"Getting started with FoW v4, where to begin?" Topic

I recently found an FoW group in my area that I didn't know existed, had a demo on Sunday and was sold as I've been looking for a historical gaming group for years.

The group plays primarily Mid-War and after some thought and consideration, I decided to go with the Afrika Korps. I also don't know that much about the African theatre so it'll provide ample opportunity for me to do research and learn, which is part of the appeal of historical gaming to me.

I've ordered the "El Alamein" starter box to get a few things at first. I know that I'll need the army book (I forget the actual name, and I wanted to call them Codexes because I'm mainly a 40k player haha). I saw there's the "Rommel's Afrika Korps" boxed set which has a bunch of tanks and two 88s, would that be a good starting place to begin?

I noticed from looking at the FoW website that most of the starting lists they suggest are all tanks and guns, with little or no infantry. Is this common? I like Panzers as much as the next guy but it seems odd to see a starter list with no boots on the ground.

If you're going Mid-War then the Afrika Korps box is a good place to start. It has a nice mix of tanks and some 88's too. Plus you get another mid-War rulebook as well. The El Alamein set has only 5 tanks and they will match nicely with the Afrika Korps set. Plus you have a couple of Allied tanks for target practice…

You need the Afrika Korps book too for your army lists.
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You really can't field infantry without it.
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The infantry is getting pretty rare these days, but you can still find them.

And yes, the Afrika Korps was pretty short on infantry even in the panzergrenadier regiments and in the 90th Afrika Division. They really depended heavily on the Italians to hold the line while the mechanized/motorized Afrika Korps provided the armored punch for the Panzerarmee Afrika. The Germans just didn't send a lot of grunts to Africa and the German TO&E shows it. IIRC, the 21st and 15th Panzer Divisions only had a single regiment of schutzen each and they only had two battalions. They were pretty small organizations…

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So the Afrika book does a pretty fair job representing the Afrika Korps. My biggest complaint is that the recce battalions are missing so you can't field them as formations. You can only get recce units from the two scout car choices that come in your support diagram. : /

There might be more goodies in the Afrika Korps command cards, but I don't own the deck and haven't bought it through Forces of War yet. I will get around to it one day.

Anyway, all you need are some grunts, 50mm ATGs, the Afrika Korps set, and some arty and you're good to go. The 10 tanks you'll have will give you a solid tank formation which you can add to an infantry formation. One interesting thing: to field an infantry formation you'll need two infantry blisters AND a boxed set of 50mm tank hunters. Apparently the infantry in the desert had ATGs at really low levels to make them more independent in the field. Also, be ready for the size shock of a German infantry platoon… they are tiny! But they have a LOT of firepower.

I am also just getting started with V4. I am planning on doing Afrika corps too. I am do a Heavy Tank Platoon. Tigers and Panzers, with artillery and other support units.

I like that V4 has all the stats on the cards. What I don't understand though is this:
If I have a tank platoon, with all same type of tank, do I need one card for the whole platoon, or one card for each tank? (I assume one card for the entire platoon)?
And do the units/box sets for V4 come with their own cards, or do you buy the cards separate?

I still need to get the Africa corp book for V4. But I have an older hardcover FOW book for that theater and it has excellent info, very detailed.

Honestly you don't need any cards if you have the book. The cards are just reference tools that help speed up the game. They are pretty awesome and are very handy. I usually take only one card for each platoon type that I field- taking more is just unnecessary. After all, this is Flames of War and not Alpha Strike where you need a card for each mech. The cards just show you the unit's stats for your convenience.

As for the cards, you get the necessary cards in the version 4 releases, so be careful when you buy older sets as they won't have the cards. You can also find full decks of the cards for sale at games stores and on-line. I strongly recommend getting them as they are just too handy to go without.

Thanks TGunner. I thought you could use the cards or the book, but with the stats on the cards I think they are very handy that way also.

Awesome, thanks! I just ordered the DAK starter box with the tanks and AA guns, the book and the tokens.

You can use either, but I find the cards to be more handy at the table than the book.

That's a pretty solid start, Wayniac. I also grabbed another El Alamein set because they are cheaper than the platoon sets and have a nice mix of useful tanks. But then again I collect both German and Brits. Having the extra rulebooks is very handy too.

At Origins in 2018 the BF vendor was selling boxed sets 'Buy 2 get one free". So I got 3 El Alamein sets….. all the desert armor I could want….

Of course they aren't painted yet

So the Afrika book does a pretty fair job representing the Afrika Korps. My biggest complaint is that the recce battalions are missing so you can't field them as formations. You can only get recce units from the two scout car choices that come in your support diagram.

From the command cards .

Looking at pics of the ETC armies on BF's FB Group , you would think the DAK was just Armoured Cars + Italian L 6/40 light tanks !

Welp, I also decided to do a British army because I found a good deal online for the "Monty's Desert Rats" box. So my wife let me put in an order the other day for that and I ordered Armoured Fist, Monty's Desert Rats and the Armoured Fist token set. Ironically, it has already shipped while I'm waiting for the Afrika Korps stuff to ship (I ordered the British army from eBay while I ordered the Germans from Miniature Market, which is seeming to be a mistake).

So I guess I'm also a British player now :) They have cool looking tanks, I'll give them that!

- Wayne

Dude! I totally splurged with the new LW releases and bought:

Hit the Beach starter set
American Starter Force: US Combat Command
German Starter Force: Panzer Kampfgruppe
Soviet Starter Force: Tank Shock Group
FOW 4th Ed full-size hard cover rulebook
D-Day American Forces in Normandy army book
D-Day Americans unit and command cards

I would have but this group prefers to play Mid War. I'm not sure if they'll branch out to late.

-Wayne

i have tons of italian forces. if you are within tri state area. can provide counterbalance. (new jersey, pa, or delaware)

Sorry no, waaaaay south in good old sunny (not the past week or so though haha) Florida.

-Wayne

MY group is also getting back into FoW.
I have a question on the Armoured Car Company above. The card says 0 points for it, but under the 1st bulet, it says you may field a Sd Kfz 221 (Mg) for 1 point. But none of the other bullets have point values in them. ??? How do these new cards work? Or should I look it up in the rules?

My group is also getting back into FoW.
I have a question on the Armoured Car Company above. The card says 0 points for it, but under the 1st bulet, it says you may field a Sd Kfz 221 (Mg) for 1 point. But none of the other bullets have point values in them. ??? How do these new cards work?

While the formation indicated on the card is free, the units of the formation listed on it are not. You will need the relevant army book to determine the points costs.

You will need the relevant army book to determine the points costs.

Or the pack of unit cards , if you can still get them .

So a quick update since it's been about a month:

My group has been having fun, and we've actually expanded to become an actual "wargaming club" in my area which I've wanted for years and years. I found British to be pretty fun but I'm switching to DAK (like I originally was going to do, funnily enough) because out of the four "main" players in the group (including me) who regularly show up, two are USA and one is Germany, so I figured I'd play Axis (and didn't want Italy, for obvious reasons) to balance it out a bit more.

Being new to FoW still I kind of don't like how anti-historical you can make some lists (especially some of the tournament lists I've seen online.. good lord, it's like 40k all over again) but the game itself is fun (although I think I'd enjoy something a bit more historical and tactical)

If you can find the FoWv3 books and supplementing lists, it's more historical in what you can bring. Still possible to get strange things like Tiger 1s and Panzer 35ts, I think, but better.

Otherwise, bringing historical lists is a matter of the player not being a doofus.

Luckily the people I play with seem to actually care a bit about the accuracy, but I think that's my one gripe with FoW; it feels too close to a wargame that just happens to look like WW2 rather than be an actual WW2 wargame. Similar to how Bolt Action, despite being a pretty good game, is basically WW2 Warhammer 40k.

Incidentally what I've found is that a lot of WW2 games are either too small for our taste (e.g. platoon/company level like Chain of Command or Bolt Action, again despite both of these looking like great rules; Battlegroup seems to be similar since it wants to use individual figures although it allows for stands) or just way too abstract and require too much logistics. The size/scale of FoW is good, just the way it plays leaves much to be desired (despite its rules being pretty good).

-Wayne

Flames works quite nicely with a rump battalion per side. roughly 6 platoons of infantry, MG platoon, Mortar platoon, AT Gun platoon, Tank platoon, and artillery battery of 4-6 guns.

Modeling-wise, I use an artillery staff team as the BN XO. Having a bunch of guys standing around a map looks like the battalion Tactical Ops Center/second in command.

What I find interesting is that FoW is always referenced as a "company" level game but it feels larger (possibly due to the 15mm scale). Especially since most other "company level" games I've seen use individually based models and not stands (e.g. Battlegroup, Chain of Command, IABSM), which seems closer to a company (several platoons and support) while FoW feels like you have several companies, so battalion level.

I'm enjoying the game so far other than the weird way lists are built since I would have preferred something a bit less restrictive but more historical if that makes sense. Also, 100 points as the standard for v4 feels too little (obviously in a non-tournament the points can be whatever) since it's like two companies and maybe a support unit but with the restrictions, you end up being limited.

I know my group isn't fond of small scale, "few platoons of infantry and a tank" type of games, although the more I think about it, the more that doesn't feel that bad for WW2 while it wouldn't for other periods. So the battalion (?) size seems to be good. I'm actually curious what other rules are that scale, the ones I've seen are either company/reinforced company (the aforementioned couple of platoons and some support) or like an operational scale where they might as well not use models but a map.

-Wayne

Well, Flames is originally designed as the player in charge of one core company with a heck of a lot of support (like the entire battalion weapons company, possibly the Regimental weapons company, and even the Division's heavy weapons)

It's a very flexible company level game that's loosely based on historical TO&E.

A tank company is comprised of one or (in some cases) two command tanks but must have a minimum of two tank platoons of the same type, although some lists allow you swap in a platoon of a different type of tank in a mixed company. You can elect to have a full-strength company by adding an optional third platoon, and if you have points left you can choose from a wide range of support units on the company list or from Divisional assets.

And that's still not all the choices you have. There are many types of companies (infantry and tank) in FOW, and any mandatory core unit in them can be used as support options for any other type of company.

A tank company can easily have over 10 – 15 tanks, depending on the max size of the platoons under them. A full-strength M4A1 Sherman platoon, for instance, can have 17 (2× command tanks plus 15× Shermans in 3 platoons of 5 each).

Some of the threads on BF's FB group about list building , are atm better than watching a comedy show .

Some of those lists are just disgusting. I mean, if you don't care about historical composition and only how good or competitive something is, why not play 40k instead? Don't sully a historical game with that stuff.

Whereabouts in South Florida are you, Wayniac? We have several FoW players in my local area, we play at Docking Bay 94 in Coconut Creek.

I'm just getting started too. Picked up the 'Hit The Beach!' box and I've got about half the Germans painted. I'd like to put together an American and a German D-Day force. Do I need the D-Day force books? Or could I use just the unit cards?

Do I need the D-Day force books? Or could I use just the unit cards?

You will need the D-Day books. The cards are nice aids but they do not have enough information on them to replace the books, which have TO&E's and point costs.