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"Vehicle ID?" Topic


12 Posts

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Action Log

28 Feb 2019 12:49 p.m. PST
by Editor in Chief Bill

  • Removed from General Historical Discussion board
  • Changed starttime from
    28 Feb 2019 11:21 a.m. PST
    to
    28 Feb 2019 11:22 a.m. PST

Areas of Interest

World War Two on the Land

618 hits since 28 Feb 2019
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP28 Feb 2019 12:21 p.m. PST

Guys, I need a real rivet-counting treadhead. My microarmor flea market loot included two I just can't nail down. They look like a 38(t) chassis open top with the gun center and forward and the gun crew inside the hull. Armor all around the gun high in front and sloping downward until it's almost a token on the rear deck.

It was sold to me as DAK, but of course that may not be right. There's sort of a family resemblance to a Semovente 47, but as I said, gun centered and the armor "box" extends too far back. Does this suggest anything to anyone?

Thanks

28mm Fanatik28 Feb 2019 12:37 p.m. PST

1. Sounds like a Marder III SPG.

2. Agree that Mongols are the badassiest horse warriors hands down.

3. Isn't the Bug grand?

Wherethestreetshavnoname28 Feb 2019 1:25 p.m. PST

Certainly sounds like some sort of Marder. Marders were designated as tank destroyers rather than SPGs, and mounted a PaK40.
Marder I

picture

Marder II

picture

Marder III

picture

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP28 Feb 2019 2:00 p.m. PST

Yeah, I just about wore the electrons off pictures of Marder III's. And given the overall weirdness of German production, I won't swear it isn't some sort of Marder III. The barrels are much shorter--but microscale vehicles are a little prone to spontaneous barrel shortening. The gun is lower with crew inside the hull which lets out the 139, and it's much too far forward for an M. I won't swear it isn't an H, but if it is, the gun shield is not what I normally see. It doesn't have that tiny bit of overhead cover of an H, and it really is a complete ring, even though it's low over the engine.

Is this going to be ANOTHER of those Nazi projects where they made five of something and then changed the specs?

pzivh43 Supporting Member of TMP28 Feb 2019 2:23 p.m. PST

Could it be the early PzJgr 1?

Can't remember how to post images, so go here (from Tank Encyclopedia website:

https://preview.tinyurl.com/y5m5h2ug


Mike

Oppiedog28 Feb 2019 2:29 p.m. PST

For me, I always look at the track suspension system to try any figure out what vehicle they slapped the gun on and go from there.

Frederick Supporting Member of TMP28 Feb 2019 2:39 p.m. PST

How about the Sd.Kfz. 140/1 Aufklärungspanzer 38 mit 7.5 cm K 51 L/24? They built exactly 2 of them

khanscom28 Feb 2019 3:33 p.m. PST

Possibly an SdKfz 138/1 ausf.H Grille? 15cm infantry gun on a 38(t) chassis.

Garde de Paris28 Feb 2019 3:34 p.m. PST

As I am a 7YW and Napoleonic fan, might I hazard a guess that it is the 15-cm heavy infantry howitzer (sIG33) mounted in modified PzKw 2 hull? 1 extra road wheel. The crew was down in the hull, gun front, center.

It was low-slung and inconspicuous, crew of 5. Used in Africa and Russia.

GdeP

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP28 Feb 2019 3:47 p.m. PST

Grille H it is! (They are?) Thank you all very much. I knew I'd come to the right place.

And that puts them in their right place--late war European Germans. Good thing I gave up and built three WWII German armies in microscale. Everything fits somewhere, but much of it only fits one place.

Thanks again, everyone.

Legion 401 Mar 2019 8:42 a.m. PST
Gerard Leman11 Mar 2019 11:52 a.m. PST

Just to be clear – the Germans produced two different types of Marder II (on Pz. II chassis); one with a German 75, and one with a Soviet 76mm gun. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marder_II

They built 3 different types of Marder III (on 38t chassis). See: link

For Grills, see: link

The wheels are the dead-give away as to whether the vehicle is on a Czech or German chassis – the 38t had 4 larger road wheels; while the Pz II had 5 smaller ones.

Note that a number of those gun configurations were also made using captured French chassis. AFAIK, the vehicles on French chassis only served in the Normandy campaign and on the Eastern Front, not N. Africa. I know that Marder III H's were sent to Tunisia in Nov., 1942. I think the production run of Marder III M's began too late to see service in N. Africa.

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