"What is your favorite ruleset for WAS/SYW in Europe?" Topic

Hello everyone,

What is your favorite rule for playing the WAS and the SYW in Europe?

Thank you

Haven't found one yet, been playing for 50+ years.

I guess I should mention my free set link

BTW, I highly recommend Herky's rules, I have a set and intend to play test them soon.

Herky, 1 question currently comes to mind, are battalion guns factored in to the fire rules or are they calculated separately?

And AOR ?

Greetings

I am still experimenting with rules.

I have used Black Powder (with the Last Argument of Kings supplement) which was OK but not really WAS/SYW specific.

Honours of War by Keith Flint (which is SYW specific) worked pretty well but I need to play it a few more times to look at some of the aspects that have come in for criticism e.g. power of artillery in larger numbers. The forum has a lot of unusual WAS scenarios that I will eventually try out.

My next tests will be with Field of Battle 2.

Just to give you an idea my forces are 10mm with battalions of 24 figures and cavalry units of 12 figures both 10cm frontage and the test games are ~7 battalions, 4 cavalry regiments and 2 model guns per side (French and Allied) on a 120 x 90 cm table (4' x 3').

Warfare in the Age of Reason feels quite clunky to read now – especially as I have miniatures which are not even close to being based for it – but I will retry this at some stage.

I used to like Koenig Krieg but this aims for smaller units (and larger armies) than I have at the moment.

King of the Battlefield by Ian Godwin (which may be difficult to find) seems very good for fast play club purposes but again postulates quite big forces.

For games where a player commands a brigade or so I have a sentimental attachment to Bataille de l'Ancien Regime. I keep looking at my part painted 18mm and considering 36-54 figure battalions for this!

Regards

Edward

Warfare in the Age of Reason feels quite clunky to read now ?

Wargaming, an Introduction by Neil Thomas.

Cartouche 2nd edition from Piquet Inc

Might and Reason, although we do make some modifications.

For the 7YW I use BP and also PW rulesets.

I don't play WAS.

King of the Battlefield by Ian Godwin.
I believe Dave Lanchester Books have new stock.

Heavily modified Rank & File.

And Warfare in the Age of Reason no longer practice it?

I use CHARGE! for my WAS armies and Maurice for my '45 armies.

Hands down, Maurice for us, although for SYW we do play the occasional Honours of War.

We've tried BP (with Argument of Kings), Age of Reason 1st edition, and Piquet, but those didn't "click". None of them appealed to our collective biases! Some of our more fossilized members still insist that the finest of all rules is still WRG's Horse and Musket, but quite obviously they have gone barking mad.

(I am of course kidding with the last comment. Quite honestly, since our club now has time constraints on our playing time, there is no way we can finish a decent sized WRG game in four hours, including set up and take down, and napping during the excruciatingly slow play).

(And once more I add – I am teasing some of my friends)!

Huge Volley & Bayonet fan…
I use them for AWI as well.

Joe Collins

Warfare in the Age of Reason feels quite clunky to read now ?

The author, Tod Kershner, writes:

Not quite sure what is meant by "clunky" but I have, over the decades, had people critique the text and also many people who have said that it is well written. To each his own.

To believe that Warfare in the Age of Reason never existed?

I use Might & Reason for my SYW gaming.

Herky, 1 question currently comes to mind, are battalion guns factored in to the fire rules or are they calculated separately?

Sorry for the tardy reply, I factor Battalion guns in infantry fire, except where they were stripped off battalions and brigaded together!

Thanks for the clarification Herky. Is that the common practice in these rules mentioned above? I've only used Koenig Krieg and the old, and regrettably, out-of-print Frederick the Great rules set. Neither set really specifed whether battalion guns are factored in to the infantry fire or are to be resolved separately, we usually did it separately. Therefore, I currently have a "pantsload" of battalion gun stands for my Austrian and Prussian armies.
If they are factored into infantry fire then shouldn't they also be factored "out" if they are brigaded together?

In Warfare in the Age of Reason the battalion guns are factored in the small Arms Modifiers of the infantry fire (+1 Battalion gun on point blank charge).

In Warfare in the Age of Reason the battalion guns are not physically represented on the table by a gun model.

In Warfare in the Age of Reason It is therefore better to know who had it, how much (even though the quantity does not change the factor of +1) and at what time …

I heard someone mentioning one of the rules that I have used, specifically Koenig Kreig or KK, in another post. They were purchasing the newest edition and battalion guns were mentioned in passing and it was indicated that they were factored in although there is no mention of that in either set of KK that I have, I have two separate editions. Does anyone have the newest edition of KK, and if so, does it address this concern?

Not me …

As much as I appreciate your input Paskal on the WAR rule set, you are only addressing one set of rules, I thank you. I was hoping that some of the others out there who have used other rule sets might have some additional input on other rulesets as well.

von Schwartz,I only talk about what I know, it's more cautious.

The only other thing I practice is 'The War Game Rules' of Charle S Grant where the battalion artillery is represented by a cannon model and its crews and fires with a system like that of the infantry (but apart) but with a longer range and different deductions.

Ahhh, now we're getting somewhere, I'm just trying to ascertain if I can keep all my bases of artillery (I currently have 1-4 gun base per regiment. One gun model and 2 figures) or if I need to have a yard sale.

You do not have to base the gun models …

I have used Black Powder (with the Last Argument of Kings supplement) and a modification of Wargaming, an Introduction by Neil Thomas.(on the Yahoo groups files)

This is a good rule of war game for playing the WAS and the SYW in Europe?

You can download my free Der Alte Fritz rules from the Fife and,Drum Miniatures web store

link

Ahhhh, ding ding ding!!!!!

You said the magic word, FREE!!!!, woo hoo!!!!

I am there!!!!

Ok thank you.

Greetings

The esteemed editor's post passing along Tod Kershner's comment was intriguing.

When I used the work ‘clunky' I was thinking of mechanisms but it is a while since I last read the (1st edition) rules so I may be doing the rules and author a disservice with the description.

With that in mind I'll give them a spin in my rules testing sooner rather then later and see how they fare. Obviously it will only be my opinion and my criteria won't be everyone's.

Regards

Edward

The three editions of Warfare in the Age of Reason and all their additives are excellent …

Maurice is still my favorite set of rules for playing WAS and SYW in Europe.

Finally found the answer to one of my original questions re: battalion guns and Koenig Krieg rules.

Koenig Kreig Ver. 2 top right page 5.
Artillery may be organized in two ways:(1)Units of one or two figures may be attached to infantry brigades, and maneuvered alongside the battalions. (2)Units of more than two figures, up to a maximum of six figures, must maneuver as separate, independent batteries.

WooHoo!! I don't need to have a clearance sale to get rid of all my 4 gun sections of artillery.

Must first be certain who had and who did not and when!

I tried Die Kriegskunst but nobody else wanted to play it. I think there's a 2nd edition in the works.
Minden Rose is good but interest waned.
Now, it's either Honours of War, or Der Alte Fritz SYW rules.

WRG, 1685-1845, 1979 ed. for all horse & musket wargaming.

Have tried a lot of rules for SYW but the ones I keep coming back to (ie actually playing with) are:-

Piquet Field Of Battle 2
Piquet Cartouche
Might & Reason
Minden Rose
Warfare in the Age of Reason
Black Powder (lots of modifications but works ok)
Maurice (but cant get it to work for historical scenarios)
Koenig Krieg (V3)

Depends on size/scale of game and time available which I pick

Must give Der Alte Fritz rules a go look decent if brief :-)

You can download my free Der Alte Fritz rules from the Fife and,Drum Miniatures web store

Wow! 1 1/4 pages, looks really interesting though. Maybe I'll print up a few copies double sided on card stock and give em a toss!!

I like what AICUSV said – been playing for 50 years and haven't found one. I totally agree with this, none of the ones on the market seem to do it for me but each to their own so those of you who are happy with your set then more power to you. One other thing I see is that many groups/clubs will have "house rules" also added to the market available rules.

Der Alte Fritz rules are what we used to refer to as beer and pretzel rules, no need for a bank of computers just quick and simple, LUV IT!!!
Base size doesn't matter, scale doesn't matter, as long as all players have the same.

I really like Honours of War rules set. Great mechanics, gives a good be and flow. Simple yet fun command system and can finish big battles in under 4 hours (post game clean up and kibitzing included).

Chris

@All

Thank you.

Final Argument of Kings by Dean West for the SYW … about as historical accurate as you can get… check out the Facebook site where the QRS are free under files.