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"Any other 40mm collectors here and what else is out there?" Topic


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Action Log

08 Jun 2019 8:33 a.m. PST
by Editor in Chief Bill

  • Removed from 19th Century Product Reviews boardCrossposted to 19th Century Discussion boardCrossposted to Scale board

Areas of Interest

General
Napoleonic
19th Century

1,249 hits since 8 Jun 2019
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

grambo Supporting Member of TMP08 Jun 2019 7:55 a.m. PST

I started in 40mm scale about 15 months ago and have not looked back since. I began by purchasing the personal collection of Andy Copestake, proprietor of Old Glory Uk who are stockists of the sash & sabre range. Since then I have brought the total of painted figures up to around 440, they are I'd say 95% S&S with some additional Perry 40's to fill a few gaps such as British Light infantry. I really like the animation of the S&S castings and will keep on going with them, but I just wonder are there any other ranges out there that I don't know about? I have looked at 'First Legion' and they make some beautiful Dragoons, I don't know though how they scale up to S&S and Perry both of which are a reasonable match, Perry's slightly thinner and the horses slightly chunkier.

Price is a consideration, Perry's are £4.50 GBP per foot figure and £9.50 GBP per cavalry figures, S&S are I think around £2.25 GBP per foot and roughly £6.00 GBP per cavalry. I should say that if you buy 10 basic line infantry from Perry the price drops to £2.25 GBP. All in all I consider this fair pricing for the scale and detail you get.

Just wonder what you chaps think of this scale? My figures are in pretty conventional units, 24 figure infantry battalions and 8 figure cavalry units for the peninsular war and I only wish to play smallish games with maybe 12 units per side…. at least initially!

Cheers,
Lee.

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Skeets Supporting Member of TMP08 Jun 2019 8:04 a.m. PST

Beautiful figures! I am also currently doing S&S figures for the War of 1812.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian08 Jun 2019 8:35 a.m. PST

How is the painting compared to 28mm?

BrockLanders08 Jun 2019 9:07 a.m. PST

Beautiful figs and paint work, but I think they would be cost prohibitive for a lot of people. Visually stunning if you have the money and space though

huron72508 Jun 2019 9:55 a.m. PST

Fantastic painting! I am currently doing the FIW all Trident and AWI Perry and Trident. I tend to go toward skirmish level. I very much like the 40mm scale.

Pricey but I do have the resources now that kids on out and on their own. I will be expanding in the future as I get closer to retirement.
John

79thPA Supporting Member of TMP08 Jun 2019 12:00 p.m. PST

I don't have anything yet, but I am considering some skirmish forces for the Peninsula; S&S, with some Perry's thrown in. I am just afraid that my painting won't do the figures justice. Thumbs up on your painting and basing.

What rules are you using with those large bases?

4th Cuirassier08 Jun 2019 2:22 p.m. PST

Give it a few years and you'll be able to use 28mm figures alongside 40mm with no problem, as they will have grown to that size by then.

WarWizard08 Jun 2019 2:27 p.m. PST

In 40MM I have done ACW, AZW and Alamo. About 90% done on my Alamo right now. I have gotten some really good deals and sales, a lot of times 40mm is less than some pricey 28mm I have seen.
Your painted figures and basing are excellent – a 10+.
I think it would be nice if TMP had a 40MM Board.

grambo Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 12:42 a.m. PST

It's good to hear from other 40mm collectors and a couple of makers names mentioned that I don't recognise, I will check them out.

To address a few questions/points made above:

I find painting these large figures really enjoyable, and in some ways easier than the smaller scales because the detail is that much more visible. Having been painting figures for over 40 years now I have settled on 40mm.

Cost is a big factor, and I would not have been able to collect this scale a couple of years ago. When we sold up our house in England and moved to Spain at the beginning of 2018 I found myself with a healthy pension pot and that just happened to coincide with Andy Copestake putting his 40mm collection up for sale. Beautifully painted, they did not come cheap, but I decided to buy them and to this day I have still not told my wife how much I paid for them! Since then I have continued to add to them, painting myself. The light infantry, voltiguers and Highlanders plus command you see above were painted by myself, the column of French infantry by Andy, others were professionally painted for Andy such as the 2nd Hussars, the French artillery and the British 60th Rifles.Needless to say they are my pride and joy.

Rules/basing They are based for use with DBN, but using 3 x base sizes so standard 120mm frontages, 12 infantry, 6 or 7 skirmishers, 4 cavalry and a single artillery piece, the depths vary.

Thanks for the comments,

Lee

grambo Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 12:56 a.m. PST

A few more shots from the collection. First the Sash & sabre British flank company, I like the expressive faces.

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French line battalion, I think painted by Andy, this is before I rebased everything for DBN. Part of that decision was because the bigger bases makes these very heavy figures easier to handle safely.
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French artillery.These were pro painted for Andy.
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And a solitary Light Dragoon from Andy, they now number 16 figures strong.
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de Ligne Sponsoring Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 2:46 a.m. PST

I have a large 40mm SYW collection which I am always adding to.
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We are in SW France and also considering moving to Spain.

4th Cuirassier09 Jun 2019 3:26 a.m. PST

Wow, £10.00 GBP a cavalryman…but they do look lovely.

grambo Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 4:15 a.m. PST

de Ligne – that is a magnificent collection of 40mm figures, I have bookmarked your blog and will take time to read through your 40mm posts, thanks for the link. I am near Gandia, Costa Blanca, but we have been giving France some serious thought :)

4th Cuirassier: The Perry figures are £9.50 GBP for cavalry, the Sash & Sabre much cheaper at £6.00 GBP each. All of my mounted figures (58 painted so far) are S&S.

grambo Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 4:26 a.m. PST

Here are the 2nd Hussars on the day that I unpacked them after their long car journey to Spain just over a year ago. This was the first time I saw them 'in the flesh'. They were professionally painted in the UK and I just wish I knew who the artist was! Sash & sabre figures.

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Doug MSC Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 6:30 a.m. PST

All I have now are 40mm figures. I have 2,014 figures for the AWI so far, 894 figures for the FIW so far, 200 for the SYW so far and 569 figures for my medievals. All my figures are from Trident Designs so far but I am looking to expand my SYW collection with S&S figures. Trident is planning to do the Spanish in the AWI next, so I am anxious to expand into them also.

4th Cuirassier09 Jun 2019 7:45 a.m. PST

Stop this at once before I buy some

oldnorthstate09 Jun 2019 8:16 a.m. PST

Our group has a collection of AWI, Napoleonic and ACW 40mm figures, mostly Sash and Saber, with some Trident and a smattering of Front Rank. Picture below. We'll be doing 40mm AWI at Historicon in July.









de Ligne Sponsoring Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 8:46 a.m. PST

Funny that…………Gandia is where we are looking!!

Ed Mohrmann Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 9:03 a.m. PST

I've a few S&S 40's, for Plains Wars (US Cavalry and
opposition), one unit of French Hussars and one of
British Hussars (12 figures each, skirmish gaming);
2 or 3 dozen FIW French and Colonial figures, again
for skirmish gaming.

When Dave (oldnorthstate) and some of our other serious
40mm collectors do a game it is a beautiful sight to
see.

Doug MSC Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 4:55 p.m. PST

Painting 40mm is a joy. Over the years I have painted 15mm, 20mm, 25mm, 28mm, and 54mm. I love painting the 40's for the detail that easily stands out and the folds in the clothes takes dry brushing and washes so smoothly. The guns and horses are also so much easier to paint for the same reasons. Get a few and try them for yourself, but be careful, you may get hooked!

79thPA Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 5:33 p.m. PST

I was thinking about a DBN project in 25s; maybe I'll try 40's now!

Personal logo PaulCollins Supporting Member of TMP09 Jun 2019 9:29 p.m. PST

I am collecting Mexican American War in 40mm. Well, 42mm actually. Just finishing up some Mississippi Rifles. I m going to use some Gringos40 with these, but right now I have Shiney Toy Soldiers and Irregular Miniatures.

grambo Supporting Member of TMP10 Jun 2019 1:04 a.m. PST

Some amazing pictures there oldnorthstate, what a collection.Excellent terrain there too :)

Really pleased to read that there are many of us doing 40mm, I agree with the comments above re painting, particularly good for us over 60's!

deLigne: Gandia is a beautiful part of Spain just 1 hour from Valencia airport by car or train. It's a lively buzzing town with endless golden beaches just 10 minutes away and not overrun with expats, it remains traditionally Spanish (unlike Benidorm an hour down the coast!) if you prefer a quieter life you only have to come 10 minutes inland and you are in the middle of the orange groves.

de Ligne Sponsoring Member of TMP10 Jun 2019 2:16 a.m. PST

Grambo,
Can we continue this discussion by email. Mine is
nigbil (at) free.fr
Cheers
Nigel
PS That puts you in Ontinyent I think?

grambo Supporting Member of TMP10 Jun 2019 2:32 a.m. PST

Most certainly Nigel, I will email you later.I'm actually in Ador not far at all from Ontinyent :)
Lee. (lgramson@yahoo.com)

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MiniPigs17 Jun 2019 11:11 a.m. PST

I love 40mm but the scale has ground to a halt. It's a pity.

SashandSaber Sponsoring Member of TMP17 Jun 2019 4:35 p.m. PST

MiniPigs,

We continue to add to our existing 40mm ranges -- although I had to take a slight hiatus while working on our 28mm FIW Kickstarter. I should have some new 40mm codes at Historicon in July.

Chris

MiniPigs18 Jun 2019 8:49 p.m. PST

Hi Chris/Sashand Saber

Is this a top secret project? What are you coming out with?

I will take a stab at guessing but I want so many things it's liable to cause an explosion in here.


Napoleonic RHA? Or the Marine Rockets from 1812? Spanish napoleonic Dragoons? Any Spanish at all? Kneeling British Napoleonic flank companies? Portuguese, Young Guard, Carabiners command, French line lancers, Dismounted AWI Dragoons, Confederation of the Rhine units?

Oh god, Im out of breath…

Artillery for the FIW?

SashandSaber Sponsoring Member of TMP19 Jun 2019 6:31 a.m. PST

We'll have French Napoleonic dragoons -- center co. and command. I'll follow with dismounted dragoons (not foot dragoons, but dismounted "mounted" duty dragoons), basically for Peninsular skirmish.

MiniPigs19 Jun 2019 7:44 a.m. PST

I think that's wonderful. But is the future for 40mm going to just be here-a-pack, there-a-pack, everywhere a pack-pack?

What's the long term vision? Since it looks like you are basically its flame keeper and without having to be specific about a given figure type can you express your philosophy for 40mm?

SashandSaber Sponsoring Member of TMP19 Jun 2019 9:46 a.m. PST

I wish I could devote more time to Sash and Saber, but alas, it is only a part-time endeavor. With some exceptions within certain ranges, I'm the only sculptor so it is hard to release a lot quickly. Nevertheless, over the last 18 years we've managed to produce quite a collection of 40mm ranges in periods stretching from Ancients to the late 19th Century. I don't plan on starting any new ranges until the present ranges are filled out -- many are already fairly complete. My plan is to add about ten 40mm packs per year since I'm only able to gear my work schedule to the three HMGS conventions plus I am also continuing to add to our popular 28mm ACW range. 40mm Napoleonic Spanish and Portuguese are definitely in the future, and you will also see French line lancers, carabiner command, and FIW artillery.

Midwest07 Jul 2019 5:46 p.m. PST

Any chance you could make some limbers for your AWI range. I've got some cannons that need a ride.

SashandSaber Sponsoring Member of TMP09 Jul 2019 4:43 p.m. PST

We may add an AWI limber at some point. It's funny … years ago nobody, but nobody wanted limbers for their games ("they just take up valuable table space") -- now they are desired.

4th Cuirassier10 Jul 2019 3:02 a.m. PST

I've always wanted limbers. I like to see horse artillery move around, and the clutter created by limbers and stuff was a thing on battlefields and a genuine obstacle.

Personal logo deadhead Supporting Member of TMP10 Jul 2019 3:08 a.m. PST

Just imagine what was behind an HA gun line. Horses and horse-holders, limbers, ammo wagons, the to and fro of those carrying the ammunition. Photos from ACW certainly convey that

MiniPigs10 Jul 2019 6:08 p.m. PST

Oh I agree, you can never have enough limbers. Some people prefer their armies to be at least 40% limbers

In some Caribbean affairs, whole parties were composed of limbers:

YouTube link

MiniPigs29 Aug 2019 8:43 p.m. PST

@Grambo

What is the diameter of the large, round command stands you have? What sized table and number of units do you play?

grambo Supporting Member of TMP30 Aug 2019 6:08 a.m. PST

Minipigs,

I experimented with CD's as command bases but eventually replaced them with 2 figure 60mm square ones as the round base was far too big!

I don't propose to play huge games with these. Currently each army consists of the following:

7 x infantry units of 24 figures each.
2 x skirmish units at 12 or 14 figures each
4 x cavalry units at 8 figures each
2 guns and 10 crew
+ command bases.

I also have a small Spanish Guerrilla unit and captured gun with crew.

Table size – I'm pondering 6 x 6. My plan from the beginning was to play through all of the scenarios from Neil Thomas' wonderful book 'One Hour Wargames' which uses a small 3 x 3 board with 15mm or 20mm figures. obviously given a Spanish themed twist :)

I'm more painter and collector these days, but still want to push the figures around the table now and then.

Lee.

MiniPigs31 Aug 2019 8:20 p.m. PST

Well, if there was ever a miniatures period to overdo it, it'd be this one. I'll be happy when my collection takes form.

18th Century Guy Supporting Member of TMP08 Sep 2019 5:20 p.m. PST

Lovely figures, wish there were people in my area that wanted to game Napoleonics in 40mm (heck, just game it in any sized figure).

MiniPigs13 Sep 2019 6:17 a.m. PST

Although I have the 40mm bug, it is an exercise in frustration. If someone wants to do anything more than 40mm Napoleonic skirmish gaming, they will find there are huge gaps in the Sash and Saber ranges.

We are not talking about whole nations missing but rather annoying gaps such as no Legere for the French or no flank companies in firing line for the British and a general lack of personality figures which one would think are more necessary to create color in a larger scale.

And, further, the dedication to complete these 40mm ranges leaves me a bit skeptical when I see Old Glory pursuing a 100 pack 28mm French and Indian War range; a period they already have a range for and is saturated by other manufacturers.

Thus, 40mm is addicting but poorly supported. I mean, poor Grambo has to get British Horse artillery sculpted. How hard is it to whip up a set of RHA?

SashandSaber Sponsoring Member of TMP13 Sep 2019 9:44 a.m. PST

MiniPigs,

I understand your frustration but I'm the lone sculptor (with a few exceptions) with limited time. I wish I could comment and reply concerning future Sash and Saber releases, but alas with Bill's new policy I am not allowed to post anything regarding such things except on Hobby News (even though we are paying advertisers). Before Fall In in November I'll announce new 40mm releases on Hobby News (hopefully that bit of info hinting at specific period releases doesn't violate the new policy). Please look at the TMP Talk Forum for more information regarding the new policy.

Chris

MiniPigs13 Sep 2019 4:57 p.m. PST

@SashandSaber

Yeah, I see this new set of advertising rules. That's going to be a lot of work for the admins to police. In any case, that Hobby News needs to be re-tooled to allow back and forth between the merchant/designer and their adoring fans.

Without your making any announcements here, maybe we could use this list of Napoleonic top ten wants and needs. You can just say if any of them are "Hotter", then I can drop the others and narrow it from there. It'll be like a parlor game.

1. British Howitzer
2. Any Confederation of the Rhine units
3. French Legere
4. Vistula Legion infantry
5. French Horse Artillery
6. Spanish Infantry, Cavalry or Artillery
7. Portuguese infantry
8. Any of Joseph's Spanish Regiments, especially the Chevau Legere Lancers of the Guard
9. Neapolitans
10. Personalites; musicians, generals, mamelukes etc.

grambo Supporting Member of TMP14 Sep 2019 6:29 a.m. PST

That's a very good list there Minipigs and would make a big difference to us 40mm Napoleonic collectors for sure.

I'm currently painting a 24 figure battalion of Perry French as Italians but I find the Perry's so stiff and formal with no variation in poses and to be fair I only ordered them as a stopgap while waiting for my Sash & sabre order to arrive with Andy at Old Glory which is now with my daughter in the Uk waiting to be flown out to be Spain next visit!)

My partner in the 40mm 3D venture, Ian Smith and I are planning long term metals Portuguese firing line, cacadores and French higher command mounted figures but it would save us a bomb if Chris at S&S could give us some kind of rough timetable for producing the same? I prefer the traditional metal sculpts in the S&S style.Have you seen Ian's amazing collection? It's well worth a look at his award winning game based on an episode of Sharpe :)

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Meantime we go on, and Ian sent me these two latest images of the first two gunners, still work in progress but looking really good so far. Two more gunners to follow after these.

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And just a reminder of the officer figure 3D printed and painted:

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MiniPigs14 Sep 2019 7:13 a.m. PST

I left out French marines of the Guard!

But little things would enhance the range with minimal effort such as head sets. For instance, why do the campaign French not come with uncovered shakos?

What about generic sitting figures for chairs or horseback? They could be used to ride this or that or sit at a table for a command vignette. The problem with 40mm is that there isn't a plethora of figures to convert to other uses.

I think part of the problem with this hobby are the low track business decisions that move it. Someone sculpts a range and it doesn't move, so they abandon it. Then when you ask for a pack of personalities, the sculptor/owner will tell you that the range doesn't sell and thus why keep adding to it? However, the secret might lie with adding packs that themselves wont sell a lot but spark interest in other parts of the range.

One positive for S&S was their War of 1812 range which I have plundered repeatedly for Spanish Junta regiments. Even the Canadian Dragoons are earmarked for Spanish Dragoons.

It's true Perry figures lack variety in body movement. I have three battalions of French Infantry by them and they look a bit stiff. That said, they do have a lot of figures that are useful for other purposes, such as their dismounted French Hussar who can do duty as one of the First Legion 40mm Napoleon figure's Chasseur of the Guard.

It would help if Chris could give us a schedule of what's more likely than not to appear in the next two years to help 40mm enthusiasts do their own separate planning. After all, if you get Portuguese made up and then he comes out with them a week later…

I have seen Ian's collection, it's impressive. It looks like there is a lot of conversion work too. He must be dedicated.

However, with regards to actual S&S range planning, I remain a Doubting Thomas because of that 28mm FIW range. I dont really care what the rationale was for that venture but no one will convince me that there was a glaring demand or need for more 28mm FIW.

From a business standpoint, a company should stick with completing what they're famous for. If they dont want to (for whatever reason), that's fine too but let the rest of us know so we can get on with our miserable 40mm lives. :)

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