Au pas de Charge | 10 Jul 2021 8:19 p.m. PST |
I noticed you rarely see spotted or blotchy horse coats in Napoleonic cavalry sketches/paintings. I am no horse expert but is there some reason for this? Did those coats not exist then in Europe? Or, were they shunned by cavalry units? Or is it that war painters couldn't be bothered to pint complex horse coats. I realize that cavalry regiments of every nation probably preferred solid colored coats if for no other reason but to create a matched visual but there must've been many instances of "beggars cant be choosers". |
BillyNM | 10 Jul 2021 10:24 p.m. PST |
They do exist – see Lejeune;s painting of the battle of Marengo. The civilian artillery team has some and the ADC at the bottom far right right is riding one. Likewise David has Napoleon Crossing the Alps on a pinto. |
John G | 11 Jul 2021 4:30 a.m. PST |
I think the knapstrutter breed descends from a Spanish officer in the Napoleonic wars having a spotted horse. So at least one spotted horse in a cavalry unit |
14Bore | 11 Jul 2021 5:59 a.m. PST |
From my horse colors investigation the black and white highlights as well as other very common markings are gene related, so that suggests they had to be there 200 years ago. So unless some pure chestnut stock was only used ( doubt that as any horse will do) only then would every horse be the same Actually last few years every horse of mine is probably unique |
Anthony Barton | 11 Jul 2021 10:55 a.m. PST |
There are several skewbalds shown ridden by Russian Cavalry by Adam Klein, in his splendid watercolours from 1814. |
von Winterfeldt | 11 Jul 2021 11:33 a.m. PST |
all kinds of colour horses were used, initially avoided because they were obvious to spot but eventually taken into service. url=https://postimages.org/]
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John Tyson | 11 Jul 2021 12:16 p.m. PST |
The first image that came to my mind is this watercolor (circa 1882) of Jan Henryk Dąbrowski on a black & white horse. I'm not certain, but I think that horse coloration is called a "Piebald."
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jwebster | 11 Jul 2021 2:33 p.m. PST |
Piebald – black and white Skewbald – brown and white (sometimes black as well) These colours are relatively uncommon genetically so maybe 1 in 20 or 1 in 40, unless specifically bred like American paint horses I believe that piebald and skewbald has been "unfashionable" at certain times, so would be seen less frequently in pictures and so on About 70% of horses are "bay" – brown coats, black mane and tail, and darker/black legs. You could get away with making every horse a bay colour John |
14Bore | 11 Jul 2021 2:48 p.m. PST |
Or in a 60 to 1 scale your 1 horse can be whatever odd color you want, it's the other 59 that are bland plain chestnuts |
Robert le Diable | 11 Jul 2021 3:17 p.m. PST |
There's also Vernet's painting of the defence of the Barriere de Clichy in 1814, in which Marshal Moncey himself is mounted on a "skewbald". I think Vernet's had served in the National Guard at the time, so may have painted this detail from memory. |
14Bore | 11 Jul 2021 3:21 p.m. PST |
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deadhead | 12 Jul 2021 1:10 a.m. PST |
A bay can be "chestnut coloured", but he is not a chestnut horse strictly speaking. A true chestnut horse has no black hair anywhere, not on his tail, mane, legs or ear tips. Of course to confuse things a true chestnut may not be "chestnut coloured" at all. He can vary from very dark brown to really pale sandy coloured, he can certainly have white markings in the usual places, but no black anywhere. Bays are more effective for simple painters like me……and much commoner. Black is just cheating if you have already sprayed them thus and I freely admit to that. |
von Winterfeldt | 12 Jul 2021 5:20 a.m. PST |
multi coloured horses did exist and were in use, notably in the light cavalry. I agree not that common but there are enough primary sources both in text and picture to confirm this. For a long time I did not paint any, but in the recent years I started to add the odd for my regiments, in fact, I like them. url=https://postimages.org/]
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Garde de Paris | 12 Jul 2021 9:05 a.m. PST |
Years ago, someone posted here that Frederick the Great had his hussars mounted on horses different for several regiments. I recall the 5th (Black Hussars; Death's Head) rode "greys," or very light tan smaller horses. Probably a mix of light colored horses. Like Deadhead, I prefer Bays – black mane, lower legs and tail, for the good contrast. I use very little white, as for star, smip, blaze, soxs, and the like. As the wars raged on, I assume any healthy animal was used, no matter what regimental tradition specified. I recall the 5th French Chasseurs a cheval rode "claybanks" – buff, light mud-brown horses. The soldiers have buff belting instead of whitened. Kept the dolman longer than any other chasseurs, and yellow-wrapped early hussar headpiece. GdeP |
Robert le Diable | 13 Jul 2021 6:40 a.m. PST |
First, I believe there was, in at least some armies of the period, a preference for mounting Cuirassiers and the like on darker horses than the Light Cavalry (and didn't the Grenadiers a Cheval, and Carabineers, ride blacks?). Secondly, I read years ago that few horses have no white at all on their face, and that most horses have some white on their lower legs, though apparently it's very rare indeed for a horse to have white on all four legs (unless, of course, it's already a grey). Predictably, ever since, whenever I've seen a horse, I've checked whether this holds true; anyone else encountered this observation? |
BillyNM | 13 Jul 2021 9:36 a.m. PST |
Robert le Diable – it's not uncommon for a horse to have no blaze (white on the face) just Google images of horses and have a look. As for white socks, there's an old saying: One white foot, buy him. Two white feet, try him. Three white feet, be on the sly. Four white feet, pass him by. |
ferg981 | 13 Jul 2021 12:24 p.m. PST |
All, I stick to single, bulk colours because my painting isn't good enough to do multicoloured horses Regards J |
Robert le Diable | 13 Jul 2021 2:13 p.m. PST |
Thanks so much, BillyNM, especially for the proverb. Since my own posting was tangential to the main subject, I was trying to be brief but accurate; that is, "no white at all" was meant to signify not just the familiar "blaze", "stripe" and "star", but any occurrence of some white on the horse's face whether or no immediately and clearly visible, which was the sense of the original writer. I don't know if the contention be true or no, but, with 15mm or 18mm castings, it's not going to concern me. The odd patchwork horse distributed among the cavalry units though, now that's a pig with a different snout on it. Good Luck. |
Erzherzog Johann | 14 Jul 2021 1:23 a.m. PST |
Some brown horses have quite significant amounts of white on the face. I haven't actually painted any like that myself but I think one day I will. |