"Problems with Tiny Wargames." Topic

I have been having problems with Tiny Wargames.

A bit of back story. I ordered a mat back in the summer from Tiny Wargames. Had a lengthy communication with Richard and put the order in. The mat came 6 weeks later and it was a lovely product. Only problem it wasn't what I ordered. So I communicated with Richard and we made a deal for a 2nd mat with a 25% discount. That was on October 29. I got an email from him on November 15 with a shipping receipt showing the package had been shipped. So far so good. I was able to track the package to Canada and then watched the package get reshipped back to the UK and then declared delivered. Odd. I contacted Richard about this. His response was strangely evasive. I waited another week and no sign of the package so I contacted him on December 12 suggesting the package had been lost. No response. I contacted him again on December 14 and I got this strange reply.

URGENT NEWS !!

NEW OWNERSHIP

Tinywargames are going through a change of ownership and there are delays to orders, please allow us time for the change over. We apologise for huge delays to orders in this time. No new orders will be processed until January 2020.

I responded by asking Richard what this had to do with me since my package had already been shipped.

"All orders will be fulfilled" was the response.

I then responded by asking Richard if my mat had been shipped in November. No response.

I have no idea what to believe. I put in a Paypal dispute and we will see where that goes. I do feel there has been some element of fraud and/or misrepresentation. Certainly important information is missing. If the mat was shipped in November and lost then a simple trace request would likely find it. If the mat was not shipped then why the duplicity? The strange journey of the package is also off putting. It comes to Canada and then is returned to England and shown delivered.

Any way, warning be told. Also, there is nothing about the change in ownership or delay in order fulfillment on Tiny Wargames website that I could find. All this is especially unfortunate since I think they make a great product.

I had the shipping shuffle a while ago, only mine went back and forth 6 times. It turned out initially the house number was wrong (it went to an elementary school 1 block away) then UPS and their horrible support hit. The national support # didn't tell the local place where to send it so it kept getting "delivered" then 2 days later "returned". I even called the school and they were going to just hold it and I'd come pick it up. They said even the driver couldn't figure out why it kept coming back. Anyway I had to go to the distribution center and hand pick it up. I got my mats but a big pain. I don't know anymore about the ownership deal. If you can find out what the address is on the package that may be the problem, I've heard of someone else having the same issue so maybe something with the labeling system?

Thanks for sharing your experience. The problem in my case is that the package is shown as delivered on the Royal Mail tracking. I should add that the package is deliverable only with signature.

The sender, it seems, is the only one who can order a trace on the package. Which means Richard has to do it. And he is AWOL!!

There have been persistent problems with order fulfilment by Tiny for at least 18 months – poor/misleading communication, ‘lost' orders and a lot of disorganisation, though I've always (eventually) received my orders and the product quality is pretty good.

Maybe new ownership is what the business needs – though it looks as if the US distributor was unaware of developments as well!

USPS is, of course, always a possible point of failure. They're quite capable of dropping a package off on (or near) a porch and then swearing the recipient signed for it.

I have heard several reports of long delays in orders, incorrect mats sent, poor communication, etc over the last year…

Mike

It is the same story (delays and excuses since early September) with the Cloth rivers and roads kick starter.

Yea, recently I got a POD from the USPS for a package delivered 60 miles away, AND not to my address, or anyone else I know.

I finally got the package after 1.5 – 2 weeks, but I suspect only because I raised the issue with claims and the local office multiple times.

The USPS was dumb-founded and blamed the seller's listing company for the bogus "delivery confirmation" to my address, instead of the one they actually delivered to, which had a completely different street and city name. Not surprising they wouldn't take ownership of the error on the "delivery confirmation" which was totally incorrect.

I had problems with them, too.It wasn't a shipping issue though. I cannot recommend dealing with them.

I had a similar experience 2 years back with lack of order follow-up and inconsistent or lack of communication. Customer service was pretty bad.
Great product though. Hopefully new ownership fixes that.

TRU

I was on the verge of ordering a sea mat from them. Thanks for the warning. I shall look elsewhere.

I would be very weary of commenting on this company as::::;

"We do not appreciate bad or negative feedback or our name slandered online. We will take swift legal action against anyone who does so."

In my opinion they have a bad track record with their kickstarters with delays, excuses, lack of communication, unsupported claims against people, threat of legal action.

If looking for alternative mats I would highly suggest Cigar Box Battle mats cigarboxbattle.com

Disclaimer (so I don't get accused of being a competitor) I do not work for or am affiliated with any company that makes war gaming mats or anything war gaming related.

Yes, I have looked at cigarboxbattle.com as a possible alternative. The only problem is that I was hoping to get a 8'by 6' sheet and they seem to only make mats up to 6' by 4'.

The Cigar Box Mats are oversized so they are closer to 56"x76"If that makes any difference. I to had trouble finding a 8'x5' mat, but did get one from The Terrain Guy before he stopped selling.

Have you looked at: link

OR: terrainmat.com

I am sure there will be a clarification post imminently?

I see Tiny have just posted on their FB page that they can no longer accept PayPal – that's never a good sign, whatever the reason.

"We have had major issues with PayPal and can no longer accept it, any orders placed in November December will be refunded. This is totally PayPal's fault, if you have not received your order please just cancel and get a refund, many apologies. We now only accept debit or credit cards or bacs payments ."

no longer taking paypal sounds odd to me.

I have an order in with them at the moment. Not good news. I have asked for a refund but no reply.

Today they've changed their Facebook settings to go invisible to searches unless you're already a member of the closed group – seems an odd thing to do.

Caveat Emptor.

They have recently protected their Twitter page…

Marcus, I have an 8' x 6' Tiny Plains Mat that I bought as a sample, and haven't used- if you want one I'd be happy to sell it on. Also the Deep-Cut equivalent. You can email me via the BigRedBatShop.

Thanks BRB. I appreciate the offer.

My first mat from Tiny Wargames was a Grasslands mat. The mistake was that I had ordered a hex grid on top of it which wasn't done. So we agreed to a second mat with the hex grid.

If you don't mind my asking how would you compare the Deep-Cut and Tiny Wargame mats with each other. I was looking at Deep-Cut and your website as an alternative to Tiny. Is the Deep Cut cloth similar in look and feel to the Tiny mat?

"Due to a problem with Paypal we are temporarily suspending our service.
​
If you have placed an order and not received goods, please put in a dispute with Paypal and you will be refunded, we have been forced to do this because of the failings of the Paypal system.
​
Many apologies.
​
We shall return in the future.
​
info@tinywargames.co.uk"

Posted on FB today – whatever the reason, looks pretty terminal

Hi Marcus, I'm not very familiar with the Tiny products so I can't comment on the quality of their mats. I know Deep-Cut cloth mats very well, though, I use them in all my own games; super quality.

I have got both mats. Deep Cut are definitely superior.

I'm late to the discussion but I had the same dramas as everyone else with parcels bouncing supposedly around the place for 8 weeks. Mine turned up eventually as I was about hit the PayPal dispute button. I checked the postage markings and saw the mat was posted only about two weeks before it arrived. Good luck with threats to sue for slander. Funny how everyone has the same story to tell.

Just to add that I had escalated my dispute with Paypal against Tiny Wargames and I just got word that I am getting a full refund. So that is relief. I have ordered a similar product from Deep Cut Studios and I must say the whole process was significant improvement from what I experienced with Tiny Wargames. I should be getting my new mat sometime this week.

I bought my first mat from tinywargames about Jan 2016, since then I have bought about 16 for my self and over two dozen for my club mates.
All have arrived with little or no problems and have been promptly changed if there was a problem. These last 6 months or so tinywargames have had problems and are trying to sort thing out. I have an order in for 10 mats and I am confident they will arrive.
I have mats from deep cut as well and prefer the tinywargames.each to their own but give tinywargames a chance to sort their problems out.

Just got my Deep Cut Studios mat today. I think overall I prefer Deep Cut to the Tiny Wargames but they are both fine products. The difference between the two companies really showed in communication between us. Deep Cut was professional from the very first interaction to the very last. Kostos did up a proof for me and once the proof was confirmed it took about 3 weeks for the product to arrive. I would say my communication with Richard was odd. It seemed lax and not very rigorous.

Stewart, I don't know about Richard's problems but when you take people's money and then don't deliver on the product that is not right. I notice on the Tiny Wargames website that Richard is blaming Paypal for his problems. The shows me that he is not taking responsibility for his state of affairs. Paypal had nothing to do with his screw up of my order. Judging from other comments above the situation has developed over more than 6 months. Too bad because he does have a good product.

@Marcus Brutus

I am happy you are happy. Can you show us the mat? Is it a custom mat? It sounds like it was custom in one way or another.

Does anyone have any experience with either Deep Cut or Tiny Wargames for custom mats?

Marcus is right too, when a company has problems and continues to accept orders and doesnt communicate, it aint good. As always, communication is the key. As a hobbyist, I accept that some of these cottage businesses run into product/cash crunches and I am not unsympathetic but the tiny minded personality that runs and hides and then gets irate if we dont accept its several months or more of silence is rightly to be criticized.

I have bought custom mats from both Deep Cut and Tiny Wargames. I have had no problems with Deepcut, although I understand they are no longer capable of producing the large mats I wanted, owing to an update of their machinery. I have also bought a number of mats from Tiny Wargames, all of them custom made. There have been some problems regarding exact details, but all were resolved amicably and I received the correct product within a reasonable amount of time, Richard was polite and helpful at all times, and e mail exchange was a satisfactory means of communication. My last mat from them, a 15ft by 6ft gridded snow mat, was bought about six months ago, before their current difficulties.

Hi Richard here from tinywargames. PayPal caused us too many issues as we relied solely on them for everything. Payments, cash flow and invoicing. We stopped using them because of this. We are now using better methods . We have refunded over £5,000.00 GBP worth of orders and sent free gifts to apologise. We are sorry you have had a negative experience but we have now vastly improved in all areas and are back on track. Regards

Glad to hear that Richard. The snow mat is due to get a major outing in a couple of weeks!

Richard, your statement above makes absolutely no sense to me. At least in my case the payment was made. The parcel was shipped and it returned to the UK. At that point you did absolutely nothing to attempt to track the package or resolve the issue. You essentially threw up your hands, sent out a lamb statement and went silent.

I disputed with the order Paypal as my only remedy. I would highly recommend people not deal with Tiny Wargames because of your unethical practices. I thank God for using Paypal on this order and having some protection.

Hi Marcus Brutus, if you email your details we can reply.

Old news vastly improved service now!