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"Some concerns with Mod Podge on the terrain" Topic


20 Posts

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806 hits since 11 Jun 2019
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
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Bowman11 Jun 2019 11:54 a.m. PST

So I built a small Japanese village for a Pirate Raid game for Historicon. I used Mod Podge to seal the XPS Foam, painted on top of that and sealed it with a spray sealer (one that didn't damage the foam with it's propellant).

On top of the foam I have buildings that sit on bases. If I leave the buildings sitting on the foam for a week or so the pieces stick. I've had to repair other pieces of Mod Podge terrain which, being in contact, glued themselves together. Since Mod Podge is made partially from PVA glue, I worry that the glue contacts other glue and sticks together. Especially in a warm car.

This is in relatively cool Canada over the winter. Now I'm driving all this to Pennsylvania in hot and humid July. Should I be worried that I arrive in Lancaster with all my terrain glued to one big blob?

Iver used sheets of parchment paper to keep my terrain pieces separated in transit, and I hope that's enough. Any tips/help from other builders? Do I need another heavier coat of sealer? Thanks for any advice

Walking Sailor11 Jun 2019 12:31 p.m. PST

Good old fashioned wax paper would be cheapest, but it might leave a residue, which may or may not matter on finished pieces. Next up is plastic wrap. Try that before buying a roll as it's not stiff and will slip down. [but I know where you can nick a test piece] Then tin foil?

historygamer Supporting Member of TMP11 Jun 2019 1:56 p.m. PST

Instead of wax paper, perhaps try baking paper.

Bowman11 Jun 2019 2:06 p.m. PST

Parchment paper is baking paper, which I believe is better than just plain waxed paper.

Do you think another coat of sealer would be good?

Dynaman878911 Jun 2019 4:11 p.m. PST

First off is how long will it still outside of the car or hotel and will you have the Air Conditioning on? If the answer is not long then there should be nothing to worry about. If you plan on leaving it in the car overnight is a different matter.

Torquemada11 Jun 2019 11:47 p.m. PST

What a lovely problem to have :-)

Bowman12 Jun 2019 3:30 a.m. PST

If you plan on leaving it in the car overnight is a different matter

That will be a problem. I drive from Canada and usually do the drive in two shifts. Plus I'm visiting Gettysburg on the way home.

What a lovely problem to have :-)

Ya, potentially damaging my game that I'm putting on at Historicon during the transport. That is a wonderful problem. What's wrong with you?

The issue is that the PVA will partially melt and act like a glue again.

thor52112 Jun 2019 5:17 a.m. PST

Had the same issue with midge lodge for 20 ADLG terrain boards. I use 55 gallon trash can plastic bags to protect mine from sticking. My boards are 48x32 and fit inside. If yours are 4x6 then just use two of them and slit down one side. I store mine vertically

Personal logo etotheipi Sponsoring Member of TMP12 Jun 2019 6:11 a.m. PST

Parchment paper, or any glossy paper will work. If you want to keep your parchment paper for cooking, most thick glossy ads you get as junk mail work the same.

It also helps if you move a lot of air over PVA used as a sealant as it dries. Basically, if you rapidly desiccate the top layer, moisture from deeper in will be "pulled" to the surface and you get a harder, "dryer" seal that doesn't re-emulsify in heat as easily. (The sealant would flake easier, but that's not usually a problem with minis and terrain, depending on how you treat them.) Probably too late for this for that set.

vagamer63 Supporting Member of TMP12 Jun 2019 6:16 a.m. PST

It appears the Mod Podge did not thoroughly dry out, and the sealer you used has now locked in any remaining moisture and is reacting with it to cause the continued sticking. You might have been better off to use an ordinary Latex Primer to seal the foam instead.

Bowman12 Jun 2019 8:11 a.m. PST

It appears the Mod Podge did not thoroughly dry out,….

I appreciate the advice but I doubt that is what happened. I had to wait a week or so to put on the gravel roads. Then it was quite some time before I applied all the static grass. Only after that was dry, did I seal the build.

But I don't have these issues when I use a simple paint sealer. I think this is simply a problem with using a PVA containing sealer.

Also, my sealer isn't flaking or bubbling or blistering, so i guess that is good. In fact, everything looks great. The surfaces don't feel sticky at all either. Just prolonged contact causes the surfaces to adhere to each other.

BTCTerrainman Supporting Member of TMP12 Jun 2019 2:20 p.m. PST

I have some great success using some of these products (Elasta Shield specifically which I used to sell) to create several large projects/boards for customers. I painted on 2 coats on each exposed surface and let them dry in between. I then sprayed them with typical camouflage paints (like Rustoleum). The layer protects the foam, and the good spray paint both makes a better surface to flock (glue spreads better and more uniform then over acrylics), and the non finished surfaces are much better protected from damage and will not stick together. Obviously more time consuming and more costly, but you will get a very long life out of your work. link

Grumble8710612 Jun 2019 3:03 p.m. PST

A type of paper that avoids sticking and does not leave a residue is the paper sold in rolls for uses such as when one has to walk across a recently-varnished floor. I can't remember at the moment what it's called, but I have an emergency message in to my concuņo to ask him.

Grumble8710612 Jun 2019 3:18 p.m. PST

A type of paper that avoids sticking and does not leave a residue is the paper sold in rolls for uses such as when one has to walk across a recently-varnished floor. I can't remember at the moment what it's called, but I have an emergency message in to my concuņo to ask him.

My concuņo comes through!

It's called rosin paper. That should take care of any sticking. We even put it under heavy furniture for a few weeks on recently-varnished floors, to keep the feet from sticking. And we use it as shelf paper in the kitchen, too. Many uses. Probably the first time anyone would put it to the use you have in mind, though!

I'd be glad to give you as much as you need, but that would only solve your problem on the return home, not on the way to Historicon.

Bowman12 Jun 2019 5:43 p.m. PST

Thanks for that! We do have something called Red Rosin Paper rolls at the local hardware stores. It's even made of recycled materials. It comes in rolls of 167 feet (!) but seems to have lots of uses.

Grumble8710613 Jun 2019 2:45 p.m. PST

Thanks for that! We do have something called Red Rosin Paper rolls at the local hardware stores. It's even made of recycled materials. It comes in rolls of 167 feet (!) but seems to have lots of uses.

Yup, that's what I bought. We were redoing parts of our house before moving in. As you said, many uses. My spouse has even used it as gift-wrap in a pinch. laugh

Personal logo Doctor X Supporting Member of TMP14 Jun 2019 12:16 p.m. PST

Concuņo for the win

Personal logo Sgt Slag Supporting Member of TMP15 Jun 2019 3:04 p.m. PST

I used Mod Podge Furniture Sealant, on ceramic tiles, to make coasters… They dried for a couple of weeks (14+ days), but when I stacked them on top of each other, with craft foam on their bottoms, they stuck together! Unfortunately, they did not work out, as I was planning to make more, as a gift, for a friend.

My suggestion is to avoid any PVA-based adhesive. PVA will reactivate with moisture. The Mod Podge Furniture Sealant was particularly disappointing as it was allegedly for sealing furniture to sit upon! The fact that it did not fully cure/seal, after 14+ days, was incredibly annoying. If I try it again, I will bake them in the oven, at 175 F, for 30 minutes, to try and fully dry them out. If that fails, I will pitch the stuff in the trash…

Mod Podge products have their place, but I will always be wary of them never fully sealing/curing. Cheers!

Bowman16 Jun 2019 3:29 a.m. PST

PVA will reactivate with moisture.

I think this is the crux of the issue. The PVA does fully harden, but that can be reversed by the addition of moisture…….including the humidity of summer.

That's why I asked here as so many people champion it as a sealer. And that includes many YouTube terrain builders like Black Magic Craft.

https://youtu.be/bR-tgtcuRPg

Bowman16 Jun 2019 10:45 a.m. PST

Thanks to Cacique Caribe (late of TMP) for this link:

link

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