with the Ukrainians out soldiering the poorly trained, motivated, lead, supplied, etc. Russian forces. This is something that surprised everyone. Especially old Cold War Warriors, as that is what they call us. The vaunted former Soviet forces only have performed only marginally.

The West is still too timid and too worried about their economy. We can't cut off Russian oil and gas our economy will tank. How about if Putin sends in a couple armored divisions to your country will you cut off Russian oil and gas then?

Perhaps the West should set up a few red lines for Putin to worry about. ow about no Russian naval vessels in the Black Sea? How about no Russian aircraft within 100KM of the border of any NATO nation that borders Ukraine?

Mike Bunkermeister Creek
Bunker Talk blog

While this war is a horror from a humanitarian viewpoint, I think talk about red lines and not stopping Putin miss the mark from a military point of view.

As long as NATO keeps supplying the Ukranians with war materiel, the Russians continue to suffer punishing loses. They have been exposed and the threat posed by conventional Russian forces grows weaker all the time. Western military leaders could not have hoped for a better outcome, except for the tragic suffering of Ukranian civilians.

Stand up to Putin? His self inflicted wound may be fatal. Help the Ukranians make it so seems to be the right way to go.

Legion has summed it up well, and while there is still the threat of Russian nukes, the Russian military is bleeding out in a war it should never have fought.
I would take the Ukranians as NATO members in a heartbeat when this ends. They are smart, determined, tough.

With Putin's plan to take the Ukraine in shambles. This may lead to Putin being pushed out of power by the Russians themselves. We can hope …

Let's hope so, but even if that happens, it's kind of a reroll after that.

Well there is clearly some unhappiness about the state of Russia among it populace assuming its not the Ukrainian army burning down recruitment centres across the country. Actually Russia seems pretty fire prone in general and not just those bit close to the Ukraine border!

(smile)

Armand

"Burn Baby Burn !"