"Hardly a revelation I would of thought...." Topic

Hardly a surprise though quite why the Russian's feel the need for some kind of formal investigation I don't know. I assume they will use the output as some form of propaganda. Though where they think it will get them who knows. It would hardly be diplomatic leverage.

link

I would kinda like to see NATO countries to at least "dip their toe" into things a bit. Nothing blatantly obvious but gray area stuff should not cause WWIII. Now the US doing it might be too far. We need to stay out of direct conflict. Europeans can justify some gray-area involvement if necessary.

Yes, because all of Russia's past actions were so trust worthy and reliable, we'd believe them! NOT!! AT this point, why would they think the world would believe anything they present.

Anything Russia/Putin says cannot be considered from a "reliable source" …

The West by and large seems to be going by the established Cold War play book for this type of thing – 'defensive weapons' and military advisors were on the table. And didn't start WWIII back then….

The West has already crossed some of the lines set down by Putin regarding equipment supply of the last few weeks and there has been no response. Frankly even if they were fighting on the front line where has he got to go short of nuclear annihilation? This isn't really a proxy conflict where Putin can threaten to unleash the Russian army in support of his puppet (And frankly for the next decade or so that threat really won't carry much weight).

What!!! I am shocked! There are NATO forces in Poland a NATO country! NATO maybe aiding Ukraine! Shocked I tell you shocked.

Grattan –

RIA quoted a Russian security source as saying about 20 members of the SAS had been deployed in the western Lviv region, close to the border with Poland.

ie in Ukraine not Poland.
Slightly different.

I like the old Cold War rules – no direct fighting between Russia and NATO on the ground (or in the air or at sea). That way nobody accidentally escalates to WMD.

Let's keep it there. Or have we all forgotten where 'dipping a toe' is likely to take us?

Russian pilots flew in Korea and Vietnam, and Russian AAA forces fought in Vietnam as well. Both sides' forces have fought in the other's proxy wars.

I don't think the current crop of Western heads of state have forgotten the playbook or have at least been advised how to play by it. So no toe dipping – nuclear weapons tend to focus thinking for better or worse. The real problem is that we can't be entirely sure what the heck book Putin is using! Though clearly his army is continuing to use a least significant bits of the old Soviet one (to their detriment IMO).

Yeah, I realize that now. I didn't read close enough.
Ah well.

I think it time we let various willing NATO countries fight the Russians.

What!!! I am shocked! There are NATO forces in Poland a NATO country! NATO maybe aiding Ukraine! Shocked I tell you shocked.

😱And it's been happening for some time. The US has about 4000-5000 troops training with the Poles and probably other NATO troops there too. The US AFAIK always has 4000-5000 troops in Poland.

However, I don't doubt US CIA, a few Spec Ops as well as a few other NATO SF troops, etc., maybe "wandering around" the Ukraine. US has had SF, NG troops, CIA, etc., there since 2015 training the Ukrainians up until a few weeks before Putin crossed the border.

Looks like the training paid off … especially with the Russian military's marginal performance.

Latvia have also been heavily involved in training Ukrainian battalions and Latvia has pretty much gone all in on light infantry. Wonder if that has any correlation with Ukraine's apparent relative success in using light infantry?

I strongly suspect that the eastern base where the 'foreign legion' was assembling that got hit in a missile strike may have been hosting NATO SF as well. Its been oddly quite given that some non-Ukrainians were killed and wounded in that strike.

If the Poles and Estonians want to fight let them as long as they keep the fighting in Ukraine, put our troops on the Polish and Estonian borders if Putin Attacks then he has broaden the war or whatever he is pretending it is.

Wonder if that has any correlation with Ukraine's apparent relative success in using light infantry?

Well being a former Light Infantryman in the 101. Light Infantry in closed or mixed terrain, e.g. urban/MOUT … Dismounted Infantry with man packed AT weapons. Can do a lot of damage if trained and employed properly. Light Infantry uses stealth in many cases. To set up AT ambushes, etc. Again fighting combined arms using mortars and FA supporting fires. And maybe CAS if available.

put our troops on the Polish and Estonian borders if Putin Attacks then he has broaden the war or whatever he is pretending it is.

US has about 4000-5000 Troops + stationed in Poland continuously for some time. NATO has troops in the Baltic States as well. Putin knows if he attacks a NATO member he will have to deal with the rest of NATO.