"Help With Identification: Danes? Dutch?" Topic

I recently added to my collection of military art and I'll readily admit I'm not sure what I bought. The auction house listed it as "Civil War era soldier" which is vague enough to be correct I suppose. I'm 98% sure those aren't troops from the ACW, but they are from the middle decades of the 19thC. My initial feeling was/is Danes from the 2nd Schleswig War.

So I'm hoping the vast knowledge base that is TMP might shed some light. I included a close-up the signature in case anyone recognizes it or has a good guess. Pics are from the auctioneer, plus a few from me now that's in my happy little hands.

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French Garde Mobile of the Franco-Prussian War but I'm just guessing.

I was speculating on some sort of FPW reserve or Republican types but I think the regimental/battalion number (17) might not jibe?

It could be Danes from the 1864 war but the regimental numbers being so high makes it more likely French but I am not sure.

The Danish army of 1864 was organized into numbered battalions and there were at least 22. That said, these might be French.

Also, most pictures show the Danes in double-breasted jackets.

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The officer's hat and rank insignia looks more French as does the infantry's personal kit. The Danes looked different, the hats being plainer for a start.

The pack carried by the infantryman directly behind the officer also looks very French. I'd opine that it is French Gardes Mobiles. They wore a completely blue uniform (coats and pants).

Jim

[q]The officer's hat and rank insignia looks more French as does the infantry's personal kit.[q]

I thought so too but was thrown by the number. However, I guess I was thinking of later French practice where Reserves and Territorials started serially in the 200s.

After looking at some OOBs, "17" could be a regimental or battalion number for the Mobiles, so I think that's the most likely.

Garde Mobile kepis should have a red band, though:

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Could they be French Chasseurs a Pied? There were more than 20 battalions of them, and if my Detaille is any guide they stopped wearing epaulettes in the field by the 1870s. I'd further guess that the date is somewhere between the FPW and the turn of the century?

not at all French…

the officer has a curious white strap on shoulder, that is not at all french, also combining golden laces but red piping on trousers with something white on the collar
the bugler seems to wear a button on a collar patch something like the italian mostrine and others armies, an other uniformological detail not at all french as the French musicians usually have tricolour stripes
even the képis of the soldiers with their curious form and without piping and number don't seem purely-french but inspired by french, it is not the same thing,
and there were a lot of countries inspired by french military mode…

The rings on the cuffs suggest to me that he is a naval officer like the French capitaine d'infanterie de marine here:
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Many of these fought on land in the Franco-Prussian War. Perhaps this is not a famous one like Jaureguiberry or Gougeard, but another such, commanding gardes mobiles?

Chris

Bloody Big BATTLES!
groups.io/g/bloodybigbattles
bloodybigbattles.blogspot.com

Is this likely to be the Sino-French War/Tonkin War/Keelung Expedition of 1884/1885 or of Boxer Rebellion 1900?

This'd then be French Naval infantry.

The packs all have the metal canteen set on top, the bugler looks native, there are some peaked mountains in the background, and the figures on the right-hand side all have an assortment of headgear, oh, and the officer has a bamboo cane.

It never occurred to me that it might not be set in Europe! That is a very European church spire lower left, however.

they are not French, such uniform is not French, nor Marine Infantry, Mobile Guard, Chasseurs or anything like that
the bugle and the bugler don't have nothing french, the tricolour elements are totally missing on both, there were only white and red
for an Officer of the 17th Chasseurs he should have at least silver laces
the 17th Colonial/Marine Infantry Regt didn't exist before the XXth century and in the Far East

here you are in the years 1870'-1880'
search in others Armies than French having a 17th Battalion or Regiment

I'm thinking Chilean or Peruvian, 1879-1884 war of the Pacific.

Thank you Lilian for definitively ruling out the French!

Good thought korsun0! Pursuing the possibility of the Pacific War or the Triple Alliance.

Resurrecting this thread to thank korsun0 for sending me this link
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..which led me to investigate and verify via this…
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So, a de Neuville copy.

bravo to Sherlock Holmes and Dr Watson

that was why he didn't represent at all a French Army uniform but seemed inspired by the French
the copier took liberties with the original and the French uniformology

an other version than in the thread with accurate colours and details, beginning by the traditional silver and yellow of the Chasseurs, the missing tricolour of the bugle etc

Lilian, in all fairness to the copyist, the pictures I posted (which were the auctioneer's) may be a little off due in part to the lighting as well as how they display on the monitor.

He (or she) did do the tricolour of the bugs cords, albeit in a more rudimentary fashion. Also, the officers' trouser piping is yellow, not red. this shows pretty clearly on the lower leg. On the thigh, the artist shaded towards the brown end of yellow, which does appear as red in the photo. There are also some things (e.g., buttons) that appear as white or gold in the photo which are actually silver in the painting. Really, the only thing that I can't determine for certain is the officer's rank braid. I've examined it closely with various lighting and I still can't be certain whether it is silver or gold. It's baffling.

Well done, sir. Some artists also take liberties with uniform details and colors. They are paintings -- not photographs.