"Battle of the Catalaunian Plains 451 AD" Topic

I am just starting up my next big project: The 451AD Battle of the Catalaunian Plains. I am aiming to get about 1500 figures in 28mm to play out this battle.

I have bought a number of books by MacDowall and by Syvanne, which seem to be some of the few that are available that even discuss this battle.
Both of the books make extensive use of the text by Jordanes written in the 6th Century.

In going through the books I have been struck by how different the interpretations of the authors are and sometimes how selectively they use the Jordanes text. These differences are making it interesting to decide how I want to represent the battle. They seem to allow me a lot of artistic license.

On my blog: collegeofkings.com I have started to review the information that I have, in particular how it relates to the Jordanes text. This process is quite long so I have decided to split it into two parts.

I would welcome any comments from the community about the battle and also any recommendations for further reading to give another view point.

I played that battle with Simon MacDowall, twice. Lots of fun! Memorably in the second game I (as Aetius) fought a single combat with Atilla. And lost.

The Society of Ancients Battleday for 2013 was Chalons/Catalaunian Plains/Campus Mauriacus. There is a brief "battlepack" at link and a long and occasionally useful discussion on the Society of Ancients Forum at link

There is a 19th-century French paper at link which I found enlightening as to the site of the battle. I attached a rough English translation near the end of the Forum thread mentioned above, but I don't know whether non-members will be able to access attachments.

Hi guys, I ordinarily lurk (I just don't have that much to say) but in this case it just so happens that I wrote my Doctoral thesis on the Hun kingdom, and devoted a chapter to this battle. So if I may make some observations,
1. I distrust Jordanes. I believe he was trying to shoehorn the evidence into a classical battle like Marathon or Cannae. But the confusion he describes doesn't make sense within the context of a classical battle.
2. We need to consider the nature of the Hun kingdom. It wasn't a single unitary state, Attila actually ruled a collection of chiefs, each of which had his own warriors (and in some cases other subordinate chiefs). So his army probably moved, deployed and fought as clans under the chief they were loyal to. This, again, argues against a nice neat classical battle.
3. Consider the operational situation. Attila had spent some time in the Kingdom of the Franks, organizing that kingdom under his chosen king, then moved on the Orleans. He expected Orleans to defect, it did not, forcing him into a time-consuming siege. The Visigothic army was in turn marching toward him from the south-west and Aetius with the Roman army from the south. I argue that Aetius' plan was to pin Attila against Orleans, unite with the Visisgothic army then crush Attila and his army at Orleans. In my opinion, this was a sound operational plan.
4. When Attila discovered the Visisgoths and Romans were advancing on him, he pulled his army together and tried to outrun the Visigoths and Romans, who pursued him.
5. Rather than finding a place for a set-piece battle I suspect all three forces were on a convergent path toward some key piece of terrain, probably a river ford. Again, I suspect that what Aetius wanted to do was trap Attila where he could not retreat and destroy his army.
6. The battle that emerged, then, was actually a massive meeting engagement with both sides throwing forces into the battle as they arrived. This would account for the extremely confused nature of the battle, including the incident where Aetius, when he arrived at the battlefield, almost riding into the Hun camp.

Anyway, I just thought I would throw this out there. I published this chapter as an article in the Ancient World by Ares press in 2009 (volume XL no 2, to be exact. I think it can still be ordered from Ares press). For that matter, I may have a scan of the article somewhere on my computer (no guarantees, though, I've gone through thee computers since publishing that article!) that I would happily send anyone who is interested (I believe there is a way to contact me here to het that?)

So for what it is worth

Michael

Great project and very intersting post.

Michael,
I'd be interested in reading your article if you manage to find it. Here's my email adress – atelierpa(a)yahoo.fr

Thanks !

thanks to all

Michael – i'd also like a copy if available.

gavandjosh02 I would love to send you a copy. Email me at mdblodgett at gmail.com
Michael

Franck, I sent you a copy of the article. So if you get a strange email from mdblodgett, don't worry, it's just me. Hope you enjoy.

Michael

By the way, Martyn K brought up a very interesting point to me in an email that I hadn't considered before--what about the Hun baggage? Jordanes really doesn't help us with that, but I am inclined to say that, if my reading of the operational situation is right Attila abandoned it. After all, he needed to move as quickly as possible to escape Aetius' trap, and he was falling back on territory he had either pacified (he wouldn't have moved on Orleans if he couldn't trust the area behind him) and then the Frank kingdom where he could expect the support of the Frank king. SO he probably didn't have to worry about food.
Anyway just continuing the conversation.

Michael

"Franck, I sent you a copy of the article. So if you get a strange email from mdblodgett, don't worry, it's just me. Hope you enjoy."

I got the strange email. Many thanks Michael !

Guys, great stuff, very interesting reading.

oldbob, you are right. MartynK brought up some issues to me in a couple of emails that I hadn't considered before, especially the question of the Hun baggage. And as I understand it, he is trying to estimate the size of the Hun army from the carrying capacity of its baggage train, which I think is an excellent idea (I worry that there will be a lack of evidence for him to use, but that's another tale…). Altogether a great discussion and the reason I joined this site!

Michael

I have just put up part two of my discussion about this battle on my Blog at collegeofkings.com
I am sorry that it is a bit text heavy, I normally put a lot of pictures of figures and games into my posts but I am only at the start of this project and I don't yet have too many figures available.

It continues to discuss the Jordanes text and how it has been interpreted by modern authors.

In my next post (hopefully over Christmas), I plan to discuss how I will use the Jordanes text to create my scenario for the refight of the Battle. I want to create a scenario that is consistent with Jordanes.

I would like to thank Michael for both his comments and his article. They have both been invaluable in developing some of my ideas. This type of situation where boards like TMP can really excel. It is great to bounce ideas off knowledgable people.