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"Bataillon DuTirailleurs Corses 1803- 1811" Topic


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606 hits since 18 Feb 2021
©1994-2021 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

Tango01 Supporting Member of TMP18 Feb 2021 8:22 p.m. PST

Of possible interest?

link


Amicalement
Armand

von Winterfeldt18 Feb 2021 10:55 p.m. PST

unfortunately this article is based on bad research by H. Knötel – the Tirailleurs du Corses did not have a brown uniform 1803 – 1811.

L'UNIFORME

Les troupes Corses ont toujours cherché à se singulariser. Or il est difficile de le faire lorsqu'on est intégré dans l'armée impériale et qu'on est assimilé à un Bataillon d'infanterie légère. Les Tirailleurs Corses perçurent la tenue bleue impériale comme tous les régiments de ce type, il apportèrent une modification dans la couleur du collet de l'habit, des parements et des pattes de parements qui fut « vert pomme », ce sera la seule unité à porter cette couleur.
Pourquoi le choix de ce vert ? Il y a deux hypothèses. Ils sont issus on le sait du 8ème Léger, or la couleur distinctive des musiciens de ce régiment était le vert. Ou tout simplement Philippe d'Ornano s'est il souvenu que Catherine de Médicis avait offert à son homonyme, le maréchal Alphonse d'ORNANO, dix drapeaux verts à croix blanche portant la devise "Pugna Pro Patria", depuis il semble que le vert soit devenu la couleur militaire de la Corse. Et puis l'Empereur n'aimait-il pas le vert !
Le fait est que nos Corses vont se singulariser par cette couleur distinctive, et de plus ils porteront la giberne sur le ventre « à la Corse ».
Les Tirailleurs Corses portent l'uniforme de l'infanterie Légère Française distingué de vert au collet, parements et pattes de parements. L'habit de drap bleu impérial est à retroussis courts et véritables, passepoilés de blanc et ornés de cors de chasse en drap blanc découpé. Revers bleus passepoilés de blanc. Boutons plats en étain sans numéro, estampé d'un cor de chasse.

Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP18 Feb 2021 11:41 p.m. PST

Frankly, I'm very glad you said it.

Even more frankly, I don't see how anyone could believe the fantasy spun by anyone. Why Bucquoy should adhere to a faulty hypothesis and Knotel mis-information I don't know.
Seems like 'justification' is a long term defect of historians of all kinds over millenia.

We see fake-news now everyday, so I guess it was always there. Rewriting the records to suit someone agenda.

Why the confusion of the mainland based separate unit- that N. very clearly isolated and strictly controlled from the beginning, knowing his youthful countrymen- and the 'legions' of national gardes supported on Corsica itself- 5 battalions spread in major centres, where the natural brown uniform remained, except when recruits perhaps were selected for the 'Chasseur Corse'- as they were referred to in the period I note*.

Also the drawing of the line between the 8eme DBLegere specialists colouring (facing) and that of the Chasseur Corse is equally ridiculous. As French DB were 'reviewed' and manpower dispersed, and recombined, his attachment of them to the 8eme DBLegere "as their third battalion" was his method of applying training and discipline to the youthful corps.

They were never intended to be 'amalgamated', nor integrated, until the necessity appears much later, into any French regiment. To be sure they would have been dispersed amongst several units otherwise.

As for the throw away comment "Et puis l'Empereur n'aimait-il pas le vert", well utter garbage is all I can say! Unless it was absolutely about the 'shade' of green used- which he could have changed on a whim anyway- he had no such dilemma when it came to 60 regiments of line cavalry; his own elite Garde, personal livery and servants etc.

That comment lasts no longer and has less credibility than a champagne bubble!

Regardez mes amis, tous sont verte de jalousie!,
Salut!
Dave

*Official History of the Battle at Austerlitz. A.Berthier. 1806=

MarbotsChasseurs19 Feb 2021 1:16 p.m. PST

A site with the correct information.

link

Sadly, the best site on all things on Corsican soldiers is no longer working! Here are some pics from the site.

link
link
link
link

Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP19 Feb 2021 4:31 p.m. PST

Ummm be careful with that prose Mike,.. while the translation engine/ IA is hilarious.. can you make out the real names?

"The Coroners and the 26th Lightweight carry over, pushing into the kidneys the Russians who no longer know where to give head. Then takes place a terrible contempt: the 26th Light still in pursuit of the Russians, in the haze-covered valley of the Goldbach, opens fire on compact shadows that stand out in front of them… this is the 108th Line of the Heudelet Brigade [3]"

the prose to begin wth is somewhat defective.

As it's a hugely complex battle- the author there has tied in a previous paragraph the Tir du Po and 26e Legere at Tellnitz.
The former had a detached company with THE ONE battalion of the 3e de ligne overnight (1-2 Dec) who came under probing skirmish attacks (confirmed by Savary no less); the rest of the battalion Tir du Po were all day in the 'pheasantry/ orchard' of Sokolnitz.

And the 26e were themselves ejected from Sokolnitz and racing (routing) Southward bumped into the 108e later after 9am. They were at a time pursued, not the pursuers, hence I call this 'nationalistic prose'.

"But it is true that the Corsican Tirailleur yet under the machine-gun of the enemy artillery continued to make the shot, and that he was unaware that during this time General Langeron took Telnitz, bravely defended by the Po Tirailleur and the 26th Light and reached the plain."
They don't even get the Allied OB correct- Langeron was facing Sokolnitz… doh..!

Perhaps they're naively mistaking the Po detachment for Corse?

And although other works lead one to believe the Chasseur Corse were at Tellnitz, the three battalions of the 3eme de ligne seem to have been there by themselves (with the detached company Tir du Po) after a mid-night rearrangment (Goetz).

I think, part of the problem with some battle descriptions is involved with the 'order of march' where brigades and divisions are concerned, and actual battelfield placement being an entirely separate issue.

GBD Merle could not possibly have personally commanded in person every one of the 4 battalions he was in charge of at one time as they were spread across 2-3 kilometres of the Goldbach frontage.

Seems to me, thinking out loud, that the 100 men (1 or 2 company's @ campaign strength?) were to act as the eclaireurs 'screen'for the 3eme battalion in the village. Makes sense doesn't it?

But not the Chasseur Corse, who seem to have been 'in reserve' at this time, possible guarding the valuable artillery and left flank of the cavalry screen further South.

regards
d

von Winterfeldt20 Feb 2021 8:58 a.m. PST

Thanks MarbotsChasseurs, yes tango should habe provide the links you do show.

I would say nice tango, in case he would take the responsibility to check the links he offers for quality control.

Frostie21 Feb 2021 8:58 a.m. PST

Did these become the Mediterranean Regiment in 1812?

Lilian21 Feb 2021 9:27 a.m. PST

not at all, this one was a disciplinary regiment for refractory conscripts

again a french military title destroyed…so the "Battalion from a Corsican Sharpshooter(s)" was merged in the 11e léger as 1st battalion 11th Light Infantry Regiment in 1811

Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP21 Feb 2021 5:17 p.m. PST

Eh?? this one was a disciplinary regiment for refractory conscripts
Meaning who?

again a french military title destroyed…so the "Battalion from a Corsican Sharpshooter(s)" was merged in the 11e léger as 1st battalion 11th Light Infantry Regiment in 1811

Actually I too got the impression from writers 40 years ago that those fine units were 'destroyed' by bureaucracy. Now having seen N. dictation on the matter, I formally disavow my previous, incorrectly directed stance, and say that the 11eme Legere was reformed with the best available and was actually an 'elite' unit in all aspects, ok save the last battalion perhaps.

All the other individual components were pretty well established and experienced. They still would have operated in their sseparate battalions, albeit under command of an administration regiment.
d

Lilian22 Feb 2021 12:41 p.m. PST

it was in reply to Frostie referring to the Mediterranean Regiments (future 35e léger and 133e de ligne)
who mixed them with the Corsican Tirailleurs Bataillon DE Tirailleurs Corses forming the 11e léger
link

Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP22 Feb 2021 5:18 p.m. PST

Ohh yup, figured ;-)
Love your work !
d

Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP25 Feb 2021 3:37 p.m. PST

The missing site, which gladly I had translated for my own use, as I found it the most comprehensive on the subject, if not by this gentleman or at least one of his reenactor partners:

TC_TirCorse.

by DaveW, on Flickr.

Whilst my unit is 'completed', anyone who requires further information, until the site resurfaces, is welcome to request the saved info,
cheers dcup

sergeant Joe major joe02 Mar 2021 1:23 a.m. PST

nieuwe rang na lange dienst 3e grenadier de la garde renactment jongens

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