"Chinese Virologist Who Fled To The US After Claiming" Topic

…Covid-19 Was Made In A Military Lab.

"A Chinese virologist who alleges the coronavirus was cooked up in a military lab has published a report which she claims backs up her theory.

Li-Meng Yan, who alleges to be a former researcher at the Hong Kong School of Public Health, says the virus was built by merging the genetic material of two bat coronaviruses.

She claims its spike protein – a structure on the surface of the virus which it uses to bind with cells – was edited to make it easier for the virus to latch on to human cells…"

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Amicalement
Armand

I'll need a little more evidence than the testimony of one person.

I saw her on FOX News last night … She did say some very interesting things. But I'd like to hear more from other sources too.

But it is not out of the realm of possibility. The PRC's economy was not doing that well. And the US was playing hardball with them on trade talks, etc.,.

Her university is saying she didn't research human-to-human transition…

But why would she lie?

Disinformation ? Sun Tzu, to paraphrase, "All War is a matter of deception" …

Considering that the virologist is from Hong Kong where Beijing suppressed protesters, she may well also have a motive and agenda for making these claims.

I believe her…. because I want to. Isn't that really the way everyone forms political opinions? No heavy lifting but it confirms existing prejudices.

She didn't provide any real proof, but should/could have connections to know about it.

Biding her time to make money off a book deal, before sharing the evidence with us?

I beleive her too… any chance that she is telling the truth?…

Amicalement
Armand

I could see the ChiComs doing this. However, I'd like more evidence.

Dn Jackson +1

Our ability to conduct virtually any level of genetic engineering is pretty 'primitive' and as such leaves 'fingerprints'. And so far no scientific grouping has found any evidence of those fingerprints on COVID-19. Also COVID-19 as stated in the article isn't terribly well optimised for humans.

And rather convenient that her 'evidence' got wiped!

It's not a matter of whether we believe her. She says she has proof. She says the genome reveals it. We need people who understand genomes who are not demonstrably influenced by the Chinese government to look at the proof and tell us. Discussion of her motives and credibility and opinions of whether or not the Chinese government would do such a thing (looking at Hong Kong and the Uyghers) are recreational. To act on such a horrific accusation we need proof. She is not asking us to take her testimony as proof. Either the genome is a "Frankenstein" as she described and not a mutation or it's not.

I hope it's not true. I hope mankind does not have this weapon. Covid has already killed about ten times Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The world could demand compensation and China could continue to deny it while threatening that they have two more of these ready to go. If you don't want your country to be ground zero for the next pandemic you can just keep your mouth shut at the UN. I don't think humanity has a way to handle a Chinese government that has and is wiling to use this kind of technology.

I hope mankind does not have this weapon.

AFAIK most larger militaries have stocks of chemical and biological weapons. Just in case … Is COVID-19 one of them in the PRC's inventories ? Maybe … ? Better to err on the side of caution, IMO.

We were trained in the '80s, in NBC Defense. I even was sent to a course as an Infantry Plt Ldr. To have the additional duty as Co. NBC Officer. Issued suits, masks, etc., to train in.

Mankind has never been unable to come up with ways to kill each other and in some cases massive numbers. I don't think that has changed this much since we, the USA dropped 2 A-bombs on Japan in '45.

False Flag Operation.
Bannon's back in da house.
A bit like that incubator abomination 1990.
I would even say it reeks of Hill & Knowlton.

Congratulations, well played.

There have been bio-weapons, but prior to this they only effect the people they hit, they don't spread from city to city, country to country.

Time to start a pool on when she commits arkanscide.

Communitsts don't like their dirty linen being aired.

I'm sure she'll suffer from a perfectly normal, fatal accident, or just completely disappear in short order, when the Chi-com's agents locate her.

Kind of like what happened with the Chinese head of Interpol who has never been seen or heard from again, after he was kidnapped from Europe (I think), not too many years ago.

The Chi-com agents are everywhere here, so it may not take too long.

I hope for her sake that I'm wrong, but doubt it.

If she does die suddenly, and prematurely, I'll take that as confirmation she is/was telling the truth.

False Flag Operation.
Bannon's back in da house.

I said it might be disinformation from the PRC. But you say ?

prior to this they only effect the people they hit, they don't spread from city to city, country to country

As far as we know …

Communitsts don't like their dirty linen being aired.

No doubt, just ask Putin too !

If she does die suddenly, and prematurely, I'll take that as confirmation she is/was telling the truth.

Sounds reasonable, and again we really can't trust anything the PRC/CCP and/or Putin say and do … regardless …

Re: spreading from city to city and country to country; didn't anyone here ever watch a zombie movie?

😲

😲

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The Grand Wizard has people for such jobs, especially those in his disgrace.
The fired losers craving for their masters attention.

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As I said, well played.
Congratulations.

…
p.s.
It is not the truth that dies from lies and deceiption.
It is trust.
After that you have believer and non-believer.
Hating each other.
And that my friend is a much greater win.

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🤔 I must be a bit dense … explain your posts Arjuna please …

No, I won't, since it would be nuked by the owner of this website and since it is your country and I have no stake in its partisanship games.
But since the owner of this website deleted my so called 'offensive' posts in this thread TMP link but not that of people that belittled my country there and elsewhere, put me in the dawghouse but not them, I'm more than happy US-Troops leaving it the sooner the better.

Everything I posted above can be found in about two minutes on the net.

I was not on tmp since about eight or nine years ago under another account I can't revive anymore, but boy what became of it is quite sobering.

I'm more than happy US-Troops leaving it the sooner the better.

May I venture a guess that country is Germany ? And why are you glad they are gone? Are they that much trouble/problem ?

But many places in the world are happy the US is there. E.g. Poland for one …

I was not on tmp since about eight or nine years ago under another account I can't revive anymore, but boy what became of it is quite sobering.

What became of TMP ?

I'm just interested in the answers to those questions, not to be combative, etc. I'm just trying to understand your POV, why you believe as you do, etc., … Without getting you doghoused. As I have spent a lot of time in there in the past.

I believe her given the following information:

1. The presence of a government biological research facility in Wuhan where the outbreak start.

2. China contained the outbreak extremely quickly which seems to indicate they were already organised for it.

3. The Chinese economy is one of the few that is still growing on the planet.

4. China's main competitors (USA, EU, India and Russia) are being smashed by COVID with massive economic disruption.

5. At least one major university in Australia found out the disease was perfectly adapted for humans, which was apparently at odds with it it coming from an animal.

6. China is refusing any serious investigation into initial outbreak.

I think the Chinese were hoping for it to cause chaos in Japan and South Korea too as it travelled quickly to those countries (but bizarrely not Australia despite massive movements of Chinese to Australia) but these managed to contain in it in a timely fashion.

Yep, lashing out at us for trying to hold them to account.

Seems like the perfect motive, and asymmetrical tactic.

Good points … but IMO and others … the PRC/CCP is to blame and were working on COVID-19 for whatever reasons. It certainly could and did disrupt the economic situation with it's competitors, etc. For better or worse.

They have the numbers to take deaths from their own creation and they were well aware of that. Classic Communist dogma, "for the greater good" … no matter how many they may/will lose.

They are students of Sun Tzu, they know the concept of "winning" without going to war.

Even if the COVID release was accidental(?), they took advantage of the situation. Never let an opportunity go to waste.

2. China contained the outbreak extremely quickly which seems to indicate they were already organised for it.

Which actually contradicts a lot of the charges thrown at China about its initial response… holding mutually exclusive POV as true? Conspiracy theory rabbit hole ahoy!

Of course once the Chinese authorities decided they had to do something they cracked down the disease like only an authoritarian state can do – and its not as if its eradicated in China.

5. At least one major university in Australia found out the disease was perfectly adapted for humans, which was apparently at odds with it it coming from an animal.

Hadn't heard of that, but it runs contrary to a roll call eminent research bodies across the world. More to the point it seems to be being pushed by a single senior scientist who as far as I can see hasn't said much since early summer.

6. China is refusing any serious investigation into initial outbreak

The CCP would no more allow an internal investigation by an independent international body than it would make the financial records of the politburo public. And the whole thing got even less likely since another state decided to flush the reputation of the WHO down the toilet.

Comes down to IMO … again … we can't trust the PRC/CCP. Nothing new there.

2020, the start of the great "Chinese Biological Wars." Welcome to your future.

Well if the PRC can engineer a virus so well that know what can spot it we lost a couple of decades ago….

"China contained the outbreak extremely quickly which seems to indicate they were already organised for it".

"Which actually contradicts a lot of the charges thrown at China about its initial response… holding mutually exclusive POV as true? Conspiracy theory rabbit hole ahoy!".

Actually, that is incorrect on the "well contained" position, as we've seen by the numerous deaths of Chinese in Wuhan, and other cities there, not to mention ALL of those that traveled overseas to spread it around the globe as well. A month or two ago there was a lot of discussion in the news about new cases popping up ALL over China and the people there having to deal with a second wave of contagion. Info about that seems to have dried up of late, since I haven't see anything mentioned on that since then.

"Hadn't heard of that (in reference to the virus' "design"), but it runs contrary to a roll call eminent research bodies across the world".

The WHO and other scientists have gotten a lot of things wrong, and/or have been purposefully spreading false and misleading propaganda in some cases, so that is no surprise.

It wasn't too many months ago when "the experts" were telling us there was no human-to-human transmission, AND that wearing masks shouldn't be done since that could actually cause more contagion. Also, there was the 6' distancing rule spread widely in the media. Now, apparently, even that is being called into question too, as late as yesterday.

Wrong on ALL counts, unless they are again, lying to us.

There might be plenty of reasons to beleive her, as well as beleive otherwise.
Apart of everything it might as well be that China figured that they have significantly better chances to contain the epidemic by enforcing strict lockdowns, impossible in other countries – and it worked.
Now the numbers are growing again all across Europe and still growing all over the world, but it seems not that much in China…
As for artificial/natural origin of virus we've seen dozen contradicting statements from leading scientits. We can of course pick side, but it doesn't really reveals the truth.
I've even seen some bizarre suggestions that the virus was created and spread by Greens who want to clean the planet from excesive humanity ( and I'm nor even talking about 5G sending virus everywhere ;)

Of course it was China. They banned all domestic travel out of Wuhan but allowed international travel to continue so they could infect the world.

Yes I'm pretty sure China didn't do all it could to prevent the spread. Either thru incompetence or again taking advantage of the situation.

The PRC/CCP are not really friends of the USA. But the old saying goes, "Know your enemies … but do business with them anyway." … 💰

I think we have to give the scientific and medical community some credit – COVID-19 was unknown less than a year ago. So its hardly surprising there has been some apparent inconsistencies as they've gone up the very steep learning curve.

The science has also, as usual come off badly, as it comes in to contact with the grey areas of public policy making and media reporting.

A friend of mine has a long-running (still updating occasioanlly) reddit thread on Covid WIV theories.

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I don't think he's specifically refuted Dr. Yan's paper (which, it should be noted, wasn't peer reviewed) said paper doesn't present new evidence or (for the most part) interpretations, as it repeats several of the ideas this thread debunked months ago. I recommend reading through (preferably using the linked pdf version, as it seems easier).

Again, whether accidental or purposefully … the PRC/CCP is to blame …

This isn't about assigning blame, it's about assessing the truth of the claim that Covid was designed by humans (at all), or more specifically WIV. You can do that while blaming the Chinese Gov't for failing to contain Covid, if you like, but it's not relevant to whether or not Covid was created in a lab.

Regardless … it came from China and it was their responsibility to tell everyone the "truth" about COVID. They may not have known where it came from, but I doubt that, but they clearly knew about before it anyone else.

This is not the first time the PRC/CCP were less than forth coming on many subjects. They even at first blamed the US Army for COVID being released(?!). They knew more than they were saying and still do, IMO. They again were trying to cover up their handling COVID, etc. Whether it came about in a wet market or in lab. Seems to me no matter how you look at it they are on the blame line, IMO.

It didn't come from Kansas! AFAIK … 🌬

Yeah, the "theory" that Covid started from US soldiers is about as debunked as the idea that Covid started in a lab. No one in the thread above (Here on TMP or the reddit thread linked for that matter) is saying it came from Kansas, but lots are saying it came from a lab. Yet the statements are roughly equally implausible. Hence my attempts to provide a detailed resource on why "it came from a lab" is implausible. Your response is a non sequitur, and I feel the need to point out that saying replying "Regardless… whether it came about in a wet market or in a lab" in fact reinforces the false claim that it's plausible that it came about in a lab.

Do you see why a Chinese gov't propagandist might say "most larger militaries have stocks of chemical and biological weapons. Just in case … Is COVID-19 one of them in the USA's inventories ? Maybe … ? Better to err on the side of caution, IMO." (Your words with PRC replaced with USA). If you saw this propaganda, you might reply with the evidence that Covid in fact didn't come from a lab, but from the wild, and patient zero wasn't US soldiers, but likely in the civilian population of China from bat-human transmission. The Chinese propagandist would do well to make a similar misdirection, saying "whether or not the US started Covid, they are surely to blame for having a fifth of the Covid deaths in the world," thus avoiding admitting that their initial claim was false, and implying that we should go ahead and blame the US for both the real crimes and mistakes AND the imaginary ones, because which were which again?

So, you know, don't act like a propagandist.

Of course … but you know my background … sometimes my Cold War Warrior bias goes on auto-pilot. As we see the PRC/CCP [and Putin's Russia] is[are] not an ally. More of a "frienemy(s)" at best, in almost all cases. And yes with the US and PRC having the 2 biggest economies on the planet … we have to do business with each other, regardless. At least to some point …

So, you know, don't act like a propagandist.

More of a half educated(!) opinion.

Regardless, I'm not saying we should go to war or anything like that. However, it seems with a pretty good certainty it came from China. So I as well as others are thinking there should be some sort of "punitives" if for no other reason, most believe the PRC/CCP did not alert the World sooner, etc. And is at some fault …

E.g. I'm not calling it Murder, but more like Manslaughter … 🕵️‍♂️

Note: "It didn't come from Kansas! AFAIK " = hyperbole, ref: Dorthey, Toto, Wizard of Oz.

be not in Kansas anymore To no longer be in a place that one knows or where one is comfortable; to be in a completely unfamiliar and/or discomfiting environment. A reference to The Wizard of Oz, in which Dorothy, upon arriving to Oz, says, "Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore."

Communist's don't like their dirty linen being aired.
No doubt, just ask Putin too! Putin and the Chinese are now capitalist. And as far as "dirty linen being aired" find me a Politian in the West that does? The Chinese had tools that were off the table for the west. Imagine if we started shooting people for not wearing mask?

You can do that while blaming the Chinese Gov't for failing to contain Covid

Not blaming China for "failing to contain", but for actively spreading the virus. Once again, why did China shutdown all domestic travel in and out of Wuhan but allow international travel to continue?

Agreed …