"Saving the colors? Good or bad? Honorable or not?" Topic

So I was watching Zulu Dawn last night. In the movie, after a time, the commander "gave up" and decided it was time to save the colors and orders two lower ranked officers to try & save them. He then went to his tent to write a letter home.
As I was watching the film, it struck me that sending the colors away while the men were still fighting was bad form. Nor did I see anything particularly heroic about abandoning the men. Then while doing some reading after the film, I came across this quote from the next general in chief:
I don't like the idea of officers escaping on horseback when their men on foot are being killed.
I read that the widow of one of the officers campaigned for him to be awarded the VC
I don't know, seems to be like the officers who stayed fighting with their men until the end (like Burt Lancaster's character) instead of fleeing are more deserving.
What are your thoughts?
Is saving the colors as depicted in the movie more honorable than defending them to the very end?

Both Officers got the VC and both were killed. The Staff was discovered later in a Zulu Kraal.

Saving the colors was very important. All was lost, and two more dead officers on the field wasn't going to accomplish anything. I bet if the men were polled, they would have voted to save the colors.

As to saving the Colours, I think it very much depends on the culture of the particular army. Off the top of my head I can't think of any army from the early modern age onward that was indifferent to the idea, but there was considerable variation on how serious it was. An important wrinkle (no pun intended) is how much said army's attitude was mirrored by public opinion, as well as how much that public opinion counted. I think Pulleine's decision was based partly on the British Army's fetishization of the Colours (which was pretty high) but just as much on the public's reaction, not to mention HM.

It can look a bit strange in small colonial actions. I think the "save the colors!" reflex came from larger European battles, where captured colors--like captured cannon--were proof of victory, and people like Frederick the Great and Napoleon I tended to come down hard on regiments which lost them. By the latter years of the 19th Century, it was bone-deep instinct.

But as 79thPA says, the battle was already lost, and losing the colors as well would only have added to the disgrace and given the Zulu more propaganda points.

That said, I don't recommend grabbing the colors and riding for safety until the C.O. specifically orders you to.

The horse business is another issue. Brave Men's Blood talked about the officers being professionals and dying with their men, and it's true for the South Wales Borderers. But other "professionals" with horses seem to have survived in about the same percentages as volunteers with horses. In the words of Binky Bagshot "you can't give a lift to everyone fleeing a great British disaster: you'd need a bus."

We do remember how Flashman won his VC?

Of course we do! Bravely saving that fort by wrapping those colors around his own body. 😉

the period of warfare has a lot to do with how important the colours were. I read an account in the early 1700s that a British unit escaped from capture by standing the colours up against a hedgeline and sneaking away with no shame. I have forgotten the exact battle.

They were extremely important in the Civil War. Color Guard was considered an honor, and in many cases a death sentence. Men fought to the end to protect them and to capture them. I seem to remember one unit ripping theirs to pieces before capture and distributing the pieces to members.

I know 2 of the colors of the 35th Ohio Volunteers still exist. One in Columbus and one being restored just south of where I live. Both sadly, not in the best of shape.

I think the commander on the ground knew better than anyone if and when the colors should be saved.

Harry Flashman would have said, "he died a hero attempting to save the colours, the fool."

I agree with 35thOVI. My readings have led me to the conclusion that the loss of a regiment's colors exerted a considerable morale effect upon the unit.

Any efforts to represent this aspect within miniature rules depend, I think, on the scale of the rules. In F&F Brigade Level, a good argument can be made that it is already "blended" into the melee results. For regimental level rules, I'd suggest penalizing or preventing any rally attempts by a regiment that has lost its colors.

Strictly my own opinion, of course.

B

In the middle ages it was a big deal to lose your feudal lord's banner. It was often carried by a trusted knight into battle. You might be just talking modern era but thought I would interject.

Timely and apropos interjection, rampantlion.
IMO, the two are interrelated traditions

B

I give a infantry Battalion a extra point if they take a color or lose a moral point if losing their color. Hasn't happened to many so far.

Also in ancient Rome was a real disgrace for a legion losing the eagle. One thing that Germanicus did, when avenged Varus' defeat, was regain the eagles (two on three) stolen by the germans.It was so important that the legion cash and soldiers' savings were hold in the same tent, robbing something under it was a sacrilege, and punished accordingly.