Xenofun | 23 Mar 2020 10:24 a.m. PST |
Hi Everyone, I have some teens that I would like to introduce to nappy gaming. They enjoy history, but don't have much gaming experience outside of RPGs. I'm looking for rules recommendations. I don't care about figure size, or operational scale (brigade, corp, army, etc)- any is fine for me. I'm not looking for skirmish rules. So in your opinion, what rules are FUN,EASY (relative terms, I know), can be concluded in 1-3 hours, and can easily involve 2-4 players. Right now I have Shako and Napoleon at War, if any of you think those are good ones to try, but I'm happy to get new rules because I doubt I'll get a second shot at this :). Our available playing areas are a coffee table and dinner table. Cheers |
dwight shrute | 23 Mar 2020 10:35 a.m. PST |
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d88mm1940 | 23 Mar 2020 10:40 a.m. PST |
Try Jr General. Here's Salamanca: link |
mildbill | 23 Mar 2020 11:05 a.m. PST |
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Mike Petro | 23 Mar 2020 11:25 a.m. PST |
link I've used Rank and File as a extremely simple intro and everybody was blazing away within minutes. |
Who asked this joker | 23 Mar 2020 11:38 a.m. PST |
I'd say any of these except Black Powder. Too many moving parts. |
USAFpilot | 23 Mar 2020 11:39 a.m. PST |
what rules are FUN,EASY (relative terms, I know), can be concluded in 1-3 hours Commands & Colors Napoleonics is a fun and easy way to introduce Napoleonics. The rules are simple and well written, and everything you need to play is in the box. Playing any actual set of wargame rules on a non-gridded table top with miniatures is extremely complex and usually takes several days to complete a game; and that is if you are already familiar with the rules. |
Hayes Wauford | 23 Mar 2020 11:55 a.m. PST |
I agree on C&C being a great system! |
Jeff Ewing | 23 Mar 2020 12:02 p.m. PST |
Thomas' One Hour Wargames: link |
Jeffers | 23 Mar 2020 1:17 p.m. PST |
Another vote for One Hour. Pick them up in seconds and have them playing without referring to rules within minutes. They are designed to work on tables that have uses other than wargames… |
Valmy92 | 23 Mar 2020 1:20 p.m. PST |
Up a level (units being brigades) I'd suggest Volley and Bayonet would allow them to be the generals they read about. |
PzGeneral | 23 Mar 2020 1:27 p.m. PST |
I recommend Fast Play Napoleonic Wargame Rules by Jon Linney. They were the first we played and I thought they worked really well. And they are free….. link |
raylev3 | 23 Mar 2020 1:56 p.m. PST |
Teens should be able to handle Black Powder….otherwise, go with one hour wargames…VERY simple rules. |
arthur1815 | 23 Mar 2020 2:49 p.m. PST |
Bob Cordery's Portable Napoleonic Wargame has simple rules with a common structure for brigade, division and army level games. See his Wargaming Miscellany blog for details. |
Ed Mohrmann | 23 Mar 2020 3:26 p.m. PST |
Larry Brom's 'Before I was a Marshal…' was developed back in the 1960's to give a game in 1-3 hours. Units are 20 figures (inf) 12 (cav) gun and 4 figs is a battery (foot or horse). Four foot units with a gun is a brigade, single mounted figure for command. No 'national differences' but you can 'bolt on' some if you wish. Great intro rules for younger or inexperienced gamers but also a superb 'tool box' for adding your own preferences vis-a-vis national differences. Foot are organized 3 figures/base, cav 2 fig/base arty crew are individually based. Foot therefore are 6 bases of 3 plus a 2-figure command stand (officer and color). |
Desert Fox | 23 Mar 2020 8:44 p.m. PST |
Command and Colors to begin with, great introduction. After they get the basics of gaming I recommend Shako 1 because it is an easy read, simple, logical and easy to remember. Then I would like introduce them Black Powder and V&B. Seems like a logical progression to me. |
T Corret | 24 Mar 2020 11:17 a.m. PST |
Snappy Nappy allows a dive into large battles quickly. Most people seem to want to be a General, rather than a RSM. The game is also easy to begin, but hard to master. |
coopman | 24 Mar 2020 4:47 p.m. PST |
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Last Hussar | 25 Mar 2020 4:09 a.m. PST |
Not Shako, surely! I never really enjoyed a game of it. I'd say Black Powder. Let's face it too many grognards complained about how simple it was! |
Marc at work | 25 Mar 2020 8:30 a.m. PST |
Black powder – works well, and very flexible. You can make it more complicated if they enjoy it |
Xenofun | 25 Mar 2020 1:47 p.m. PST |
It seems One Hour Wargames, Black Powder, and Commands and Colors: Napoleonics are well regarded for this kind of situation. Turns out they wanted to try skirmish, so we played Song of Drums and Shakos and they had a ball. That works for me. And now I have some good rule suggestions if they want to do large-scale stuff. So thanks everyone! |
colkitto | 25 Mar 2020 3:31 p.m. PST |
I think there's a large battles variant of Song of Drums which might appeal? |
Xenofun | 25 Mar 2020 5:52 p.m. PST |
colkitto, I think that is where we are headed. |
HappyHiker | 10 Apr 2020 7:09 a.m. PST |
Another vote for Rank and File, my 12 year old loves them. Hated Black Powder. |
hexblade | 13 Apr 2020 7:25 a.m. PST |
+1 for Rank and File rules. Good basic set that makes for fun game. Easy for anyone to use, and as you go, you can add optional rules that are sprinkled within the rule book. Also very easy to add house rules. Bonus, you can use them for other horse and musket periods. |
Old Contemptible | 24 Jul 2021 3:34 p.m. PST |
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SHaT1984 | 24 Jul 2021 6:27 p.m. PST |
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pfmodel | 24 Jul 2021 11:14 p.m. PST |
A Boardgame may be the best initial option, SPI produced a large number of boardgames in the past which were easy to learn and play. This is a link to one example: PDF link But for pure figure gaming rules, DBN, Absolute Emperor, Snappy Nappy are good options. |
Rome Bruce | 26 Jul 2021 9:57 a.m. PST |
If you want something published in this decade, try Absolute Emperor. It is specifically designed to help people get into the period and still have ranks and flanks (not skirmish level). It is through Osprey and available through Amazon. Yes I'm the author and not a schill (I can't afford a schill :p) |
4th Cuirassier | 28 Jul 2021 3:52 a.m. PST |
I've no specific recommendation for rules but would suggest that a good set to adopt would be any simple and intuitive ones that don't require wholesale rebasing when the users are ready to move on to something more complex. |
arthur1815 | 29 Jul 2021 3:27 a.m. PST |
Thinking it over, if starting figure gaming one can't beat Charge! by Brigadier Peter Young and Lieutenant-Colonel J.P. Lawford. Although the book shows the example battles being fought with SYW figures, there is no reason why one couldn't use Napoleonic troops instead. Simple introductory rules using only d6 and figure removal, accompanied by a scenario, will enable youngsters to get playing quickly; later they can progress to the advanced rules and a more complex scenario involving larger forces. |
dantheman | 29 Jul 2021 8:33 a.m. PST |
I also recommend Commands and Colors Napoleonics. I know posts above Pooh-Pooh Shako, but I HAVE a teenage son and he started playing it with me and liked it a lot. You can start with a small scenario (I did last day of Arcola) to learn the ropes. Shako is easily scalable. Black Powder is also simple. Start again with a simple scenario to learn concepts. In the end it is the scenario as much as the rules in my personal experience. So few rules start with a learning the ropes approach. Kills it for younger players. |
doubleones | 31 Aug 2021 1:24 a.m. PST |
I'll second Rank and File by Crusader. Very good system that's open to tweaking. |
Michael Hopper | 31 Aug 2021 12:03 p.m. PST |
+1 dantheman – I have to agree, been playing Lasalle more recently than Empire IV, still dabble in Shako, loved General d'Armee at first sight, but while ALL rules can work, it really depends on three factors: 1. How much detail does a group of players want? 2. What speed of play can players afford, or desire? 3. KISS (Keep it simple) Scenarios, which I prefer to point-based games with just about any set of rules or period of history, are something that I relate to because I read about the combats through historian efforts to bring the battles to life through their research and writing. Peter Anderson puts on great games at Historicon each year, and regardless of his choice of rules I find the scenarios are thought out and fun for all. Ditto Bill Gray does Age of Eagles scenarios at the brigade level. I do not paint brigades as units but watched him run a game one year and admired both the rules he developed, and the scenario he ran at the time. Likewise, Sam Mustafa has interesting and innovative ideas for his various rulesets, to eliminate player total control/helicopter views. The rules are gamey to prevent player gamey control, but what really brings Sam's games to life are scenarios people have developed and shared via his wiki. If xenofun or dantheman or anyone wants to talk about scenario work, I can share samples too. I share concerns by others that young(er) players are turned off if complex rules (which work) do not allow the new players to phase themselves into a period and the mechanics of the system. Scenarios are not the only solution to teaching the new players but they can certainly help make the transition easier. Michael log1cal.mh AT gmail.com |