"brexit - are you tired of it?" Topic

Hi
This i not a conversation of plus and minus of brexit, but i am living in DK and after brexit. If you take the hard version, you are in third counyty world as far as i am in DK.
That means that i often buys books in uk, 200 to 300 dkr, but after brexit i will have to pay 180dkr and 25 vat on my purcases in UK.
Thats about 100 % price increase.
That is the same price increase from my UK miniatures sellers.
I would strongly advise all miniatures sellers and book sellers to give a sales notification before Brexit because afterwards it is gonna hurt, and there is going to be a sales drougth.
This is not a discussion of pro et contra, but you should react. All your european customers is gonna stay aeay.

Peoples, the sky will not fall in either scenario … but there are gunna be down sides.

I don't think the OP was trolling (apart possibly from a phrase in his first sentence, and to a degree the title).

His main point is a very fair question that is of special interest to those of us who are overseas customers of British companies.

Whilst for Brits I imagine the Brexit debate is all-encompassing at the moment, for many of us overseas it is just a far-away argument on the periphery of our interest. But as the time grows near, suddenly it starts hitting home that whatever eventually happens, it will impact us outside the UK, even with our hobbies.

SO, ignoring the politics of pro- and con- Brexit completely, what are the likely impacts going to be on overseas customers over the next few months? This may affect our buying decisions from UK suppliers, which in turn may affect at least a percentage of their overseas sales.

I think the OP is merely querying what preparations are being made by our British wargaming suppliers (who are also our fellow hobbyists and friends after all) around overseas sales.

Let's discuss this without the overt politics, please.

I'll cut right to the chase. Brexit or not, I believe the Pound will fall on March 29th. How much and how long is still anybody's guess. I hope to take advantage of it.

It would be mighty selfish of me to make my little hobby an item of concern when it comes to Brexit.
I shake my head to see another country besides mine where the politicians cast aside the will of the people to put their own interests and desires first.

If things go bad for our British miniature dealers after Brexit and they loose customers from Europe (i.e. the continent), then I will try to do my part this summer and place a few large orders to offset their losses. Perhaps a few others on this side of the pond might consider doing the same.

The EU sounds like the Hotel California. You can check in any time you want, but you can never leave.

Well, I have to live in the middle of these "interesting times".

Whatever sort of Brexit happens, the pound is going to tank, by how much depends on the hardness of the exit arrangement. So overseas buyers will benefit from very beneficial exchange rates, but EU residents will face stiff import duties. Whether one will offset the other, who can say.

Perhaps you could send an enquiry to our illustrious trade secretary, the Right Honorable Liam Fox?

Don't worry though, a hard Brexit will knock 15% off our GDP so there won't be any figure manufacturers to buy from anyway.

a hard Brexit will knock 15% off our GDP so there won't be any figure manufacturers to buy from anyway.

That's a very sad possibility.

These discussions always bring out plenty of "expertise".

The problem is that nobody actually knows with any certainty what is going to happen because the nature of Brexit has yet to be defined. Everything that is being predicted is exactly that, a prediction … and any prediction is based upon the particular point of view of the person making it.

I suspect that in many ways Martin Rapier is correct and that some of the smaller figure manufacturers and suppliers will not survive the aftermath of Brexit and that wargame exports to EU countries may well have import duties placed on them. The same is true of anything from the EU coming into the UK, and Bexit may well have an impact on wargame figure manufacturers and suppliers in the EU.

Well, if there is a more economically friendly Brexit (like staying in some sort of customs union or Efta) then the impact on manufacturers GDP and exporters will be rather less.

But at the moment no one knows what is going to happen, which is half the problem.

Tbh, I think most people are heartily sick of the whole thing.

After the EU put customs surcharge and vat on my buying from USA and Australia, i only buy from within EU. Nearly 100% of my online purchases of books and miniatures come from UK, so after brexit i will have to go elsewhere. Thats irritating.
Even now i have to differentiate from Amazon Uk whether its from Amazon directly or an independent, because Amazon has o put 25 VAT on the sale as an independent do no not.
At the moment i am buying miniatures as a stock for the next couple of years.
So miniature producers lets have a pre brexit sale!

"The EU sounds like the Hotel California. You can check in any time you want, but you can never leave. grin"

It is more like being in NATO, you pay money in, you get benefits out, you adhere to some rules, to a greater or lesser extent Sure, you can leave, but why on earth would you? Especially when other people are clamouring to join.

Martin,

re:

you adhere to some rules

Should that read "you adhere to Germany's rules"…?

DB

"The EU sounds like the Hotel California. You can check in any time you want, but you can never leave. grin"

Hmm, I never had an issue with the original true "common market" concept. Absolutely common sense.

Never remember voting for a "United States of Europe" though, and yes Brexit has shown the Franco-German stamp of authority. It's sad it got to this stage but for many voters it was always about one particular issue…… – but hey this is a wargaming forum, let's not go there! :)

Most people here in Britain seem to be fed up with hearing about it. It doesn't matter if you are remain or leave, we just want it finished.

Part of the problem, I think, is that we have had two years of 'expert' predictions which are all wildly different to each other. Nobody knows what will happen.

The most damaging thing about the whole process is not hard or soft Brexit but the current uncertainty!

There was a recent interview with Mervyn King, the ex-governor of the Bank of England. He is now retired and didn't seem to have an axe to grind either way. He reckoned that, whatever happens, in the medium term it won't make much difference!

So maybe the best thing is just to get it over and done with….

Basics will be that anyone in the EU will end up paying VAT at their local rate rather than the UK rate. If the EU chose to impose import duties those will be added before VAT. Essentially it will be the same as buying from anywhere outside the EU at the moment. In the UK it will be the same as buying from the US or other non-EU country, so you will pay VAT at 25% plus Postman Pat's ransomed for handing over your parcel. No reason to suppose there will be additional import duties because goods come from the EU. That is based on 32 years working in VAT.

I'm tired of it because it leaves show organizers unable to make important decisions, it makes me fearful for people in the miniature business who have become friends over the years and might no longer make it to the continent or would even simply close shop if they lose EU sales.

If you are a European gamer and need stuff from a British manufacturer it might be wise to buy in as much of the stuff you need now rather than waiting. Whatever the outcome is there is likely to be disruption to trade come March 29th. Your stockpile can then last you until something concrete is settled.
There is a chance that Brexit could be postponed but the British government has to have a valid reason for doing it acceptable to the EU. Both sides are deadlocked and the default is leaving with no deal so that is the situation to prepare for.

I have no dog in this fight but am sure it wouldn't matter either way in any taxes, they all get more than their fair share.

The sun will still shine and then it'll get dark. Like everyone I know, I'm thoroughly bored of it all now.

I think some people are confusing wargame figures with commodity markets. The products here are unique and single-sourced. The sorts of rises and falls which have oil companies or food corporations switching from one country to another don't have much impact here. Would any of you building WWII German armies switch to building Japanese because they were 15% cheaper?

As a Yank, I've always been a foreigner to my British friends and suppliers--indeed, the worst sort of foreigner a far as shipping rates and taxes go. (Unless we could rig a North Atlantic Free Trade Association?)

But this is not going to make much difference. I'll buy 2mm figures from Irregular because he's the source. I'll go on buying from H&R, Adler and Baccus because there really isn't a US alternative, and every so often I'll dig deep into the wallet and buy some beautiful 28mm figures because no one else offers those particular figures. The pound isn't going to drop far enough to make a serious change in my spending, and certainly no one's discussing the sort of rise which would encourage US competition.

Brexit may be important for a lot of reasons not pertinent on this forum. In the wargame trade, it's going to be less memorable than pirates and zombies--and well behind Games Workshop.

Seems like the real problem is VAT.

I will be buying figures/books from UK companies, but from an EU distributer.

I will be buying figures/books from UK companies, but from an EU distributer

That'll make next to no difference because the distributor will simply pass on import costs in their final prices to customers.

As for trying to bulk buy now before 29 March, don't expect UK wargames businesses to be able to cope with a surge in demand and get it out the door before customs rules change (that's if they do), especially with extra demand already happening in the run-up to Salute.

Thankfully I have a huge lead-pile so maybe this is an excuse to paint that rather than order more!

The EU sounds like the Hotel California. You can check in any time you want, but you can never leave. grin

12 Apr 1861 – 9 Apr 1865

Ring any bells ?

While most of us are still seething over 22 August 1642 – 3 September 1651, Jacob Rees-Mogg is still bitter about 431 – 404BC.

Basically I don't care either way but it's good to see the English people vote for their independence from the United States of Europe. And it's bad to see politicians and corporate bosses trying to overturn the people's vote.

Basically I don't care either way but it's good to see the English people vote for their independence from the United States of Europe. And it's bad to see politicians and corporate bosses trying to overturn the people's vote.

Aleternatively, it's terrible watching the British people continue an awful public voting history that has chosen countless Eurovision Song Contest losers and BBC reality TV contest nobodies. And great that some politicians and business leaders are none the less trying to save the British public from themselves. Two sides and an edge to every coin…

Basically I don't care either way but it's good to see the English people vote for their independence from the United States of Europe. And it's bad to see politicians and corporate bosses trying to overturn the people's vote.

You do seem to care a little bit, and in one particular way….

I am not British, so it is not any of my business.

If you are a European gamer and need stuff from a British manufacturer it might be wise to buy in as much of the stuff you need now rather than waiting. Whatever the outcome is there is likely to be disruption to trade come March 29th.

This is what I am already doing, with at least five different purchases planned for the beginning of this year. First order arrived already, the rest I will try to send to the manufacturers/retailers in the next couple of weeks.

Seems like the real problem is VAT.

Not really, we already pay VAT when making purchases from the UK – it is just that it is usually already included in the price shown by the manufacturer or retailer.

For me the worry of UK leaving the customs union is that there will be import duties piled on top, and all of the hassle of getting your stuff through customs and handling the paperwork to demonstrate the value of the items.

Makes purchasing from companies within the custom union is very convenient. Maybe I will need to start paying more attention to manufacturers in the continent in future – for example Mirliton in Italy seems to have some interesting material.

As for trying to bulk buy now before 29 March, don't expect UK wargames businesses to be able to cope with a surge in demand and get it out the door before customs rules change

This would be rather unfortunate situation, since I presume that the customers might want to cancel any orders that have not been delivered in time.

Non Brits and non Europeans who have been saying that they have no interest in Brexit should reconsider. No matter what happens, or even the uncertainty of what may happen, will be a disruption in what has been a wide spread trading network including social and cultural issues as well as financial.

Amy potential or actual disruption will have ripple effects far outside the EU. Investors may be cautious in what they choose to do, postponing or even cancelling plans until a known reality is established. Suppliers and customers alike will be faced with the uncertainty of obtaining goods and such basic items as shipping. This will also include transactions with non EU and British entities, as the uncertainty of both payment and the ability to sell something may again postpone or even cancel orders.

Non EU and non British businesses and nations will benefit from the confusion as they will present themselves as alternative, safe sources, to buyers outside the EU and to British and EU buyers who may be hesitant to buy from each others. Markets that go may never come back.

Personally by this time of year I have usually figured out my British and /or European vacation plans and have started booking . Due to the uncertainty , which my be simply hype, I am waiting to see what happen,s first in March and then later on, before committing.

If we can learn anything from this mess it should be the realization that politicians should not offer referendums unless they are willing to accept and implement both a yes and a no response

As an American, I still have no input and will proceed with or without the program in place. It was a case of voting for or against it. No vote so no impact by me.

As a business, I go to various states which have different sales tax laws. I did not vote for or against those taxes. I am a guest and have to pay what I am told. The same goes for the UK.

As a wargames manufacturer I don't have a clue how exit will effect me and don't expect to until its all over with becouse no one seems to know. As a British voter, I have lost all faith in this parliament and in politicians as a whole, not worth the money WE pay them. The country voted to leave and they should be getting on with it.

Sounds a bit political to me Tim.

Gwydion, your right. I don't usually discuss or comment on politics or religion, both areas are a minefield. However I broke my rule this time because Britexit has actually got me considering never voting again ever.

Apparently the load that the British manufacturers are currently seems to vary a bit. During the January and February I have made orders from not fewer than 7 different manufacturers and the processing times for the orders have varied from a day to a couple of weeks. TAG actually announced on their website that this January had been their record month…

However, the delivery times from UK to here seem to be a bit longer than what I am used to (around 1 week), though whether this is due to load on Royal Mail or at this end of the postal chain I do not know.

That said, whether hard Brexit takes place on 29th of March (and at the moment situation still seems unclear), I should have enough figures to last for a while… though I should certainly refrain from any further purchases for the rest of the year.

If a vote today 55% would remain according to various data/polls .
The no vote was built around , the old , less educated compared to the remain vote and a passive form of light racism.
Generalisations but there is some truth in it.