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"Using Perry Koreans as Late Ming" Topic

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Marcus Brutus17 Sep 2020 4:55 p.m. PST

Following up on a very recent Topic on 28mm Ming, Alex Cheng, host of the Facebook "Ming Chinese Wargaming and Military History" wrote, "one could easily substitute Perry Koreans for most of a Ming army, as the Korean army at that time was based off that of the Ming. The Ming/Koreans from Tiger miniatures could be used to supplement the Perry Koreans. The color scheme of the Korean and Ming armies are quite different, so that would make it easier to tell the two armies apart."

What do others think about this? Could it work? That would presumably solve a major wargaming hole.

Wansui17 Sep 2020 8:32 p.m. PST

Perry's Garrison troops have a better chance of passing; Southern soldiers wore a similar uniform with cloth turban for headgear.

Armored Koreans are problematic as they sport half sleeves while most Ming brigandine was sleeveless and paired with segmented armguards for cavalry. Ming border troops often used rectangular or triangular flaglets as helmet finials as opposed to just a horsehair tassel with a trident. Color scheme for brigandine are both derived from the Five Elements.

RudyNelson17 Sep 2020 9:50 p.m. PST

I too am skeptical of using Koreans for an entire army.
Several paintings from the Korean War Museum in Seoul shows a number of various troop types. The Sodong, professional soldier, did wear a wide brim helmet that would work for spear men and archers. Also multiple arrow launcher and catapult crews look the same as well.
One problem with the Korean spearman's is that they carried both the single and tri-point, due in part to the dominance of castle wall warfare when they needed to push off ladders. So the tri-point will have to be trimmed down.
Armored infantry were mainly dismounted noble elite cavalry.
Heavy cavalry may also need work on weapons and helmets.

skipper John Supporting Member of TMP18 Sep 2020 5:20 a.m. PST

I'd love to be able to buy a few Ming castings to add to my Korean army. A little more variation and another splash of color! But, alas, it is simply "not to be." Does anybody make anything in 28mm Ming?

altfritz18 Sep 2020 7:21 a.m. PST

I have the Ex-Cavalcade Ming but sadly am not currently in a position to get them moulded/castings made.

Berzerker7318 Sep 2020 3:44 p.m. PST

I think Northstar has 1 set of Ming troops for the game Ronin. link

skipper John Supporting Member of TMP18 Sep 2020 6:06 p.m. PST

Berzerker73… So I need 6 mounted. At 20 Pounds a pop that will be $156.00 USD.

"… I do not think it means what you think it means."

figman119 Sep 2020 6:05 a.m. PST

Clibinarium posted some time ago on Lead Adventure Forum that he was working on a range of Ming that would match with the Perry's. Perhaps we could encourage him to continue with it.

skipper John Supporting Member of TMP19 Sep 2020 6:17 a.m. PST

Apparently Some Ming have been commissioned at the "Steve Barber Models Commission a Miniature" FB page that will match up with the Perry Korean. Awaiting casting.


clibinarium19 Sep 2020 6:37 a.m. PST

Oh I don't need encouragement- I am hard at work on it. The difficult thing is to be quiet about it, because I've been preparing it for a long time with very slow progress. But things are starting to come together.

figman119 Sep 2020 7:16 a.m. PST

Excellent news Clibinarium! I can't wait to see the results of your work.

Marcus Brutus19 Sep 2020 5:00 p.m. PST

I kind of figured that the idea of using Koreans for Chinese was a bit too good to be true. I can't quite understand why the Perrys would do two of the three belligerents in the Imjin War and not all three. With that said, good to hear that Ming figures are in the pipeline.

Berzerker7320 Sep 2020 7:06 a.m. PST

Skipper John – I was not specifically addressing what you need but just adding to the general discussion of manufacturers producing Ming troops.

If you can use them great, if not it makes no difference to me.

clibinarium21 Sep 2020 2:38 a.m. PST

"I can't quite understand why the Perrys would do two of the three belligerents in the Imjin War and not all three."

I know what you mean, but I guess it points towards the possibliity that the Koreans haven't sold well enough to justify the commitment to the Ming (which is a much bigger prospect). Or possibly that the Brother's interest moved on, or that there's so much else to do (its impossible to run out of interesting subjects).

The Perries likely did the Koreans out of personal interest it them, rather than any plan to make money (that's what napoleonics are for). Certainly I would be overjoyed to break even doing Ming, as I can't imagine they'd be big sellers. Its my personal interest in them that keeps me going, but that's enough for now.

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