"Russia offers US bases to monitor Afghanistan" Topic

Russia has offered the Americans access to their bases in central Asia to continue monitoring of Afghanistan.

No concrete acceptance by America as yet.

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Fascinating how the Russians are still willing to work with the Americans despite general American frothing about Russia. It goes to show how much American policy is based on historical grudges and subjective concepts and not realpolitik.

Well, I'm sure that Russia stands to get nothing from a US intelligence gathering station in their country. Of course, they wouldn't install listening devices in the walls, floors and ceilings like they did in the American Embassy in Moscow a few years ago.

American policy is now based on false narratives from the main stream media. When things really go south, those responsible will need a boogeyman (Russia) to blame. America has become a country of imbeciles.

I think the adults in Russia have a sense of humor by offering us help.

Yea, that sounds like a "good" idea, no doubt for the Russians.

Wonder what their angles are in offering this, and how they plan to benefit from it?

I suspect there are multiple "catches" to this proposal which should make it a non-starter.

The ironic thing is that Iran offered the USA "help" right after 9/11.
Well, maybe. Shia vs Sunni? Who knows?
But Russia trusts the Taliban as far as they can throw them.
The Great Game continues.
The enemy of my enemy…

Wonder what their angles are in offering this, and how they plan to benefit from it?

The angle is simple. Russian friendly countries like Uzbekistan have already had issues with Islamists.

The Russians figure if Taliban take over Afghanistan, Islamism could spread to these countries which would hinder Russian interests.

Thus the Russians have figured out if they give US a bone, they can keep the Americans involved and have the Americans bleed blood and treasure to deter the Taliban.

Have them back out of The Ukraine, Georgia and the Crimea first, then the US might start to believe their offer.

Or, perhaps stop sending agents to various countries to kill those that Putin wants dead.

Dan,

Why would they? They are offering the Americans a carrot. The Americans can take it or leave it and it won't impact Russia that much.

And while we're at it how about you Americans get out of Syria and Iraq and stop directly supporting Saudis atrocities in Yemen?

Hypocrisy is so unbecoming.

Hey that's unfair arealdeadone! We were out of Syria, for a bit (I think 2 months) so we weren't "everywhere" at some point in time. lol

I doubt the US has any idea of Russian intentions so it's best to pass on their offer, for once not blindly step into something. It's the Russian's back yard, let them deal with it or they can partner up with the PRC when they want to roll in. It should give the Wagner group something to do closer to home.

Hypocrisy? Funny, talking about a country that has a history of invading its neighbors, murdering its opponents and keeping it's people in a state of fear to maintain it's grip. All nations are hypocrites about "real" politics, but is there another nation that, without fear or force, calls Russia its ally? If Russia spent what it does to invade, threaten and pretend that it's a player in world politics or economics on it's people, it would be a much better place for its people and respected far more.

And again, I agree that all national government (or most of them) are hypocrites. Just some so much more than others.

Deadone is right. America is the world leader in interfering and invading foreign countries all over the world. Just in recent history we brought down a stable Libya. Transformed it from one of Africa's most wealthy nations to an extremely violent terrorist hot bed. We destabilized the entire ME by taking out Iraq. We just spent two decades throwing away American blood and treasure in that black hole called Afghanistan. In the last century we invaded Panama for no reason, had a decade long debacle in Vietnam. Who are we to tell Russia anything? Stop buying into the main stream media brainwashing of Russia Russia Russia. They are an easy target because we don't want to highlight the dirty deals thatf corporate America and dirty politicians have with China. Does anyone care about a vibrant and free Hong Kong anymore?

Well … can't say I really trust Putin. But if the US could stage airstrikes into A'stan. From "former" Russian "territory" to keep AQ, ISIS, etc., under control if they want to try to attack the West or East for that matter. Then that may be something to think about …

Hypocrisy? Funny, talking about a country that has a history of invading its neighbors,

In a measly 20 years America has invaded more countries, destroyed more other countries and been involved in more wars than the rest of the world combined.

murdering its opponents

So do a lot of American allies – Saudis chopped up a guy in their own embassy in Istanbul but hey they're still a great friend of the United States of America and make Boeing, Lockheed Martin and Raytheon shareholders very happy.

and keeping it's people in a state of fear to maintain it's grip. All nations are hypocrites about "real" politics,

Again big American friends don't just keep their people in a state of fear, they also murder women for adultery, murder LGBTIQ+ and have a quasi-slavery system for immigrant labour.

Or even America's unwavering support of Israel which is basically implementing apartheid.

For a country that's big into freedom, America loves people who deprive freedom of others.

Then America's is now globally perceived as having its police shoot black people for merely being black – not a good look and as bad as Russia in many ways.

That makes them bigger hypocrites than Russia which literally doesn't hide its nastiness.

If Russia spent what it does to invade, threaten and pretend that it's a player in world politics or economics on it's people, it would be a much better place for its people and respected far more.

Last time Russia played nice in the 1990s, the Americans took the opportunity to expand NATO, tried to destroy Russian nuclear deterrent and tried to convert Russia into a deindustrialised agrarian society (literally a stated goal of the American controlled IMF).

They've done better for their own people under Putin than the 1990s democrats/kleptocrats.

Having said all that, America is a key part of the west and has done a lot of good for the world. However its actions over last 20 years have undermined the concept of western liberal democracy let alone the rules based order the Americans supposedly support.

They have literally caused American democracy to waver and emboldened authoritarians in Russia, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, UAE etc but also wannabe authoritarians in countries like Hungary, Poland and even here in Australia.

USA needs to return to an even keel and start acting rationally and under liberal democratic principles it espouses.

Agitating Russians towards WWIII (which Ukraine is certainly a red line) whilst ignoring Chinese atrocities and even worse actively supporting Saudi atrocities with weapons and even aerial refuelling and other services is not the way to do it.

"The ironic thing is that Iran offered the USA "help" right after 9/11.

Well, maybe. Shia vs Sunni? Who knows?".

The real irony is now Iran is protecting their radical Islamic opponents in their own country.

Sorry, the Israel apartheid claim is just Palestinian terrorist propaganda.

Nice try though, but repeating the lie over and over will never make it true.

Sorry, America and Americans prefer conservative democrat principles, instead of liberal ones, since the latter now seems to mean socialist/communist progressivism, and it is destroying the country, not making it better. This will be shown in the 2022, and 2024 elections after the current experiment where those in power ran so far to the left, creating a society of lawlessness, over-taxation, and tyranny.

Thresher,

I don't think you understand how "socialist/progressive" America really is. After all you have Medicare, Medicaid, national parks, Amtrak, public hospitals, public schools, national highway system, social security etc etc as well as support for American industry including massive protectionism of some industries.

Do you realise that people like FDR used "socialist progressivism" to better the lives of most Americans? Indeed FDR was so socialist he made Bernie Sanders look like a capitalist neoliberal.

And it was FDRs massive socialist policies that set up America for its golden era of the 1950s-1960s.

Most Republicans still support "socialist progressivism" too.

In the past many Republicans were also pro-union which helped LBJ introduce reforms to protect workers.

Even Trump engaged in Keynesian left wing economics, not conservative democratic free markets.

Conservativism is:

1. Pro-limited (small) government (which no Republican or Democrat has seriously supported for nearly a century at least). So no public anything save police, courts and military.

2. Anti-union and opposed to government protection of workers rights (so child labour is OK ad indeed it was extremely common in America up to 1930s until FDR and his Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938).

3. Values based on Judaeo-Christian – so back to discriminating against LGBTIQ+ and reducing female rights (eg by banning abortion or access to family planning) and forcing Christian values (eg prayers at school and banning evolution).

4. Pro-business to the point that violation of individual rights is perfectly acceptable as long as those individuals are poor.

5. Anti-environmental protectionism – so going back to the days when the air was toxic to breathe and rivers caught fire is regarded as a good thing. Don't get them started on climate change.

As for taxes, they used to be much much more for the rich in the 1950s-1980s and society was far more equal and there was real progress in improving living standards. It's the creeping in of conservative economics aka neoliberalism that is destroying western living standards.

As for Israel, yes it is an apartheid state. Two state solution is dead and Israel is completely opposed to any real progress and it's gobbling up Palestinian land in west bank like it's going out of fashion.

Indeed latest violence was due to Israelis kicking Palestinians out of their homes in Jerusalem to make way for settlers. Actually that's not apartheid that's ethnic cleansing.

arealdeadone:

Ssh, don't let the news out!

Or, how Ayn Rand and her husband both went on Social Security when they could (but kept it quiet as best they could).

In the US, the political spectrum looks somewhat like this:

Left liberal middle conservative Right

Then of course are the radicals, both far left and far right.

Then America's is now globally perceived as having its police shoot black people for merely being black

Key word there is "perceived", because we both know what a bunch of crap the main stream media peddles.

USAFPilot,

Perception is key for successful influencing. If countries on the periphery don't see any value difference between China and USA they will side with whoever coughs up the most cash!

And right now that is China.

It also looks hypocritical.

If USA gets its value messaging correct, they will be better able to persuade other countries not to go down the path of authoritarianism or side with China.

I get it. The problem is America is a divided country right now like I've never seen before in my lifetime. There are forces inside my country who hate America and what it stands for. They are convinced that America is a racist and anti immigrant country which couldn't be father from the truth. We have a main stream media which pushes this nonsense repetitively.

" Indeed latest violence was due to Israelis kicking Palestinians out of their homes in Jerusalem to make way for settlers ".

Lol. The Palestinians who were kicked out of their homes actually had not paid rent for decades in some cases … it was a legal matter but as usual the Palestinians like blaming everything on the evil zionists and thought it was a good time to kill Israeli civilians again

There is so much of the above you've posted, arealdeadone that is just plain wrong.

There are Palestinians, Muslims, Arabs, or whatever you want to call them that live inside Israel and have Israeli citizenship and full voting rights. That's not really my definition of apartheid.

Ronald Reagan was for small/smaller government, as am I, like 90% smaller in my case, save for the military.

The Federal bureaucracy is bloated, inefficient, wasteful, and overly expensive. The same can be said for many/most state governments as well.

Banning the murder of unborn children (infanticide) is a good thing. I and I suspect many are for "family planning", but not abortion – these are two completely different things.

Many of your hyperbolic, corner cases are just silly in today's modern society, but tens of thousands, if not millions of regulations probably could be rolled back or eliminated with little downside.

Yea, "conservatives want polluted air and water" for themselves, their families and friends, and their descendents. LOL. Keep spewing the lunatic leftist propaganda, since some uneducated people might actually believe it if you tell lies like this often enough.

The current guy in charge here, and his Dem predecessor were only able to get away with so much that is wrong, and anti-American because the news media here isn't objective, and are acting in the role of partisan propagandists for him/them.

Yea, America is so racist it elected a black President, twice, and we now have a black, female VP, and many other minorities in high positions of power in our government, both now, AND in the recent past.

Clearly, many refugees and illegal immigrants don't think America is so bad, since they're flocking here by the millions every year, in order to live here (we have an estimated 30 MILLION illegals living here already, or about 10% of our population), despite what many Dems and the lamestream media will have you believe.

Clearly, they understand the USA is a great country to live in, and are risking life and limb to get here by any means necessary.

After all you have Medicare, Medicaid, national parks, Amtrak, public hospitals, public schools, national highway system, social security etc etc as well as support for American industry including massive protectionism of some industries.

Yes, and water is wet and ice is cold … The USA has some what could be called "socialist" systems in it. But still the USA is not a socialist nation/society. At least not yet !

The USA still operates as a Capitalist society overall. And yes we all know FDR could be said to have used socialist progressivism. But not to the level as some want to as we see currently … 'Nuff … don't want to "go political"/DH …

Hypocrisy is the coin of the realm worldwide … it's the standard … it is unstoppable and undeniable. So it goes on and on and on …

Again big American friends don't just keep their people in a state of fear, they also murder women for adultery, murder LGBTIQ+ and have a quasi-slavery system for immigrant labour.

And yet some small groups in the USA who say they are Marxists. Support Cuba's Communist Gov't … i.e. BLM … Who must not know many in Cuba also have ancestors from Africa that were slaves there. Guess those black lives don't matter ?

LBGTIQ ? What's the "I" stands for ? Did I miss something ?

As far as LGBTQ … you can do what want with other consenting adults, etc. Don't give a ! And you can identify your gender as a ham sandwich, etc. I don't really care. I ID/call myself an old fat crippled bitter White Man Vet who likes females. Some don't like that ? They are bleep* and can !

BLM supports Palestinian leadership/terrorists … but yet their leadership has LGBTQ[or LGBTIQ?] in it's ranks. Which is fine as they can have whoever they want as their leaders or minions. It is their right. And I say go for it. Just don't down my back and tell me it's raining …

But I guess BLM again proves their hypocrisy and even stupidity. LGBTQs in many places in the Mid East are not accepted. In many cases being killed after torture, etc. Gritty enough for ya ?

America loves people who deprive freedom of others.

Who in the USA ? Most in America couldn't find on a map or spell, etc., many of those places you speak of. And it is even worse when they vote for some of those who are somewhere in the US Gov't. Who are just not "qualified", etc., etc.

So do me a favor … when ANYONE says America in this context … SAY the US Gov't/Leadership ! Most in the USA when asked about "Red China" … would reply "It looks good on a yellow table clothe.". So it has been said … you get the gov't you voted for and in turn deserve …

Just of the hell of it … when someone says "the USA supports the KSA", is the KSA any worse than Iran ? I'm pretty sure the differences is not more than just Sunni & Shia … in most cases … yes ?

Then of course are the radicals, both far left and far right.

Yes that goes without saying … it could be said is part of the "system"… beginning with Freedom of Speech.

Almost forgot …

Then America's is now globally perceived as having its police shoot black people for merely being black –

As we know that is not true at all. E.g. Sadly according to FBI stats[IIRC], LEOs shot 13 unarmed Blacks last year. But that figure is still too much. However all these cases are not literally "Black & White" … There were some factors that caused these to occur, etc. Either way not good …

However, and I have said before, BLM, etc., should make this a priority – the fact than about 7000-8000 Blacks killed Blacks, last year. I find that very disturbing. And in many cases CD included children …

Do the Math : 13 vs. 7000-8000 … All of the those deaths including CD is not acceptable and most unneeded and unfortunate …

IMO BLM … the ball is in your court …

Legion4,

FDR's policies were far more socialist than anything else promoted by modern Democrats. New Deal changed literally everything and significantly curbed power of capitalists – it was literally a revolution within.

FDR was a total socialist democrat more in line with European thinking than American (and in my mind the greatest American president) and he took on the whole corrupt system and won.

In fact I would argue he was anti-capitalist – he believed the capitalist system needed a good collar to keep it in line.

Thanks to him, Americans got:

- Social security
- Massive national infrastructure investment (which fuelled industrial growth)
- Labour protection laws (including banning of child labour)
- Actual effective regulation of corporations and capitalists – literally the robber barons were kicked to the curb.
- Contributed to great protection of the environment (though still a long way to go).
- Created greater equality including between races (again a long way to go but remember it was the 1930s.

Now compare FDR to any other American president including those before him, one (Warren Harding) of which threatened to use Army aircraft to bomb striking miners at Blair Mountain,

Bernie Sanders' is about the closest Americans get to FDR. Everyone else including current administration is closer to Reagan.

Support Cuba's Communist Gov't … i.e. BLM … Who must not know many in Cuba also have ancestors from Africa that were slaves there. Guess those black lives don't matter ?

Cuba Communist government has nothing to do with the slave owning colonialists of Cuba's past. And let's not forget before Cuba the guy running Cuba was Batista whose brutal treatment of the working and peasant classes reduced them to effective slavery.

Cuba wouldn't have gone communist if this American patsy wasn't such a nasty tyrant now would they.

Even as failed as Cuba's communism is, it has still done more for Cubans than capitalism ever did!

And note most of Latin America is close to failed states. They have gained nothing from capitalism or the semi-feudal agrarian elites that run most of them.

Even the poster boy for neoliberalism, Chile, imploded in 2019 with mass rioting and social unrest for nearly 2 years now due inequality and lack of opportunity due to country's hard capitalist policies.

Indeed the one truly capitalist industry in Latin America is the drug trade (crime being totally unregulated by definition) and it's resulting in 10s of thousands of death and untold misery.

Yea, "conservatives want polluted air and water" for themselves, their families and friends, and their descendents. LOL. Keep spewing the lunatic leftist propaganda, since some uneducated people might actually believe it if you tell lies like this often enough.

Actually it's true.

Look at the conservative opposition to so called "green tape" and how conservatives universally take side of fossil fuel companies or deny climate change.

Here in Australia conservatives support the coal industry even though it's contributing to massive environmental damage.

On the day the Europeans announce they will no longer be investing in fossil fuels, the Australian conservative government announces $600 USD million for a new gas power plant (that will ironically not even use gas but diesel, at least initially),

They support destruction of old growth forest and natural wonders like the Great Barrier Reef. Indeed they have cried Chinese interference when UNESCO condemned Australia's management of the Great Barrier Reef despite the issue being known for years now.

So yes conservatives actively pursue environmental destruction as the primary goal is profit and individuals (including corporations) right to pursue profit.

It's why corporations offshore too – you can get away with slave labour like conditions and complete disregard for environmental protections unlike in western states with their "green tape".

So if you seriously believe conservatives are pro-environment, then explain why conservatives and capitalists actively oppose environmental protection measures and seek to roll them back?

The current guy in charge here, and his Dem predecessor were only able to get away with so much that is wrong, and anti-American because the news media here isn't objective, and are acting in the role of partisan propagandists for him/them.

So Abe Lincoln, FDR and LBJ were anti-American? Those guys pursued policies that were far more anti capitalist/anti-elite than old Biden. Lincoln literally smashed state rights, whilst as discussed FDR was nearly a socialist and LBJ did a lot of far more revolutionary left wing stuff.

any refugees and illegal immigrants don't think America is so bad, since they're flocking here by the millions every year,

I suspect given half a chance, they'd go to Germany or Sweden!

Seriously though, the failing US is still infinitely better than the failed states of Syria or Libya or Myanmar or Guatemala or Honduras or Nigeria or Ghana.

And note most of those other states weren't socialist. Their problems are cultural, economic, or in case of Syria, created by the Americans themselves when they allowed their allies to support jihad in them.

Lol. The Palestinians who were kicked out of their homes actually had not paid rent for decades in some cases … it was a legal matter but as usual the Palestinians like blaming everything on the evil zionists and thought it was a good time to kill Israeli civilians again

Oh and LOL, let's not forget that the West Bank including most of Jerusalem is currently illegally occupied by Israel and Israel never compensated the Palestinians who fled their homes in 1948 for loss of property that was taken over by the Jews.

Oh , and lol .. those houses that started the latest HAMAS cry were actually Jewish owned prior to 1948 … nice try . Not everything is a Zionist plot you know

arealdeadone … I did not say I did not like what FDR did of the things he brought about. Of course I [nor you?] were not around then … so …

Cuba Communist government has nothing to do with the slave owning colonialists of Cuba's past.

has nothing to do with the slave owning colonialists of Cuba's [the USA's] past.

Nor do anyone alive now/today in the USA. Many of our ancestors were not even here ! However today is now a point of contention causing rioting, looting, murder, etc.

But yet somehow many of us alive today are guilty … of what I'm not really sure? I nor any of my ancestors arriving here in 1905 … Never owned any slaves. And don't think anyone alive today has picked any cotton for sometime ?

I think you missed my point about BLM supporting the Cuban Gov't.

Much of the rest of what you say is pretty much well known. BUT … we can't change that, what happened so long ago. Again hindsight is 20/20 … As we see tearing down statues, does not really change anything, AFAIK ?

"Yea, "conservatives want polluted air and water" for themselves, their families and friends, and their descendents. LOL. Keep spewing the lunatic leftist propaganda, since some uneducated people might actually believe it if you tell lies like this often enough. "
Actually it's true.

Yes it is true … say something long enough some will believe it. Whether it is true or not … The media today demonstrates this all day … As does many of our elected and appointed Gov't officials …