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"Iran using loitering munitions in Iraq" Topic


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arealdeadone12 Sep 2021 4:38 p.m. PST

Yet more evidence Iran is rapidly developing and fielding loitering munitions (kamikaze drones), this time in combat operations against militants in Iraq:

link


Kamikaze drones are IMO one of the most revolutionary weapons of our age – cheap yet reliable, responsive and very difficult to counter.


Save Israel, West has been a bit slow on developing these preferring to rely on more expensive manned fighters or large expensive drones like MQ-9 Reaper.

Legion 4 In the TMP Dawghouse13 Sep 2021 9:27 a.m. PST

No surprise really … if they don't develop the Tech they will buy it.

Kamikaze drones are IMO one of the most revolutionary weapons of our age cheap yet reliable, responsive and very difficult to counter.

Those are all the reason Iran has them as well as others.

Save Israel, West has been a bit slow on developing these preferring to rely on more expensive manned fighters or large expensive drones like MQ-9 Reaper.
How do you know the USA & IDF are not developing them now ? And of course, it would be very classified. I have never been to Area 51 … you ?

The Reaper IMO is a great weapons system. Not cheap … but can do the job if need be. Wasn't it a Reaper that turned Iran's Gen. Suilimani and him comrades into jelly?

The 4 of the top Taliban leaders that Obama let out of Gitmo, all have a price on their heads. I'd think in time when the chance presents itself, etc. A Reaper will come calling. Game over … And yes there may be CD, hopefully not as it makes bad press, etc., but it would be worth it, I'd think …

Striker13 Sep 2021 1:13 p.m. PST

Iran is probably ahead of the US in this aspect. US weapons are usually overpriced and loaded with excess capability. To use a Reaper as a suicide drone at upward of 4mil makes Pentagon sense but nowhere else. Cheap drones with enough explosives to get the kill should be something the West could make in the hundreds and tech them to swarm a target. Some video is out there of drones flying in a flock like birds, private company not DoD. Iraq and Hezbollah make good testing grounds as well, no blowback and you get customer feedback. The US at least will only buy the big expensive toy (like carriers) rather than looking at a cheaper alternative.

Legion 4 In the TMP Dawghouse13 Sep 2021 3:04 p.m. PST

I'd hate to think the US would use a Reaper as suicide drone. I'd like to see US suicide drones, again they may be being worked on the now.

arealdeadone13 Sep 2021 5:06 p.m. PST

How do you know the USA & IDF are not developing them now ? And of course, it would be very classified. I have never been to Area 51 … you ?

IDF already has LARGE NUMBER OF loitering munitions and used them as well as sold them to Azerbaijan who used them en masse in Nagorno Karabakh.

I did say Israel had them in my first post.

I have never been to Area 51 … you ?

If they're only developing them, then they are already way behind the game cause other countries are using them en masse.

In case you haven't noticed Azerbaijan just won a high intensity conventional war with cheap loitering munitions and Turkish Bayraktar drones.


The Reaper IMO is a great weapons system. Not cheap … but can do the job if need be. Wasn't it a Reaper that turned Iran's Gen. Suilimani and him comrades into jelly?

I think you're struggling to understand the concept of "cheap and expendable."


A Reeaper costs $32 USD million (compared to $4 USD million 20 years ago for a Predator).

Belgium brought 4 unarmed Reapers and related command infrastructure for $600 million.


Ukraine brought 48 Turkish Bayraktar TB2 and related infrastructure for $69 million.

Sure a Reaper is more capable in terms of pay load and speed (still anaemic compared to even a WWII fighter) but it's also insanely expensive.


Ironically Bayraktar TB2 is actually more survivable than Reaper due to being a much smaller airframe.

And as you can afford a lot of Bayraktar TB2s you aren't as susceptible to losses,


And the Azeri/Israeli/Turkish model of pairing drones with loitering munitions is still so much cheaper than the US model of buying really, really expensive drones.


A Reaper might be awesome for assassination missions but I'd rather support my infantry brigade with half a dozen Bayraktars paired up with loitering munitions and artillery then pray than one of my country's few expensive Reapers is available.

Thresher0114 Sep 2021 2:06 a.m. PST

Makes sense, since they used human ones in the Iran-Iraq War.

Legion 4 In the TMP Dawghouse14 Sep 2021 7:43 a.m. PST

I did say Israel had them in my first post.

Well yes …

Save Israel, West has been a bit slow on developing these preferring to rely on more expensive manned fighters or large expensive drones like MQ-9 Reaper.

So … I may have misunderstood your intent … ? You are so much smarter than I … That has been made clear many times.

If they're only developing them, then they are already way behind the game cause other countries are using them en masse.
How do you know that for a fact ? You don't … and yes … the US military generally knows how to keep a secret. I know you are very critical of the US and it's military. So I think again your comments is many cases are biased almost divisive … IMO …

In case you haven't noticed Azerbaijan just won a high intensity conventional war with cheap loitering munitions and Turkish Bayraktar drones.
I noticed … but Azerbaijan is not the US.

I think you're struggling to understand the concept of "cheap and expendable."
Oh I understand cheap & expendable. I just don't think it is always the best choice. Being issued many items while on active duty. Sometimes cheap ain't better … Just my thoughts …


A Reaper might be awesome for assassination missions but I'd rather support my infantry brigade

Have you been trained to call in CAS or Gunships ?

Have you ever actually done it, in training or otherwise ?

Have you ever been in an Infantry Bde, let alone a Bde HQ ?

Whether an A-10[done that], F16, or a drone i.e. the Reaper, it still is an airborne weapons platform packing some heavy ordinance. E.g. Hellfires AT missiles. If available Reapers, A-10s, AH-1s, etc. are airborne strike assets. I see little difference from a drone to an A-10 or an AH-1/AH-64 to the Grunt on the ground requesting CAS. Been there done that … at least in training.

Another reason I don't think cheaper is always better.

Now I do see suicide drones another weapons system that should be in the inventory. Along with any other airborne weapons platforms.

You again think you understand about how a Grunt operates, etc., without ever being one.

In short … I want the US Military to have drones of all types. As I want it to have weapons of all types from a good pistol to a B-21.

Funding ? It's there, but IMO it is wasted on projects that don't help with the USA's defense of it's citizens.

E.g. Maybe not trying to support a million+ illegal aliens, etc. Who never should of had the chance to cross the border. But with an open border … well we know the outcome. And that is just one example …

The $ is there for both the Reaper & suicide drones, etc. … but not under the circumstances our leadership has put us in …

Makes sense, since they used human ones in the Iran-Iraq War.
Yes since "they" put very little cost on human lives. As we know … the USA does not do that. I'd rather spend $ on the weapons that lower our losses as near to 0 as possible … and theirs' as many as possible, as often possible. That is one way you "win" a war. But you understand all the Thresher … some don't.


BTW on Military.com this am … The IDF have 'bots but these do not fly however …
link

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