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"9e Dragons AB - 18 mm" Topic

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1,479 hits since 13 Aug 2020
©1994-2021 Bill Armintrout
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von Winterfeldt14 Aug 2020 6:02 a.m. PST

In contrast to the well pampered AWI collectors or spoilt Boney enthusiasts, the French Revolution collector has sometimes to do with makeshifts.

Those are early French Napoleonic Dragoons, and there AB is usually quite keen in research and detail he did for cartridge pouches and sabre the M 1801 pattern, still what could I do – my French infantry needs at least some cavalry as well.

To realize the incredible microscopic sculpting you could open the photos in a new window to get it in bigger outlook and admire the stars at the rosette where the chin scales are fixed to the helmet – incredibile.

For the guidon bearer I have to find a producer who does such Dragoon guidons for about 1793.

Frederick Supporting Member of TMP14 Aug 2020 8:06 a.m. PST

Fantastic work – thanks for sharing

Valmy9214 Aug 2020 8:48 a.m. PST

vonW, amazing painting as always.
If you don't mind printing your own, Col Bill Gray has a file of Revolutionary flags from the old available for free download (link to download page)
This is what I do for most of my French Rev flags.
All the other countries are harder,

Tassie14 Aug 2020 10:08 a.m. PST

Very, very nice indeed, Von W.
Those are arguably the best French Dragoons I've seen in 18mm.
My compliments!

rmcaras Supporting Member of TMP14 Aug 2020 10:17 a.m. PST

fantastic brush work!!

nsolomon9914 Aug 2020 5:37 p.m. PST

Well done Von W., beautiful figures beautifully painted.

Sho Boki Sponsoring Member of TMP15 Aug 2020 1:38 a.m. PST

Splendid! AB + VW = Masterpiece of Art.

Gunner Dunbar15 Aug 2020 2:43 a.m. PST

Incredible, amazing paint job.

xLAVAx15 Aug 2020 3:42 a.m. PST

Beautiful, little pieces of art.

VonBlucher15 Aug 2020 7:34 a.m. PST

Look great!! Especially like the dapple grey, done a few of these myself dome extra work put they always look great.

von Winterfeldt15 Aug 2020 9:34 a.m. PST

thanks for all the compliments, the downside those dragoons are really post 1800 – I would wish to got those sculpted as Lejeune or Hoffmann show them.





Anthony Barton15 Aug 2020 9:51 a.m. PST

It's a pleasure to see what a lovely job you have made of them.
To be fair to myself, when originally sculpted they were intended for post-1800,in fact for the central period 1800 to 1812 .
We found that most people would use them for any period.
With the pressure of all the other things I had to make to keep customers happy, I never got around to making the precise pre-1800 period uniforms.
One day perhaps…

von Winterfeldt15 Aug 2020 9:58 a.m. PST

Thanks for the feed back, I absolutely understand your reasoning – unfortunately pre 1800 period (1792 – 1800) is my main interest, realizing well my minority positions but thank you very much for all your sculpts, they are always a pleasure to paint.

Valmy9215 Aug 2020 3:34 p.m. PST

AB, the thing I'd love to see for the early period is French generals, and perhaps a representative. I'd especially like to see them coming from the best. Those would be a little orphan in the wider AB line though unless you were expanding the early period generally. Epaulets can be removed in a conversion, but adding the little front point to the cocked hat when everyone makes the flat bicorne is beyond me.
Thanks for listening,

Garde de Paris16 Aug 2020 8:11 a.m. PST

Years ago, I gave up on collecting 54mm,single display, figures because of the magnificent artistry I saw in others. I did not have the time to develop such talent, "on the road, away from home" for 35 years.

So I began wargming with 30mm flats I had been given by F A O Schwartz (toy store of NYC), for doing a window display for them of French troops retrearing through a village as Russian, Prussian and Austrian columns converged to push them on.

Later I bought a few Jack Scruby 30mm figures, but it was when Charles Stadden's and Willies 30mm figures came on the market that I really began to build units. The Vietmeyer system, using 1:20 ratio, was the basis of a planned 48-battalion French Corps in Spain. I wanted to do units where I had good information of unique drummer, sapeur, voltigeur for specific units.

I mixed eras, having the 45eme de ligne in 1815; the 46eme de ligne in 1813 campaign; the 94th de ligne of the Austerlitz period; the 15eme de ligne in white Peninsular uniforms faced black; and even considered doing some units in the Revolutionary period helmet with fur crest, and/or, or mixed, cocked hat. An anthology of the Napoleonic era.

Painting as we see here has finally "driven the stake" through my continuing to build these units. Just no time left to become so good a painter!


stephen116220 Aug 2020 7:05 a.m. PST

I especially like the horses!

What kind of paints are you using?


von Winterfeldt20 Aug 2020 11:06 a.m. PST

I use acrylics for under painting and then artist water colours along with paint flow improver.

stephen116221 Aug 2020 2:03 a.m. PST

I will have to experiment with these products.



von Winterfeldt21 Aug 2020 5:35 a.m. PST

primer – rattle can white primer


artist acrlyic colour – natural umber – a heavy wash, or a dark violet

then an underpainting lets say dark skin tone, leave out the deep shades, don't overpaint them.

then a heavy wash of artist water colours, take off paint with a damp brush where light are requited – good hues are dark umber or a mix of sienna and burnt umber etc.

jwebster Supporting Member of TMP21 Aug 2020 12:49 p.m. PST

I have had this thread open for a while, looking at the photos. von Winterfeldt's painting is outstanding and he has sent me details in the past which has really helped me

I had just finished an extremely similar unit – and finally got the courage to post

It's not at the same standard, but still above what anyone should be painting for tabletop use. I am a little proud of my horses, I use oil wipe

I'll get around to Guidons and flags one of these days


MarbotsChasseurs21 Aug 2020 5:28 p.m. PST

Well done both of you. I have a soft spot for Dragoons!

von Winterfeldt21 Aug 2020 10:42 p.m. PST

they look great, good that you posted, my method with the water colours is a bit like oil wipe.

The Tyn Man23 Aug 2020 6:54 a.m. PST

Super work, some of the nicest I've seen here. If you don't mind saying, what do you use to high light the horse main, tail and tackle?


von Winterfeldt23 Aug 2020 7:08 a.m. PST

No I don't mind, the secret is under paint the long hair with a light grey you like, I use a warm one, so I mix a bit brown into the grey, then dry brush over the dark primed hairs – not over painting the deep recesses, folds etc, (see above), then when dry use artist water colours (Schmincke in my case, there is is ready available where I live) – black and a bit of brown or ochre, not a pure black and then add airbrush flow improver, let it run over the manes or horse tail, it will already shade itself. For those parts you like a bit more light, use a damp brush to take off the artist water colour and you have the highlights, the same goes for the tack, here I use a colder grey and mix a bit Prussian blue into my black – otherwise same procedure as above.
It is so easy.

The Tyn Man23 Aug 2020 7:48 a.m. PST

Many thanks, much appreciated. The funny thing is, I have a set of Schmincke water colours I happened to purchase in Salzburg a few years back. I thought they were quite pricey at the time, but are very good quality.


von Winterfeldt23 Aug 2020 8:10 a.m. PST

give it a try, one just has to find out how light one has to do the under painting.

The Tyn Man26 Aug 2020 9:42 a.m. PST

One more question, what kind of paints are you using. I'm still old school and use mainly enamels but I'm starting to rethink it after seeing the work you've done.


von Winterfeldt26 Aug 2020 9:57 p.m. PST

I use for base coating and under painting the usual hobby acrylics and artist acrylic, like GW, Army painter, Pro Acrlyics, Schmincke again, then for water colours – Schmincke Horadam (along with Vallejo Airbrush flow improver and of course some water to achieve the consistency which works best).

In case you use enamels, I don't know if water colours work, give it a try, otherwise I would substitute the water colours with artist oil colours, which may achieve an even better result.

C M DODSON26 Aug 2020 11:09 p.m. PST

Stunning work.

You have breathed life into them.

Best wishes,


Personal logo SHaT1984 Supporting Member of TMP27 Aug 2020 2:10 a.m. PST

No "I'll get around to Guidons and flags one of these days…"

John, just guidons… no 'standard/ entendards for the Dragoons (and yes I know ceertain revolutionary ones did have them), Rigo tells us that.

As to detailing horse colours, I suggest try the opposite- my never ending black undercoat; one wash of 'main' horsebody colour; then a thinner pale wash, then a light sand or tan; on rump, legs and front legs/ chest build up a variety of coloured layers.

Going the other way..? darken main colour, wash once, lightly swipe with a damp brush with a white wash,.
Leave to dry off for 30 mins.

Come back- don't like it? Amend colour or use a contrast- often for manes/ tails/ hocks etc. White sox only ever use a pale thin wash WHITE OR SAND over main colour of legs

Keep underbelly darker than most of horse to hide the grotesque bodywork of scupts! I find the horses are, apart from the furniture, the easiest part of my painting day,
regards davew
wine,,, mmmm Chambertin_

von Winterfeldt27 Aug 2020 3:03 a.m. PST

Thanks for all the comments, I am a bit surprised that the French Dragoons got such glowing comments, compared like with my Austrian and Prussian hussars which were much more difficult to paint, but are they so much worse compared to the French Dragoons?





The Tyn Man27 Aug 2020 7:42 p.m. PST


jwebster Supporting Member of TMP28 Aug 2020 7:12 p.m. PST

Definitely deserving of love

The lacing, the pom poms, the saddlecloths. What really impresses me is not just the detail, but the consistency. I might get a few just right, but never feel like going back to fix the ones that weren't quite there

What is your formula for the yellow lacing ?


von Winterfeldt05 Sep 2020 10:28 a.m. PST

no special formula, just two layers of yellow and then a touch up here and there with yellow artist water colours

Tassie08 Sep 2020 11:09 a.m. PST

The hussars are, in truth, also very good.

"but are they so much worse compared to the French Dragoons?"

Fishing for compliments, perhaps ?

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