"Russian and French Columns" Topic

In Empire they are two figures wide bases.
However due to the huge losses at Borodino was the formation width changed and if so how can the new formation be represented on the table top?

Also French columns of division after 1808 are three figures wide bases to represent its two company frontage. However if the Voltigeur company and/or Grenadiers are detached to skirmish or for some other purpose should the parent column be consider to be one company wide. One company wide?

Were any nation's company paper strength ever achieved under campaign conditions?

Hiya

Empire III is ridiculous. Each figure is 20 files wide and you are meant to work out firings, etc based on this number.

Russian battalions had eight platoons (say 480/8 = 60 = one figure). Columns were two platoons wide = two figures.

French battalions had six platoons (say 540/6 = 90 = one and a half figures). Columns could be two platoons wide = three figures.

Plus you could put your grenadier company on the right – giving total frontage of four and a half figures. In Empire this gives a French column double firepower, adding the PLUS TWO COZ FRENCH this yields 299% TOTAL VICTORY result.

Rant over

The little men are "playing pieces" -- none of this matters.
You could have the same size base with just one 54mm figure on it and it would be the same.

Russ Dunaway

Empire goes by company stands and yes its 1 stand in front.
Part of my problem getting contact to work, but my die rolls I think are part of the issue.
I generally have 12 figure battalions ( yes way over for my Borodino OOB)

If you have the rules, it's all laid out up front. Standard Russian battalion is 8 figures/480 men. They didn't form columns with two company front so this would yield 2 figure front, 4 ranks deep. If there are fewer men then you subtract one casting for every 60 men starting with the rear company and taking one casting from each company before taking a second from any one. A half strength battalion would therefore be 1 wide by four deep. 360 man battalion would have two forward stands at 2 figures and two rear stands at one figure. Of course, if you have less than 6 figures in the battalion its probably best to use a regimental mass because otherwise they are too fragile.

French battalions routinely operated with two company frontage and sometimes had grenadiers on the right giving a 3 company frontage (and significant advantage). Up to 1809 all French battalions regardless of morale class can do so. From 1809-1812 forming grenadiers on the right is only allowed if the battalion is crack line or higher and is not allowed at all after 1812. If the grenadiers are not formed on the right then they are in the rear. They never took the place of a fusilier company in the front rank; they either added to the front by forming to the right of the front line fusilier companies or stayed in the rear to push the fusiliers forward. If elite companies are detached to form ad hoc battalions (or never included in the case of regiments 135 and up) then there are four companies which would still form a column with two company frontage with two companies to the rear.

Assuming the battalion has the ability to form grenadiers on the right, if the battalion is full strength that is 4 fusiliers and 2 grenadiers in the front rank with two more fusilier companies (4 figures) behind them and 2 voltigeurs either in the rear or out skirmishing; at 75% strength it would be 3 fusiliers and one grenadier in the front with 3 more fusiliers behind and again the 2 voltigeurs either in the rear or sent out as skirmishers.

Full strength would look like one of these (ranked in order of probability from top to bottom):

VV

FFFFGG
FFFF

FFFFGG
FFFF
VV

VV

FFFF
FFFF
GG

FFFF
FFFF
VVGG

or 75% like this:

VV

FFFG
FFF

FFFG
FFF
VV

VV

FFF
FFF
G

FFF
FFF
VVG

So after 1808 reforms?

Yes.
Prior to that there were 9 companies per battalion. Initially 8 fusilier and one grenadier, then around 1805-1806 a voltigeur (light) company replaced one of the fusilier companies. In the nine company battalions there was still a two company front and the grenadiers could still form on the right of this to make 3. If for some strange reason the grenadiers were not on the right they formed to the rear as did the voltigeurs if they weren't sent out as skirmishers. So the only difference to the above is that there are three more companies adding depth to the formation, but no more frontage.

So no place or use for Column of Peloton then?

The above are the formations shown in the rule book.

If you mount your figures at just one company per stand I suppose you could form a column with a single company front, but don't know why you'd ever want to do that… Loss of firepower with no increase in mobility, more chance of bouncethrough damage from artillery bombardment, increased chance that enemy would get full or partial enfilade in melee, greater chance to fail an elan check when attempting to melee since a single figure casualty would be 50% of the front rank rather than 16.7% if 6 figure front, etc.

Ah the rule book. Thanks tvlamb

Napoleon's decree of 18th February 1808:

link

The part relevant to this is Article 7.

There's an obvious logic to it: if the battalion has an elite company (or two) missing, it can't form three complete divisions to manoeuvre by.

Thanks Musketballs