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"Why does everyone assume Napoleon was the problem?" Topic


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02 Oct 2019 10:32 a.m. PST
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Whirlwind01 Oct 2019 7:36 a.m. PST

The excuse of the captives at Jaffa being under parole has been questioned (see Napoleon Series this year passim) and in any case Bonaparte was not obliged to carry out mass 'executions' even if they were justified by the laws of war.

Andrew Roberts, generally very sympathetic to Napoleon, covers this in his "Napoleon the Great". If you are pedantic, Napoleon broke the terms of the parole first by disarming some of the prisoners. If less pedantic, the number of victims claimed by Napoleon himself was higher than the number of parolees, plus the killing of the troops that Eugene had promised quarter to.

Brechtel19801 Oct 2019 8:48 a.m. PST

Just to be clear, Kevin, can you confirm that you do think it's possible and likely for someone to commit suicide by stabbing themselves seven times in the chest?
Because that's why it's impossible to believe Villeneuve committed suicide.
If you actually do believe that, what's the point of a reasoned discussion?

Where did I state that I thought Villeneuve committed suicide?

I do believe that I stated he was murdered. I have seen no proof, however, that Napoleon ordered it.

If you have a source for your position, then please post it.

Deleted by Moderator

von Winterfeldt01 Oct 2019 10:00 a.m. PST

so Jaffa – again, under those slaughtered were women, children yes it is in de la Jonquière – I see again that also this thread has ran his course and I see it pointless to contribute any longer.
Boney gets literally away with mass murder.

André Peyrusse :

On avait bien recommandé de ne pas prodiguer la poudre et on a eu la férocité de les poignards à coups de baïonnette; on a trouve parmi les victimes beaucoup d'enfants, en mourant, s'étaient attachées aux corps de leurs pères,

p. 271

La Jonquière : L'Expédition D'Égypte (1798 – 1801), Tome IV, re print, Paris 2003

and

Bernoyer :

(…) furent la cause de l'épouvantable massacre de troupes de cette garnison et des malheureux inhabitants de la ville. tout fut mis à feu et à sang.

(…)
ni le sexe, ni l'âge, rien fut épargné.

p. 145

Bernoyer, Avec Bonaparte en Egypte 1798 – 1800 & en Syrie
1981

4th Cuirassier01 Oct 2019 4:49 p.m. PST

So we agree Villeneuve was murdered but that Napoleon organised the official lies about it? Good.

Now, let's move on. Other than Napoleon, who had the motive to murder Villeneuve and the means to have it mendaciously covered up as suicide?

For bonus points, who later said that it he'd wanted Villeneuve dead he'd have organised a show trial and had him shot?

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